I don't understand why people like this, who have such negative outlooks toward Skyrim, are even on this forum. To all of the people who think Skyrim is gonna svck, why are you wasting your time reading this? Go play some other game.

i completly agree

I've said it before and I say it again: Bethesda profits much more from critics putting them to the task than from a bunch of religious zealots they could sell a plot on the moon to....

So if you believe it's wasting anyone's time to voice criticism here, you're dead wrong. It's wasting time filling the forum servers with endless sermons as to how utterly perfect everything Bethesda publishes is - because the folks at Bethesda aren't that dumb to believe they could not possibly do anything wrong.

that's not what he said. what he said is basically the inverse of what you said.
It's wasting time to post sermons that compare Bethesda to the Apostles, true, but it's also wasting time to post sermons that declare Bethesda to be the right hand of the gaming world's version of Satan.
you're both criticizing extremes, just opposite ones

The point was that we have a rehash of Oblivion's environments in that the landscape is pretty normal and little that is truly fantastic about it. Now I personally think that some of the mountains are a wee bit too cragged, but that merely adds on top of the "visuals over substance" stack...



Which made sense given how long it takes to actually make a piece of armour. But Skyrim blows the "instant gratification" horn on more than just that opportunity...



If instant gratification and a limo to the dungeon (not to mention lots and lots of medals, pardon, perks) is what one is after, maybe. If what one is after is a fantastic yet believable world, I don't see that improved a bit...

No, he didn't. He criticised a post that said that it looks like Skyrim is a watered-down Oblivion. Even if one dislikes Oblivion, that's a far cry from considering someone the gaming world's version of Satan (That would be EA, anyway ) What that post merely did was stating that Skyrim was a continuation of the trend already established with Oblivion, a trend the poster obviously didn't like.

You CANNOT blend two spells together using the dual wielding mechanic. Thus the argument that this is the "new spellmaking" is moot.

Double casting has two separate projectiles and the spell effects do not blend like they would in spellmaking.

Now im not a fan of the old spellmaking, but please don't be so daft as to compare the dual wielding mechanic to spellmaking... it's so far removed.

To me Skyrim looks like it will have most of what I liked about both games. I've always said that Morrowind gave us a great place to explore but that Oblivion gave us a great place to adventure. Skyrim, it looks like, will give us both.

But it isn't a rehash. They have far more variation to the types of environments. I'd prefer closer to Morrowind environment but this is better than Oblivion




Oh wow, you don't have to sit in the same place and sleep for 3 days anymore. Might be a TINY hit to immersion with a HUGE boost in customization and crafting depth




The world is supposed to have more dungeons, more diverse environments, more culturally significant architecture/politics/items, more culturally localized factions, better graphics/animations for the world, cities/towns with visible economics, better weather, etc etc. All of these things should create a more fantastic yet believable world

Yeah, I'm pretty sure most people didn't just hit "T" and put the slider all the way up to 24 hours until the armor was done. :rolleyes: Shame on Skyrim for giving us the ability to not only create or own armor, but modify it too.


You have played enough of the game to see if the world is fantastic and believable? With NPCs actually doing jobs now, and not just standing or walking around, and dungeons that have a history to them that you can discover as you go into them, I believe it will be much more believable. And you do have to discover a location before taking your "limo" to it.

You do know there is many different regions in skyrim all with their unique look including a volcanic region? all we have seen is around riverwood and such

What, precisely, is fantastic about it? Heck, the use of mammoths itself is hugely cliché. They might have used woolly rhinos for a change, but even that was apparently too far out..




What precisely is "depth" about instant gratification?




You mean, aside from Norway, they also have a bit of Sweden, Denmark , Finland and Russia thrown in?

I don't think they meant that you could actually blend the spells but that you could simultaneously use to spells at once, Not spell making but you get the benefit of 2 spells at one time like you would if you made a paralyze/flame spell

I think someone needs a /violin :violin:

Well, if you did, shame on you. Care to tell me how your refusal to actually roleplay tells us something about the game?



That wasn't any different in Oblivion. So what? You take the limo to the next closest location you have already discovered....




Thanks for reminding me I forgot Iceland on my list....

I would challenge you to give an example of a "better job" that would address all of your complaints yet still keep in mind development costs and time.

Oh yes, and still be something that could be remotely considered a "TES" game.


EDIT: The reason I am asking this is because after reading your posts, I believe you to be more of a bigot and negative-o-tron spinning arguments just for argument's sake. Basically, I think you are feigning your conviction about 'pure roleplaying' and 'not blowing the instant gratification' horn in order to just argue.

In terms of the fantastic elements? Well, I'd offer something that could be remotely considered a "TES" game. Name starts with M... no wolf hounds but nix hounds. No mammoths but Silt Striders and Netch, Kwama and Guar... The main critter you knew from Earth was rats, and it isn't too incredible that those pests exist anywhere

Shame on me? It would take hours of looking at a computer monitor to realistically wait on that. No thanks, I play games for fun. I do believe that's what's they're made for.


And in both Arena and Daggerfall you can travel instantly to anything on the map. Fast travel is in TES's blood. Morrowind is not the definition of everything TES.

Pointing to something that has already been done and calling that "fantastic" is oxymoronic as its anything but "fantastic" and more like "been done" and "tired".

Morrowind was a great game, but trying to draw weak lines of comparison between that game and elements in a new game that you've yet to even experience? Smells like arrogance and spite to me.

I don't think you know what cliche means. Mammoths aren't cliche. I can't think of a single RPG off the top of my head with mammoths. Sure they're REAL and fairly well known but that doesn't make them cliche. Regardless, your response doesn't make sense. I didn't use the word 'fantastic' in the line you quoted nor did I talk about animals



Again, you don't seem to get what I'm saying. I didn't say there was "depth" to the instant gratification part of it. I'm saying there is depth to the system itself. There are FAR FAR FAR more options in Skyrim's smithing as opposed to Morrowind's. More options=depth





Huh? You make no sense. Skyrim has about 5+ different ecosystems while Oblivion essentially had 2 with 1-2 variations of one of them

ROTFLBTC. And mammoths have never been done... Did I say I wanted precisely the same things? No, I didn't. You wanted an example, it is the very notion of an example that it has been done somewhere already




You wanted an example, you got one. You wanted one that had a TES connection, you got one. Didn't like the fact that you got one, so you insult me. Smells like arrogance and spite to me.
It looks to me that you are the one who isn't the least interested in a discussion because you can't even suffer if your demands are met.

I insult your answer because ITS NOT AN EXAMPLE.... unless we are counting plagiarism of someone else's ideas. Did I ask for rehashed ideas about a game most people here have played and are familiar with? No.

I asked for a creative example from you. I asked for a gem, a sliver of light in the darkness of your pedantic argument, and what you gave me was coal... something used up already.

Maybe once you actually MEET my demands we can have a discussion. If you ask me to make up an example of a way I could do something better, and instead I point you to someone else's work... well that's hardly an answer at all is it?

EDIT: You know what Bud? I apologize for my aggressive tone. It frustrates me to see someone blindly criticize something they haven't yet experienced... and do it so badly. On top of that you seem to offer no recourse to your arguments at all, making them seem spiteful and immature.
I do hope you enjoy Skyrim, if you so choose to play.

i think skyrim will be more like oblivion morrowind and fallout 3 so it will be good my favourite games of all

@Tyel

While I'm not the biggest fan of how Skyrim is turning out, if you want to avoid being instantly gratified, it's often easy to find a solution.

If you think that your smithing should take a long time, make the item, then leave it there, and walk around town and RP until you think your armor should have been done.

You can avoid fast traveling if you want, or simulate paying for transport by only fast traveling city to city, and buying then dropping junk to represent the fee. I wish that the NPC's would still give travel instructions for quests, for those who wish to ignore the compass. At the same time, it does make sense that, if your character has a map, people would mark locations on it and your character would be able to use a map and compass, at least for locations. People and items, not so much...

Morrowind's environs were amazing, but most were indigenous to Vvardenfell, and live nowhere else on Tamriel. I do wish that they'd go to a more unusual region (Black Marsh, Valenwood, Elsweyr), but the human lands don't have to look like something far removed from Earth. After all, they supported a life form that's essentially us.

Spell-crafting being gone does svck, period.

Um... I'll take an "instant gratification" Smithing system that offers a bunch of choice and customization (thus depth) over "bring me 10 pieces of ebony and come back in 3 days".

As far as world environments go, Mammoths seem pretty in line with the Skyrim environment to me...

And while all we've really seen in demos is Riverdale and it's surrounding areas, I've seen plenty of shots in magazines and such that have a bit more diverse landscapes. Perhaps not quite Morrowind status, but MUCH more lively than Oblivion.