I think that is safe to say that the majority of people on this forum have played at least one elder scrolls game before, and as such don't quite see the point of the removal of classes. Well, I just found out why. I recently started playing Morrowind, and several hours after the start found out I was pretty unhappy with some of my choices for skills, after finding out about all the different guilds, houses and the general gameplay. Unfortunately, it is too late to change much. In Skyrim, however, this problem will be eliminated, since you never physically commit yourself. Sure, I could have done the research about the game beforehand, but that would have ruined the fun of exploring something new. I can now imagine how the VAST majority of players will feel if they are forced to make such a decision early on. I therefore thank Bethesda for this decision, and trust that any changes they make are not just 'dumbing down' the game.

Classes are restrictive. Simple. Glad they're gone. I won't miss them at all. Thank you Beth.

I've always thought it was quite a good idea. On the previous games, you chose a style of gameplay you wanted, like magic, stealth etc. and then you had to stick with that for the entire game. With Skyrim if you choose a style and decide to mix it up, it's easy.

Same here. I was playing "out of character" only a matter of hours after selecting my class. Now my "class" is merely a subjective idea of whatever it is I'm doing at the time.

It's a definite improvement. You get to discover what you want to do as a player, and the game creates a class based around that. When I say it creates a class, I mean there is a point where it starts restricting you - you earn more experience for leveling skills to ever higher levels - but there is no point where you can't suddenly pick up a new skill. It's just not recommended.

The only thing I liked about "Classes" was lost int he Morrowind -> Oblivion Transition. I just really liked being addressed in dialog as the Class.

From a mechanical point of view, they were just that though, arbitrary, and restrictive titles. That's not to say some restriction isn't actually a good thing, every game has some restrictions, even D&D. The problem is, (Particularly for first-time players) classes forced you into such a pivotal decision out the gate. In Skyrim's system, you still can Perk towards a "Class" in spirit, but at least you get your feet wet before committing.

Dang... I totally forgot about that.
If the same function existed in Oblivion I'd have named my class "Criminal Scum". Then even the voice actors would acknowledge me.

i never had a problem because i always picked custom class :biggrin:

Many Elder Scrolls vets treat the first character in a new game as a likely throwaway. Our goal isn't and never was to rush pell-mell through the entire game, right out of the gate, be done with it in 20 hours and go on to something else, but to experiment and think and try to figure out how the game works. Yes - some of us actually enjoy that.

I'm ambivalent about the removal of classes. Personally, I don't much care - the "classes" that I use in past games don't have much to do with the actual character and have more to do with working around the inevitable idiosyncrasies of the game. However, for just that reason, I'm a bit wary. In the past, I could compensate for the failures of the game by manipulating builds. Since I no longer will have that ability, and since the game is sure to have poor design decisions (If it doesn't, it'll be the first TES game in history not to, and I just don't count that as particularly likely), I'm concerned that I'm simply not going to have any way to get around the game's inevitable flaws.

That and I honestly appreciate any mechanic in the game that discourages those who desire instant gratification and guaranteed success. If such people get frustrated and give up on the game, then, sincerely - good riddance.

I am also in the crowd that says "good riddance", however, the title spelling of "resoning" made me think of this video

dot dot dot
http://youtu.be/4Z2Z23SAFVA

Once again I totally agree with gpstr.

That, and Ill miss being able to give myself a class with its own unique name as well.
I do hope theyll let us at least name our class, even if its cosmetic only.

There's nothing to name.

Well thats just awful.
So Im going to be the only classless in a world full of healers, merchants, knights etc.
How fun.

Besides, why not? How hard would it be to let people name themselves and give themselves a profession?
Boy, I wished I gamed on pc cause Id mod that in in two minutes after buying the game.

What does your reply contribute anyway?

I like the idea of feeling out your own "class" and utilizing the skills you chose to use. I also agree with gpstr, it was fun to basically get a feel for the game with your first toon and surely I don't seek out instant gratification. With OB though, I couldn't help but invest myself in every character and later on you wish "well I should have picked restoration rather than alteration" or something similar. I'd be very interested in seeing how intuitive this system is, it cant just be the case that you level off what you use regardless of any major/minor skills. The ones you use most should still level you (at least that is how I have it figured out).

Why I am glad with classes being changed is I hated not rolling an "assassin" simply because my idea of an assassin might have slightly different roles and the tediousness of comparing an Assassin build as laid out by Bethesda with my own was all futile if later on in the game I wished I had picked skill A rather than skill B for one of my majors.


I'm really excited to see how this new system works, the more customization you can throw on a toon the more time I'll invest in it.

Well, what you say you like... is something I found quite... hilarious. It was very "D&D"ish. And while some of them fitted the conversation (Warrior, Mage, because they are more general), others looked strange (Nightblade, for example). I don't kow... I found strange how NPCs told to you what classes they were: "I'm X, Barbarian"... can you imagine that, in real life, you meet someone and the first thing he tells you is "I'm Bob, Plumber". It made me laugh. :biggrin:

I've got no regrets about the removal of classes but i'm not convinced the new system will be particularly forgiving of changing the direction of your character midstream. After all, if you have invested in several perks for a skill you no longer wish to use, it's going to be annoying for the rest of the game and hard to escape the feeling that maybe you should have started again.

This. Ultimately there is no difference between the two systems. All they really did is remove the ability to name your class. Which is sad, from a RP perspective.

Even these days people define themselves by their job.
They call themselves Bob the doctor, not Bob the father/ husband or Bob who likes fishing as a hobby.
Used to be even more prevalent, look at all the surnames such as Thatcher or Smith or Cooper.
I always thought it made NPC's more fleshed out, more real.
They had a name, a home and a class, they werent just some background.

Kind of like attributes in Oblivion, I don't think classes added a whole lot of definition to your character. They were never referenced as part of the story and you didn't get any unique benefits from having a particular class. Really, what race you were had more of an impact on the game than what class you chose as your life's profession.

I say they don't really need to be there unless each class has something special to set itself apart from every other class and they are woven into how your role plays out through the game.

Not more than naming your classes really...

... I don't even remember them appearing in Morrowind anywhere...

They did, in dialogue often acknowledge your class.
Naming my class adds verisimilitude and depth, it enhances roleplaying and certainly has more use than a snide remark that doesnt really add anything.
I do not like the removal of things because 'they are superfluous', they never are.
And the more that gets removed, the more TES mutates from a massive open world RPG thats all about player choice to an action/ adventure Fable style.

I don't see what people hate about previous systems.

Was I the only one who didn't strive for +5 every time I slept? It seemed to me that I was overly powerful soon enough, anyway. :shrug:

I'm just hoping that this system isn't rewarding the "Jack of all trades" type. It should be hard to be one of these. I should have to train harder.


Anyhoo, I'm not too worried about the system change, as long as it works well. I'm kinda weary of new things, but aren't we all?

The thing is that you can have a profession (which was what a class was), but that doesn't define you. "Larry the Blacksmith" cab be completely different in a lot of aspect from "Barney the Blacksmith". It's what you do what defines you. Though you are righ that, long time ago, intreducing oneself telling the profession was more common... but some things as "Barbarian" doesn't belong, in my opinion. You say that you're a warrior, scout or whatever, but not a barbarian...

Oh no, choices with *gasp* consequences. I actually have to play a role and RP, thats no good :rolleyes: . Sounds like they just want to encourage JOATs.

Can't have a thread like this without a comment like this from xtc!