After the third era Greymarch the Champion of Cyrodiil is named the new Sheogorath. What do you think this means. Even Jyggalag had trouble with this saying "Mortal? King? God?" at his defeat. So what is the Champion of Cyrodiil? Will he live for ever? What will hapen to The Shivering Isles if and when his dies? Or is he just crazy and this is Sheogorath's blessing taking root?

I doubt anything is truely known, but I would assume that CoC won't live forever. If/when CoC dies a successor would most likely be named (by Haskill?). But to be honest I'm just throwing things out there. Your guess is as good as anyone elses.

My question is did we see the last of the actual Sheogorath/Jyggalag or will future references tell of a change with the Daedric Lord Sheogorath. Since you freed Jyggalag will he have a realm of Order for eternity, or is he in an eternal slumber type deal?

If the CoC defeated Sheoggorath in battle then that could be part of something that would change his nature - but Who declared the CoC to be the new Sheoggy? And why?

There is another Daedric Prince who was/is not Daedra already ... and in what way is the CoC insane? Or does the Nature of the Prince of the realm decide the Sphere of Influence of the Realm? Does becoming a Prince of Oblivion make one immortal?

The Old Sheoggorath cannot die ... so what becomes of him?

Loads more questions there ...

Sheogorath knew that the CoC would have to become the new Sheogorath in order to save the Shivering Isles. The CoC became the new Sheogorath when he/she dipped the Staff of Sheogorath into the fountain of madness. It is unknown how the CoC will progress as the new madgod.


For the moment, the CoC's only real ability of immortality is to cheat death while in the isles; apparently, at least for the time being, the majority of his/her powers are derived from the Isles themselves.


He has returned to his previous station as Jyggalag, Prince of Order.

to me im guess after CoC's passing and before he dies im guessing he'll name a new Sheogorath of the Shivering Isles

The hero was the incarnate of a god incarnate, so he was certainly a god to anyone looking to define him. Realy he's just as powerful as any Prince of Oblivion, so long as he still has his worshippers on Nirn. He won't be the hero anymore, but rather Sheogorath. After the door shuts, and the hero dosn't show, anyone on the outside would take that as a sign that he died valiently shutting the door.

The Shivering Isles are to the CoC what Akavir is to the Nerevarine.

Exit, stage left.

devs trump players ... modders trump devs

"I am Lord Sheogorath now! The Old Sheogorath become some fogey old guy who's all obsessed with crystals and stuff, but I smacked him down and took his throne to save the Realm of Madness from the dull Grey March of Order! So now everybody's still insane and happy and stuff! And look, I can prove it, let me summon my Chamberlain!"
*nothing happens*


The Champion sure knows how to lay a credible claim.

For me, I'd say Sheo made the CoC walk like him, till he became him. As you did tasks for him, you had to learn how to walk like him, for he knows he will be gone soon. Towards the end, you begin to walk without his guidance, thus you are now walking in his baby steps. But the CoC still has much more walking to do till the CoC becomes the complete Madgod. And hey, if a man(s) can become one of the nine, what's to say another could not be a daedra prince, or something like that?

That's true, the realm is the lord over the lord, right now. He's got to be one with the land, synthisize. Realy though he's Sheogorath for all its worth, he dosn't have to prove anything to anybody. Prow's got it dead on, it is an elaborate exit. It would be cool if the personality of this new Sheo is more Mad, more malevolent. Like Keyser Soze, shoot his children and wife, then wipe out every enemy Mad. Jyggalag needs to make himself known on Nirn, now that he's free again.

The underlying assumption of my post was that Sheogorath was still the same Sheogorath and that the Champion simply became stark raving mad, to the point of believing himself a Daedra Prince.

:lmao: I get it, that's awesome! The next Imperial Census should hint at that happening. Then we took note of a poor, naked soul Sheogorath, flashing his teeth in a lopsided grin, calls "his equal".

As far as I'm concerned, the events of the Shivering Isles are a figment of the CoC's imagination. And I base this simply on the fact that Sheogorath is just silly and I doubt he's Tripolar.

So now that we spend so much time on TIL bashing ESF, it sounds interesting enough to join? Shua is newly around here somewhere too.

Yea! Thats a great point (the one about Tiber Sepitim) I adhere to ethier that or that that CoC is just crazy

That has crossed my mind a lot too.

My bon vivant Dunmer spellsword lost himself entirely at the end. "Why, yes. I am Sheogorath." (I own a mansion and a yacht.) He never did the Main Quest, so he was never the CoC - just an adventurer from Vvardenfell who managed to get into the Mage's Guild, then was sent by his superiors to investigate the strange door in the lake.

Of all his assorted trophies, he finds the mannequin with his old set of (steel) armor vaguely disturbing, for reasons he cannot explain. If someone was to press him on it, he might murmur something like "that... belonged to someone else." Or poof them away to Execution Point. Or offer them cheese. Who can say?

I considered that a definite possibility when completing the quest: that you went into the Shivering Isles, and nothing really happened, you're just now absolutely cuckoo.

Basically you do not have to be a Daedroth to become a Daedric Prince - so while it could all be a dream - maybe it really happened.

Also as mentioned earlier it might be that having been named Prince a land of Oblivion itself protects you from death. It would be interesting if it turned out that the reason daedra cannot die is because the land protects them and not because of their own innate natures.

The Greymarch was actually the Champion's grey matter marching away, I love it!

So now that th CoC is the new prince of madness, and sheogorath is now jiggalayg. Doesnt that make 17 daedric princess?

Meh, needed another place to post that was actually active.

And BTW, to contribute this post to the topic, Jygallag is not a deadric prince. He's an imaginary figure, like Bugs Bunny or Superman or Jesus. But thats going offtopic.

Yea. <_<

Though the ending of SI conflicts with previously established Lore and the Story of the Shivering Isles itself.

The story suggests that it is the unpredictability of the player that allowed him to defeat Jygallag, now by extension this applies to every mortal as Lorkhan envisioned Nirn as a place that would always be new. Combined with the knowledge that the Daedra were formed or changed into their current form at the creation of Mundus, it isn't much of a stretch to assume it was the unpredictability of Mundus that "cursed" Jygallag, not a group of Daedra.

What I would expect is that the Champion of the Isles, now Sheogorath will turn into Jyg at the next Grey March. Jyg being as much part of Sheogorath as everything else in the Isles.

Of course Jygs plot exposition at the end leaves no doubt that this was not on the mind of the dev involved but we can't really expect them to know these obscure parts of the lore and change them gracefully, they're http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/monomyth.shtml!

So seriously guys! Get out here and talk! Discuss! Get a regular account if you don't want to be recognized. The only way to learn the lore is to talk about it.



Being stark raving mad is a prerequisite for mantling the Prince of Madness.

I think by the very nature of the Isles we are not to know. Perhaps we sleep, and when we step from the door, we awaken again, thinking our madman's dream was real. Or maybe we are simply awake, but in the land of the mad. Or maybe we truly are the Prince of Madness, forever seperate at last from the opposite, Jyggalag.

Anyways, if someone were to say to a new player/NPC/someone who didn't see it happen in the next game:

So there was this guy who went into a shiny magic door and fought a daedra Prince that was another Daedra Prince and became one himself by dipping a stick with an eyeball in some magic water.

OR someone said that they heard that about someone and didn't believe it, think. If you hadn't been there, would you think anything but "He's absolutely NUTS!"