[Katie Pollard]

I'll go ahead and re-post my thoughts:

I'm all for voice acting, as long as there's variety and it doesn't limit conversations like it did in Oblivion. It would be awesome to have Morrowind's amount of dialogue voice acted, with each race having, say, two voices per gender. Unfortunately I don't see this happening.

Until that is achieved, I prefer Morrowind's way of handling it, but if it did have Oblivion's way, I would be upset, but I wouldn't freak. Besides, I'm sure a Lore_Dialogue300 equivalent for TES V will come out eventually. :shrug:

this.

My personal conclusion: if I can get unique living NPCs with full voice acting I would totally love it, but realistically speaking it really isn’t possible. For me it isn't the speaking that makes a character alive but how he/she is presented; a voice just ads to it but isn’t essential.

and this.

I would love for Bethesda to just go back and look at Morrowind and write the dialogs and content to the standard of depth which morrowind achieved. Maybe even a little bit better. Think nothing of whether it can be implemented with voice acting or not, just do the best job possible. Then evaluate how much content is there and decide if it will be possible to do voice acting with it, and not just do voice acting, do it RIGHT. Have a variety of actors (at least a unique voice for each race/gender as in the limited VA of Morrowind). If it's possible to do voice acting with the breadth and depth of dialog which has been written, then great, go for it. I'd love to have it if it's done right. But if it's not feasible, just don't do it.

It's about quality and substance. If it were about the decoration I would just eat frosting, but I want my cake, damnit!

[Wayne W]

Oblivion had 0,7GB of voices.(no expansion)

You're off by a factor of over two.

Data\Oblivion - Voices 1.bsa: 787 373 673 bytes
Data\Oblivion - Voices 2.bsa: 1 005 007 382 bytes

Total: 1 792 381 055 bytes (1.66 GB)

Since they are all 64kbps CBR MP3 files, that's a bit over 60 hours ((1 792 381 055 bytes - overhead) x compression ratio x 8 bits per byte / 65535 bits per second, with the compression ratio for MP3 files generally being very close to 1 and the overhead being below 100 bytes per file) of spoken lines in total.

EDIT: For the record, Bethesda wasted a lot of space there going with a bad compression algorithm for voice as well as a totally overblown quality not really needed for 99% of voice files. For most of them, a Speex file at 8 kbps or at most 16 kbps would be sufficient ...

[Holli Dillon]

While we're on the topic of space, how many PCs have Blu-ray players? Is it just Xboxs who haven't caught on to that technology yet? Why, then, do PS3s(4 year old consoles) run Blu-ray discs, and only PS3s? Space isn't a problem with Blu-ray, is it?

[stephanie eastwood]

While we're on the topic of space, how many PCs have Blu-ray players? Is it just Xboxs who haven't caught on to that technology yet? Why, then, do PS3s(4 year old consoles) run Blu-ray discs, and only PS3s? Space isn't a problem with Blu-ray, is it?

My comp don't have one namely as there isn't a PC Game that requires one or the need for me to get Bluray movies. The Drive that run Bluray pop up around a good $200 on average. It would also rise up the price of game if every they were put on a Bluray disc (they aren't that cheap to make). It isn't cost efficient.

Right now, there isn't a game that required a crap load of space on DVD9 (can hold up to 8 GB) other than it act as an installer. Hell, we still got stuff releasing in CD format.

As for space, a single layered bluray disc has 25 GB. Dual-layered bluray disc goes around 50 GB a disc.

As for the Xbox not using the Bluray, its more that Microsoft does not want to cave in using Sony's Bluray.

[A Boy called Marilyn]

While we're on the topic of space, how many PCs have Blu-ray players? Is it just Xboxs who haven't caught on to that technology yet? Why, then, do PS3s(4 year old consoles) run Blu-ray discs, and only PS3s? Space isn't a problem with Blu-ray, is it?

Who cares? I didn't buy a physical copy of a game since years, and this includes Bethesda's games (namely Fallout 3). I just head over to Gamersgate and get my games there. They can include 130 GB of voice (ideally, as an optional pack) for all I care.

[Julia Schwalbe]

I think the game should just be all voice-acting, and instead of playing it, you listen to Morgan Freeman describe your actions.

[Latino HeaT]

Same quality, and 2GB, they could recite the Greek epics and still have enough space left for an average action game.

Did you not read my post? 20 hours of recording is abyssmal. What would Morrowind/Daggerfall's have? 100-200 hours? More in depth characters is a must. I want to spend half an hour talking to a characters, like I did with Vivec.

And for all you out there hoping that bethisoft will risk it with TESV. No they will not. They will not do a game that does not promise profits. And they don't want to just make even. They want big profits for there hard work. And also the menagment that is giving the DEV team their budget, are a bunch of money grabing pricks, just like Nintendo is [censored] their franchises for $ so will bethsida. They will make casual games, riding on old glory. So instead of asking for the imposible( a game that is a true and good sequel to The Elder Scrolls, ask for things that would make a game with the prime audience, the casual gamers, better to play for the rest of us. It will be HD, it will have full voice-over, it will probably even have a action elements, it will have the pointer and fast travel. Help them make the game good even with all that cr*p.

Have you not heard? Many of Bethesda's fanbase won't continue with the series if TESV is a failure. We have high expectations of Bethesda, and don't want to be disappionted again.

Most of Bethesda's audience is likely the fanbase. Not many mainstream gamers actually enjoy Oblivion. It's a RPG. They don't like it. Sure, they did get a few, but compared to how many there are all together, they hardy got any. (sales don't count because it was well advertised, and a lot of people returned the game) I believe the actual long time fans make up the majority of thier market.

[natalie mccormick]

Most of the fanbase is playing on the PC, mods and stuff. They got a profit on X360 and PS3 versions as well. The fanbase of original elder scrolls( as sad as that may be) is probably less than 15% of the target audience.

And 6/10 people i know raplay morrowind today, skip most of the dialogues. And why are you stuck on 20h? it will probably have about 40h-50h dialogue, with all side quest and everything that you can do. oblivion was made so that you have 60h for MQ and some major SQ, and 100h for most of the SQ. why would they talk trough that all? Its not a movie. Its not a book. If you want to read a book, do like the rest of us do, and read a ******* book. There will even be tiny little books in game. Its going to be a game. Its going to have fights. Some of the voices will have battlecries. Half the time in game will be spent wandering the wild and killing stuff. Why would they waste time making things that 80% of the customers will never see? And voice over is not even the problem. It is harder to invent 100h worth of dialogue, than to record it and stuff it onto the disc. They could record 100h worth in 2-3 months (parallel recording). Instead they will make 40h of good dialogue, and go for quality, no quantity. And will make a game, and not a movie, or a book. They already gave a TES book. Its timne to make a game.

[Marine Arrègle]

(...) And why are you stuck on 20h? it will probably have about 40h-50h dialogue, with all side quest and everything that you can do.

Oblivion has 60 hours of recorded dialogue. Really.

For comparison: The Lord of the Rings audiobook has 55 hours. That's a single "main quest" without any branching, without any choices on where the fellowship might want to go, but on the other hand a good part of it are descriptions. In other words, 60 hours for a sandbox role-playin game, where you are supposed to actually be able to have meaningful choices and branching story lines depending on it might be barely enough for one major quest line. It certainly isn't enough for five of them, like Oblivion had. Oblivion would need about ten times as much dialogue it had (to account for choices, consequences, plot branches, general information gathering and lots of everyday lore-related stuff) for it to "work" in the context of a sandbox role-playing game.

[Stephanie I]

Voice acting breathes life into any game even when I got many mods for morrowind witch made the npcs more life like they were still more of a walking plank with a note on it than a person and voice acting in oblivion(and the improved ai)made the npcs so alive and stop complaining about the little amount of dialouge there are mods that do that ever heard of lore dialouge300?

[Steph]

W8. Did Oblivion have branching storylines? And also in the books all characters speak, and a lot of it is from the main character. And i really hope that the mass effect is the last rpg-ish game i play where i hear the main character. The only branching i saw in oblivion was Do you want to do that? No? Ok then nothing.

So if 60h=1,7BG than 3GB (same compression, but they could probably reduce quality for most of it) would give 105h. Lets say that 25h goes off to regular stuff: shops, people, beggars, that's still 80h of quest dialogue. And it will still probably be do or do not choice, not "do like this, or like that". And 80h of dialogue, that excludes the main character. Normal people probably wont get that much spoken directly at them during a month of normal social interactions.

[Amy Smith]

W8. Did Oblivion have branching storylines?

No, it didn't. It should have though.

[Marina Leigh]

Voice acting breathes life into any game even when I got many mods for morrowind witch made the npcs more life like they were still more of a walking plank with a note on it than a person and voice acting in oblivion(and the improved ai)made the npcs so alive and stop complaining about the little amount of dialouge there are mods that do that ever heard of lore dialouge300?

1. What are you talking about ai for? This is a thread about Voice acting...

2. If voice acting breathes more life into the game, surely, having a small amount of it defies the purpose. How often do you have a conversation with someone where they will only talk about 3 things, and will only give you one line responses? Also, mods shouldn't be neccessary for the game to be enjoyable. If I want there to be tons of topics, I should be able to simply play the main game. And, not everyone has a PC.


While I'm talking about mods. Mods are far easier to create when voice acting isn't involved. Think of all the many of potentially amazing mods that weren't created because the creator didn't want to bother with voice acting. If you record voices, it will rarely ever fit in with the rest of the game. If you don't have them say anything at all, it seems really fake and immersion breaking. Think about it.

[^_^]

Voice acting serves no purpose other than reducing depth and making the game easier for every twelve year old boy.

[Lory Da Costa]

In this day and age, surely you could get a handful of voice actors to voice their lines then 'manipulate' it with software to create thousands of different voices. Imagine doing this to Oblivion. Every single voice would be different, but still only voiced by 5 people!!

[Killah Bee]

Voice acting serves no purpose other than reducing depth and making the game easier for every twelve year old boy.

Sorry, but I completely disagree. I wouldn't have enjoyed Oblivion half as much if it had no voice acting. I especially like the female voices.
If they announced that TESV had no voice acting, only text, I would seriously think twice about buying it!!

[Lavender Brown]

In this day and age, surely you could get a handful of voice actors to voice their lines then 'manipulate' it with software to create thousands of different voices. Imagine doing this to Oblivion. Every single voice would be different, but still only voiced by 5 people!!

Short answer: No.

Long answer: You would notice it quickly. What matters most for us to think of two voices as belonging to different people isn't stuff like pitch and tempo, which you could easily manipulate with filters, but their choice of words, typical phrases, sentence structure, spelling imperfections, breath depth and length, pauses between words - both silent and, uh, less silent -, use of rhythm and stress and so on.

[Jay Baby]

2. If voice acting breathes more life into the game, surely, having a small amount of it defies the purpose. How often do you have a conversation with someone where they will only talk about 3 things, and will only give you one line responses? Also, mods shouldn't be neccessary for the game to be enjoyable. If I want there to be tons of topics, I should be able to simply play the main game. And, not everyone has a PC.

Very often actually. How much of a conversation do you have with your bank teller or you fast food server or the Utility lady when you pay your bills? Unless your really talkative, most of life revolves around 1 topic-1 sentence conversations. You only hold actual conversations with people you know, or people you want to be talking to because they have important information that pertains to you.

[Barbequtie]

I hope the voice acting will be better then on Oblivion. More unique voices. And i also hope that the dialogue between npcs will be longer instead of the short cheezy stuff in Oblivion

[Christina Trayler]

Although I'm sure it would never happen, but I would think that if Bethesda released 2 versions of the game, one with voice acting and the other with a larger world, most people would gravitate toward buying the one with more content, even though they wouldn't have bought it if it appeared that voice acting was completely disregarded. I think just realizing that they had to have a trade off when buying the game would make some people realize that voice acting isn't a big deal to them. I'm sure that from a business stand point it wouldn't be tried, and I could be very wrong about people pretending not to like shallow games.

[Chase McAbee]

I think the game should just be all voice-acting, and instead of playing it, you listen to Morgan Freeman describe your actions.

:thumbsup:
Problem solved. Everyone's happy. Thank you.

You know Bethesda can afford it now. With all the blood money they got from killing Morrowind.

[Sarah Edmunds]

Voice acting is a "tool", a means toward an end. In OB, that tool became more important than the end it supported, and we got well promoted and advertised "full voice acting" INSTEAD of dialog choices. That doesn't mean that it can't be done well, but that it wasn't in the last game.

It can definitely be done more efficiently. Bethesda recorded and added absolutely identical lines for each topic for each of the various race voices, whether they needed them or not. For example, the Altmer speak the rumor about "Trouble in the land of the Altmer" as if it's some third-party subject. There could have been a lot more minor variation even with the SAME amount of recorded voicing, just more carefully selected and/or written specifically for each race and/or gender. If the Bosmer had given you one "slant" on the subject, and the Orc delivered his or her views from a different perspective, it would have been far more interesting and immersive. As is was, they all said exactly the same thing in exactly the same words, and I found it annoying and blatantly "wrong" in too many cases, and far too repetitive to be realistic.

Then there were the beggars who used one voice for one line, and a different voice for the next. If you're doing a 'beggar voice", finish it, don't just do 25% of it and use something else to "fill in" the missing dialog.

Let us not forget the heavy armor dealer, Vornado: "Greetings, Dumbner. I'm Vernardo." (I've just been insulted by someone who doesn't know his own name) It's details like that which shatter immersion and stamp the pieces into the dust.

The problem is not so much that RPGs and full voice acting don't work together, because it's fine in several "linear" RPGs, but that the greater demands of voicing a "sandbox" RPG can quickly exceed the budget. Limited voicing (as was done in MW) is one answer I can deal with, reducing content (as was done in OB) is one that I can't. There may be other solutions, but if it's done at the expense of gameplay and depth, then I don't want it.

Done well, voice acting can add a lot to the game; done poorly, it is a lot of time, effort, expense, and disc space for little return.

[Vera Maslar]

Voice acting is a "tool", a means toward an end. In OB, that tool became more important than the end it supported, and we got well promoted and advertised "full voice acting" INSTEAD of dialog choices. That doesn't mean that it can't be done well, but that it wasn't in the last game.

It can definitely be done more efficiently. Bethesda recorded and added absolutely identical lines for each topic for each of the various race voices, whether they needed them or not. For example, the Altmer speak the rumor about "Trouble in the land of the Altmer" as if it's some third-party subject. There could have been a lot more minor variation even with the SAME amount of recorded voicing, just more carefully selected and/or written specifically for each race and/or gender. If the Bosmer had given you one "slant" on the subject, and the Orc delivered his or her views from a different perspective, it would have been far more interesting and immersive. As is was, they all said exactly the same thing in exactly the same words, and I found it annoying and blatantly "wrong" in too many cases, and far too repetitive to be realistic.

Then there were the beggars who used one voice for one line, and a different voice for the next. If you're doing a 'beggar voice", finish it, don't just do 25% of it and use something else to "fill in" the missing dialog.

The problem is not so much that RPGs and full voice acting don't work together, because it's fine in several "linear" RPGs, but that the greater demands of voicing a "sandbox" RPG can quickly exceed the budget. Limited voicing (as was done in MW) is one answer I can deal with, reducing content (as was done in OB) is one that I can't. There may be other solutions, but if it's done at the expense of gameplay and depth, then I don't want it.

Done well, voice acting can add a lot to the game; done poorly, it is a lot of time, effort, expense, and disc space for little return.

Absolutely 100% agreed. On every point. Couldn't have said it better myself. :nod:

[CSar L]

Voice acting is a "tool", a means toward an end. In OB, that tool became more important than the end it supported, and we got well promoted and advertised "full voice acting" INSTEAD of dialog choices. That doesn't mean that it can't be done well, but that it wasn't in the last game.

It can definitely be done more efficiently. Bethesda recorded and added absolutely identical lines for each topic for each of the various race voices, whether they needed them or not. For example, the Altmer speak the rumor about "Trouble in the land of the Altmer" as if it's some third-party subject. There could have been a lot more minor variation even with the SAME amount of recorded voicing, just more carefully selected and/or written specifically for each race and/or gender. If the Bosmer had given you one "slant" on the subject, and the Orc delivered his or her views from a different perspective, it would have been far more interesting and immersive. As is was, they all said exactly the same thing in exactly the same words, and I found it annoying and blatantly "wrong" in too many cases, and far too repetitive to be realistic.

Then there were the beggars who used one voice for one line, and a different voice for the next. If you're doing a 'beggar voice", finish it, don't just do 25% of it and use something else to "fill in" the missing dialog.

The problem is not so much that RPGs and full voice acting don't work together, because it's fine in several "linear" RPGs, but that the greater demands of voicing a "sandbox" RPG can quickly exceed the budget. Limited voicing (as was done in MW) is one answer I can deal with, reducing content (as was done in OB) is one that I can't. There may be other solutions, but if it's done at the expense of gameplay and depth, then I don't want it.

Done well, voice acting can add a lot to the game; done poorly, it is a lot of time, effort, expense, and disc space for little return.

About the beggar voice, I was under the impression that was intentional, as when they're begging for money, they put on that fake voice. Then the voice would change after you gave them money.

But great points!

[Ysabelle]

Very often actually. How much of a conversation do you have with your bank teller or you fast food server or the Utility lady when you pay your bills? Unless your really talkative, most of life revolves around 1 topic-1 sentence conversations. You only hold actual conversations with people you know, or people you want to be talking to because they have important information that pertains to you.

If you save someone's life in some kind of quest, the chances are, they're going to be pretty happy to see you, and will have something to say. Also, when technology is as under developed as in TES (going by us), people do in fact talk a lot more. Even look at the older generation. They talk more because they where encouraged to talk more. Imagine you have no TV, no computers, no phones, or anything at all. What do you do for fun? Talk!