Yeah that's the only two things people that believe it's going to be an Akaviri Ka Po Tun invasion look at. 1) Tosh Raka is dragon and 2) He wanted to kill off the Tsaesci and then invade Tamriel.

Thing is the dragons were not killed off, they left Morrowind to go to Cyrodiil and they've worked with the Empire. They are said to be able to shapeshift and or hide out in the mountains. I don't think the Tamrielic dragons nor the red dragons from Akavir are gone.

And it just makes more sense to me that the dragons are these dragons not a Ka Po Tun invasion. After all. The only person to have transformed into a dragon is Tosh Raka.

Ikonoclast have you been touched by Sheogorath by any chance?

As to the other question, why should Alduin help the mortals once again. Well if you take the side that says he wants to go back to being a free spirit then there is no reason for him to want to, unless he is now so intertwined with creation that by destroying it he destroyes himself. But then why would he attack in the first time. If you take the other side that now within him/part of him is Martin Septim who died/ascended to save his people then maybe as the Dragonborn you awaken something within this god, i dunno. Speculations.

I hope you do realize the aedra ARE Nirn, and they are already essentially dead. You really need to read up on lore some more before you make silly proclamations.

and we will serve molag bal in his realm of oblivion forever!:obliviongate:

No. I can only think of one of the Lord's avatars I'd let touch me: Siula-tegr of one of those matriarchal nedic tribes. Wow, her knockers moved the mountains to wetness. They call this dew, now. She walks on wind and likes to lure the lustful off cliffs. Alas, she can't be captured by ordinary folk like myself. You actually need madness to have her, and since I've never been touched...

The remainder are men, and fugly. Take Uncle Swamp-Ass, of the Bjoulsae horseman, for instance. This avatar wears tweed trousers, too short to hide his scraggly legs (too thin to mask his swamp ass), and goes shirtless to let his belly spill out. A long nose and ginger beard stick out from beneath the brim of his triangular, reed hat. No one knows if he's got eyes. Or teeth, for that matter. I'm sure he's got some major whiteheads. He lives in a swamp. Maybe you've smelled him?

Indeed, just as i suspected.

you sir are a genius but I have a few question/comments
First off I did read your whole post and all of the first page but didn't read any comments after that so sorry if this has already been brought up
1) I just wanted to check that I interpreted this right, in your theory Akatosh essentially tricked man into making him extremely powerful right? I think thats really cool but Im not sure if I read it correctly just wanted to check
2) In between when I read this and posted this, I played a little bloodmoon, and this one story mentions that the Falmer are the servants of the Adversary. So could the Falmer possibly be a mythic dawn equivalent in your theory?
But anyway wow great theory I hope you're right it sounds awesome

Sorry if this has already been asked and/or answered, but why would Akatosh enter into the covenant with Alessia in the first place? I kept hearing 'to gain a place at the head of the pantheon' as the tradeoff, but really what use is that to him when he could be eradicating all men instead?

Why did Akatosh agree to be bound to the Empire? Did he actually agree to it? Thanks in advance.

Wow... this seems really, really viable. Bethesda writers must be really pissed of right now if this is right.

@greatcarbuncle I'm guessing he had it all planned out from the beginning or something, he needed to form the pact to get at the head of the pantheon so he could gain in power through worship.

Could this mean that Akatosh worked with Mehrunes Dagon secretely? Akatosh needed a way to get rid of the line of his blood but could not do it openly, so he worked with Mehrunes to use Dagon's followers (the Mythic Dawn) to assassinate the dragonblood line. Akatosh then betrayed him in the end as he considered him to be a threat or he just didn't need him anymore. Maybe he did the same with Mephala and the Morag Tong?

Thanks for Cipher for deciphering a lot of usefull information and posting it here. Your job is so much appreciated that I came back from read-only-mode after over 5 years. Regarding the lyrics in Skyrim theme, I suppose I have now a closest approximation available (after reading this forum and searching through various others and listening to the music - offcourse...

Dovahkiin
Dovahkiin
For the sake of Skyrim
For the land, for our home
For Hrothgar's blood
For the Nords and our wow
to Shor's single son
Dovahkiin, our king,
who'll dawn with fire!


I am not sure of the Nords-word as anything tends to sound like the writing if you have the words visible when listening to the music. Anyway at the end of Bethesdas pod-cast: http://bethblog.com/index.php/2010/12/16/the-bethesda-podcast-episode-6-enter-the-dragon/
you'll find the complete song without the narrators voice. Thanks also to Fiore as many in the web have suggested a verse:"...for sole single son" (which does not make sense) but as you suggested and Cipher explained, it must be Shor.

Please feel free to disagree as I cannot any more listen the song objectively without thinking I have it right.

Anyway, I hope (and suppose) we will see the lyrics in February's GI.

yes, i mean i like to read but i am not a fan of TES so called Lore for starters, so I care nothing at all if it is close or far from it.

The outer Church is come!

Thanks for keeping this thread alive guys, i took a break from the forums... no real news coming out anyways... can't wait til the first bit of info is released so I can just see if I was even close...

The symbol of the Empire turning into the ultimate threat to all of Nirn? Interesting. But if that were the case, who is this Dragonborn? Based on Kirkbride's post http://www.imperial-library.info/content/forum-archives-michael-kirkbride, it seems that Oblivion really was the ultimate setup for the Aedra to free themselves from the mortal plane; the only one with the power to stop it being a descendant of Tiber Septim. So for this theory to be true, the Dragonborn must be heir to the throne?

With the Heart free and Tamriel under cyclical (also known as the old smog himself) sequence, Convention is inevitable.

Re-Man is beget by SPACE GODS! And these came from Aka-you-know-the-place. Beyond Twil, which is another name for Aldmeris-Atmora. Or Sarthaal. We are not certain. But this is not your father's Shor.

So, yes, I do swallow the Akavir theory. And others, whole. Without bread. I'll talk about it in twelve hours. Maybe.

In the http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXD8IFoEiF4&feature=related. < It only works if you're a robot in mereth-trance.


To say nothing in saying so little is a mastery of the Fool.

Well this has given me a lot to think about. A great read.

Is that how Aedra worship works? I know that in the Discworld novels the more people who believe in a god the more powerful they become, but the Discworld novels are, well, the Discworld novels.

I'm sorry, I didn't read it, but I did open the spoilers.

And search for 'nerevar'.

I know everyone seems to want to brush off this as being OMG LAYM, BETHESDA WOULDN'T DO THIS TO US! - but the Nerevar went off to Akavir during the events of Oblivion.

And hasn't been heard of since.

Ever played Diablo 2?

Edit: and now I'm going to read the OP!

Very impressive research. I've never known much about the Elder Scrolls lore, but this does make a lot of sense.

All I care about is this little history bit:

The most potent symbol of the Empire and the Imperial crown, the dragon banner, is said to be based on an Akaviri design as well. Some sources claim that the Akaviri long ago rode red dragons as mounts in war.

Found it at the Imperial Library ( http://www.imperial-library.info/content/guide-akavir ) :celebration:

ALSO>

I think the coolest story that may relate to Skyrim and what this all means when its put together is this:

http://www.imperial-library.info/content/daggerfall-story-lysirius

I've read the whole post, it was very interesting. The only thing what comes to my mind right now is this question:

Why did the eight 'divines' help men/mer? I mean, the crusader relics are all made/blessed by the eight gods.

Another one:

Why did men and mer also worship the seven others: Zenithar, Kynareth, Mara, Julianos, Stendarr, Arkay (although he was mortal once, or the son of Akatosh) and Dibella? Was this part of the Covenant?

Yeah I still don't understand what Akatosh got out of the Covenant? So what if he's worshipped by men now - he wants them all dead anyway. Were he and the other Aedra bound to it against their will?

Now this is interesting...and kind of strange, because this part "They[Akaviri] have never plagued Tamriel since." is inaccurate. Unless Lysirius is Reman and the whole story is quite exaggerated and deformed.

6 days, we will find out a bit of the truth.

but i have to say i have been on the same page as you for a while now, im still unsure that THIS is the plot.
though things were cleared up here for me.
eh....i cant wait for some real info.

though the akavir thing seemed plausible at first they have their own problems to deal with.
one thing that bothers me is the mysteriousness of dragons in TES
sometimes you really dont know what is literal or implied. dragon seems to be a broad term in tes.

one source will say that they were eaten and wiped out by the akavir.
and the other will say that they were eaten and wiped out by the cliffracers.

Whats in six days?