Wow. Can't wait till my mage gets to that high of a level so i can deal out some serious damage!! level 79 is SuperMage!!

So I'm not sure I'm qualified to reply yet, since I have not played a mage character yet. That will be next after my warrior Nord.

But I've seen many of these threads complaining about destruction spells scaling - ie not getting more powerful as you get more skilled. But what is confusing me is that is the same way it worked in Oblivion, and I never seen any complaints on that in the Oblivion forums. So I don't see why it should be so much of a problem in Skyrim.

Thank you DieBySword. I'm tired of seeing blind whining about the Destruction damage output.

- Potion (Deadly Aversion to Shock) layed on an arrow to increase Shock Weakness 100%.
- Apply Fortify Destruction potion that makes spells 162% Stronger.
- Go Sith Lord on Dragon
- Profit!

Really, alchemy is the key here that allows magic to surpass a lot of melee damage. And magic
has the benefit of being ranged. This allows magic to be 100% more useful in situations were
melee is completely inefficient (flying dragons for example). I'm sure you can couple this with
some enchanted gear and just laugh your way through the game blowing up anything in your path.

Magic is about damage AND utility. While melee is really just about how hard you can hit something.
Even if you can somehow outdamage magic by use of melee, the fact that melee has very little utility
compared to a fully stocked mage acts as a class balance. At least that's how I see it.

LOLz I could deal this dmg on low levels you just need to get your destro to 100 and perk the tree. Get some destro mana reduction robes and gear ( no need to enchant yourself just find some in the world ) and buy some destro pots and poison pots from your local vendor.

The only thing I dont is getting alchemy to 100 so I could make my own destro pots they are much better than standard pots. The weakness to magic pot is best bought from vendors cant seam to make a better poison than 65% weakness to mana but can make 97% weakness to fire/frost/shock.

Which you actually don't need to do for melee. I have a 41 warrior, bro.

The problem with destro is its extremely strict reliance on 3 other skills. Silly.



Really? having to use a bow and farm for pots on every battle? Thats how it was supposed to be?

Yeah you dont need too but you do it yourself and exploit auto-power attacking, else you would need to take nearly the same amount of time to kill an enemy as a destro mage.



Really its seams that your meele is the one reliaing on 3 other skills, I can do just fine with only my destro tree.
Still that dosnt mean I wont use a vendor pot from time to time to take less time killing large HP enemies.
And if I already got high level and have [censored]load of perks to burn why not use them in things I like like enchanting/alchemy/archery/picpocet/sneak.

...
So basicly, it alchemy abuse again.

...

Any skill + alchemy / enchantment / smithing ----> Broken skill damage output from any skill.

For relevant comparison, you'd be able to one-shot the same dragon with the arrow you used to apply weakness to shock if you had a powergaming-archer in his stead.

Hey, atleast that "exploit" doesn't require power leveling 2 other skills and using a freaking bow :rofl: :rofl:

Am I playing TES or doing a min/maxing character for a MMO Raid? So much preparing, farming, exploiting, planning, strict building to make one skill work. No other skill requires half this much (ab)use and lameness.




Alchemy AND Enchanting (ab)use to make destro good. Sounds....fun....lulz.

Dragons aren't hard anymore at high levels. For some reason they don't seem to scale as well as other mobs. Secondly, that means that destro requires having a constant supply of potions to be powerful for 30-60 seconds at a time while 1hand/2hand/archery get to be powerful all the time with enchants and/or smithed items, on top of using potions if they want.

Your just being ignorant.

Yeah you dont need power leveling for stamina exploit yet your using it just shows how BS your views about destro are.
And I dont need to abuse alchemy and enchanting I can make powerfull pots with only plain alchemy.
I dont even need alchemy because I can buy pots from vendors and I dont need enchaning becuase I can find loot with the enchants I need.

So what about you ?
You are required to use smithing or your weapons and armor svck.
You require enchanting to make your weapons hit more or they will svck.
You arent required but will do alchemy just for abusing smithing an enchanting.
You will abuse bugs like marksman potions and power attacking stamina exploits.

I pitty you :shakehead:



So after my demonstration of owning with destro the dragons got magicaly gimped ? So they dont have 3,4k HP anymore? Are they weaker than a chicken ?

Your meele wont be worth [censored] as long as the dragon flies but can be circumvented with shouts if you got it. Still your required to exploit the system for the dmg your dealing, exploit the system to be able to power attack contantly and use bugged pots to deal more dmg and fall back on your racial bonus if your an orc.

I can play my melee or bow character without exploiting enchanting and/or bs just fine on master. I just need one or the other. :celebration:

I can play my illusion, conjuration, sneak character without any required supplements on master. :foodndrink:

Destro requires exploiting enchanting/alchemy, farming potions for every battle, and using a freaking bow on master. :facepalm:





->I'm sorry but the difference are night and day. Its a joke for you to even compare them. Super strict builds and abusive gameplay requirements for Destro are one of a kind.

Op is right, you shouldn't rely on enchanting to be strong. So I guess I shouldn't need enchanting, smithing, and alchemy to reach 500-600 damage with my one handed weapons. Fix 1h bethesda! We are weaker than mages! /end sarcasm

You don't need that to do melee/bow/conjure/illusion/sneak on master.

You DO need that to do destro on master. Its a very strict requirement and craps over many builds.



This is where the problem arises.

Game was not balanced for Master. I repeat not balanced for Master. NOT FOR MASTER.

You mean destruction was not balanced for master. Most other offensive skills actually do fine without having to abuse multiple crafts

See DieBySword? He didn't even read your post. And if he did, hes deliberately selectively ignoring parts of it.

This is why I stopped arguing with him, I suggest you do the same. Hes a broken record.

Are you handicaped maybe ? I dont want to waste my time if you are

Your meele or archer that dosnt use enchanting smithing and alchemy and dosnt exploit stamina will have the same problems as a destro mage that dosnt use alchemy smithing and enchanting and dosnt exploit mana. All three clases will be able to finish the game and all three clases will take mayor time investment in killing anything. And even the meele will use bows when facing flying target or if he wants to dmg from afar. Do you think using the bow ONCE ( without perking it ) to poison an high level enemy makes me automaticly an ARCHER.

What about this you cant comprehend ?

Was not balanced for Master. You admitted it yourself. Your "Arguments" are null and void now. kthx

Nope. My level 51 Archer doesn't have enchanting, or smithing for that matter, and nearly one hits everything. My Mage thats the same level, who primarily uses destruction? Its a spam fast.

You stopped arguing because you have no debate. Destro without abusing 2 crafts and a bow is garbage.


Melee, bow, conjure, illusion do not require such a strict reliance on other skills to be workable.




And why exactly should Destro be the only offensive skill not balanced for master?

Just make more powerful spells oh wait...

When creation kit comes out it will be easy to make new spells. But if they become noticeably weaker as you lvl higher that NEEDS to be fixed as that is [censored]. lvl scaling run a [censored] (or muck)

Because nothing was balanced for Master. Deal with it.

Thats not true, and proves you don't have a high lever archer, melee character, conjurer, or illusionist. Destro is the only skill that requires all of that abuse, farming, and min/maxing.

No, but it considerably lowers your dps and makes for a hybrid play-style, not a destro mage. Lol relying on a bow as destro....thats just...Kinda helps prove our point.


Please stop telling us to abuse 2 crafts and use a bow (3skills) when the other offensive skill don't need to.

Enchanting doesn't make destruction strong. It makes it usable. Go dual cast incinerate or thunderbolt or ice spear or what have you and tell me how many casts you get off without the enchanting -% magicka enchants. I'd guess about 3 or 4. Not enough to take down anything more than the most basic mobs that are one-shottable by any ability. All of the melee skills and archery are usable without a single crafting skill, though they do less damage. This doesn't mean they aren't still strong. Just not completely OP.

Also, the 500 damage 1h IS with using all 3. I never said it wasn't. The point is, destruction can't use all 3 to increase damage. It uses one to increase damage, and 1 to make it actually usable at all (hint: that's enchanting). Melee and archery are able to use all 3 to get consistent, sustained, high damage at all times while destruction uses one to get damage that is on par for 30 seconds. Basically, destruction is worse 95% of the time, and equal the 5% of the time that you have a 30 second pot on you. That's balanced.

Why the heck is it there then? :confused:

Shouldn't they just make it so Master makes every enemy nigh invincible? :confused: