I'm in the midst of creating a mod, where the player can become one of the Tribunal, I've seen mods that do this, but all I see are mods that make your character strong. I don't want just this. So, here's my questions:

How exactly do the Tribunal and Dagoth Ur tap into the power of the heart? I can't find a reference to it through my whole gameplay, and I'm currently looking through lore, and can't find anything there. If there isn't any lore, what would you suggest? Just activate the heart and have a choice to turn into a god? I mean exactly how do they do it. Do they perform a ritual? I wouldn't think they'd do what the Nerevarine does to the heart, that would just destroy it, right?

How would the Dumner react to a new demi-god? Would they accept me immediatly, or would they require me to earn thier trust?

Can the Tribunal shape-shift? I would assume so, since Vivec is half Dumner, half Chimer. But just to be sure.

Would there be any major enemies I'd make, becoming a Demi-God? And would I need to protect myself somehow?

Would the Ordinators and Temple automatically follow me, givn that Vivec accepts me?

If Vivec is killed, how would the PC go about things then?

What would the people think if the PC wasn't Dumner? Should I force the PC to look like something else?

Would I need to perform some heroic action, similar to the case of the Ministry of Truth?


I may think of more questions at a later date, and I'll Strikethrough any that have been answered, thanks ^_^

If I recall correctly, Sotha Sil figured out how to use the tools (Sunder, Keening, and Wraithguard) to tap the Heart of Lorkhan. I don't recall any indication of the method they used. Dagoth Ur figured out how to tap the heart without the tools, but again there's no description of how he did it, that I can remember.

In order to answer your other questions I need some more information. Like, what time period is the PC tapping the heart to become a demi-god in your mod? That will greatly impact who their enemies will be, what the populace of Morrowind will think, etc.

That was all I could find, too. Are you saying that there is no known method? If so, I may create my own then.

But didn't Dagoth Ur earn how to use the tools, then become a god? I'm sure Nerevar left him with them at Red Mountain while he spoke with Vivec, Almalexia and Sotha Sil, and when he came back, he was a god? Or am I utterly wrong?

EDIT: I just read http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Kagrenac%27s_Tools, and Dagoth Ur learned to draw power from the heart because of his experiments with the tools.


Whenever the PC can get the tools and get to the heart. So it can be at any time, until the heart is destroyed. It's up to the player to decide.

Yes, they perform a ritual. There's a pattern for using Sunder and Keening, and the pattern you use alters the outcome. Check the construction set dialogue with characters like Yagrum Bagarn and Vivec.

Do they need to know you've tapped the Heart and become a god? What's the point of telling them, they already believe you're a very Holy Saint.

If they can shape shift, they don't let anyone know.

Helseth, but that's Tribunal.

No, I don't think they would. Out of pride, I think most of Indoril's leadership would feel only luke warm toward you. That doesn't mean they wouldn't send an emissary to ask you to join their House as a senior clansmen, or something political like that.

Vivec's death would not be emediately felt by the world. It should be up to the player to determine how their Nerevarine feels about Vivec's murder.

They wouldn't care. Most Houses would offer you clanship and shower you with publicity and empty praise, then figure out ways of getting you out of their hair. The three Houses present might use your status to expand their claims on Vvardenfell, especially in the newly opened Dagoth-Ur region. The two others might use your House clanship as a means of claiming Dagoth-Ur as well.

Isn't killing Dagoth Ur, ending the Blight storms and emerging from the crater heroic enough?


Is this a real mod or a pipe dream?

Not if the player hasn't done any of the main quest, in which case, you will have killed Vivec. Bad.


That seems good. I may let the player have thier own city in Dagoth Ur. Should it be renamed, though?


Hopefully a real mod. We'll see how far I get.

Dagoth Ur will be still alive, you can't kill Ur without destroying the Heart.

What if I keep him at a distance from the heart for a while? would his powers slowly disapate? I can kill Vivec in-game, and I assume it's because he has no access to the heart. Perhaps my character could subdue him in a sort of mini Ghostgate for eternity?

Also, I read all of Vivec's and Yagrum's dialogues. They don't refer to what they do to become gods. I am getting tempted to just add a simple turn into a god when activated script to the heart.

I don't think there's any lore to clarify how you would go about tapping the heart. Just have some snappy mystic-sounding dialogue tree, and that should do the trick.

As for the consequences of tapping the heart, there isn't really any solid information there either. The houses and the Tribunal might welcome you with open arms, or they might treat you as an usurper and try to kill you.

I'd get the feeling they'd treat you like an usurper. You are an outlander who was just supposed to do away with Dagoth Ur. Receiving godlike powers would be a giant affront to the Tribunal, and the dunmer as a whole.

I think this could be a great quest, gaining the trust of the people. I just have the problem of what would I do with Dagoth Ur? I can't perform the ritual while he's fighting me to the death, can I?

Make up a backstory for some power that lets you be invisible to Dagoth. :shrug:

But I need him to see me to fight me to get me into the heart chamber. I don't want to break the main quest with this mod.

Whenever you use the power (or whatever) you can sneak past Dagoth Ur and get into the Heart Chamber.

Whenever you don't use the power Dagoth Ur sees you, so you can do the main quest.

The PC can use this power to sneak past Ur and get to the heart quicker, and do the main quest. It's not very good when you can do this.

I don't think that would work. Dagoth Ur and the Ash Vampires have a more direct connection to the Heart than the Tribunal so their powers do not need to be recharged. If you look at the dialog, there is mention that the Dagoths have all been killed before but the Heart brings them back. Even the Ash Vampires say they cannot die.

Although in the vanilla game the Ash Vampires don't resurrect, lorewise they do, so as long as the Heart of Lorkhan is not freed you will ALWAYS have Voryn and the other Dagoths coming back sooner or later.

! I have a plan... What if my character can somehow banish Ur into a plane of oblivion? Would that be feasible? Would any Daedric Princes benefit from my becoming a god?

First of all, why is this a problem? If the player wants to complete the main quest as usual, then they won't use the tools in that way when they sneak past Dagoth Ur to become a demi-god. If they do complete the main quest this way it will be a perk of being a demi-god. (There's actually a back-path for completing the Morrowind main quest already in the game, so this won't be as big a deal as you think.)

Second, if you want to make it so the player cannot complete the main quest by sneaking past Dagoth Ur, just make it so when you use the power you can only tap the Heart to become a demi-god, and cannot do so as to complete the main quest. So, when you want to complete the main quest, you don't use the power, and so Dagoth Ur can see you, etc. Then make up some backstory to explain the difference - like, you can only complete the main quest after Vivec tells you his plans, or something.

I just don't want to let the player be able to skip one of the biggest fights in the game, and the fact that for some reason you can't destroy the heart when you sneak past Ur is kinda slacking in story. If at all possible, I'd like to find a lore safe method of getting around this. I want the mod to be as close to lore as possible.

If the player can become a demi-god, it's hard to believe they couldn't just beat the main quest that way too. But if you don't want them to be able to complete the main quest this way, then make it so they can't beat the main quest while using the power (or however you want to do it). Explain it through backstory.

Or, if it bothers you that much, just give the player the opportunity to do the ritual and become a god during the battle with Dagoth Ur in the main quest. So they can become a demi-god and complete the main quest at the same time.

I've decided that the player will go to the Heart, activate it, and then become a god, I'm not sure what will happen about Dagoth Ur, but after that you'll get the Dumner to accept you, build a city, become powerful, and eventually become as awesome as Vivec.

Does anyone have a suggestion about Dagoth Ur? Something needs to happen to him no matter what, anyway. Should he be concealed in a prison of my creation?

I was also thinking about the player. Should there be a physical change? Perhaps a resize,and is it possible for me to assign a new animation to myself (Ur's) while I'm already part way through the game?

Also, the main quest wouldn't be possible to finish until the heart is destroyed, in which case you would loose all powers. (Yet you can still do it)

Here's the thing. As long as you don't bring in any thing that already has established lore - other gods, the Dwemer, etc - then you really can't go wrong. You can deal with Dagoth basically any way you want, and it will be perfectly consistent with the lore that already exists, because there is no previous lore pertaining to this.

Just pick something and go with it, you can't lose.

Ah! I have it. Once you activate the heart, Dagoth Ur will be banished, and all that will be left is is helmet. It will be refered to as "Dagoth's Prison" and will be a pilgrimage site similar to Vivec's Ash mask, but the truth is, no one knows what happened.

There is a very simple explaination for leaving Ur alive: Once you have bound yourself to the Heart, he can do nothing.

You posess the tools and you can't be killed. Neither his Vampires nor the Tribunal can touch you. It's you're turn and you have everyone's king in check.

You can:
A) Continue building Anumidium and expel the n'wah
B ) Go to Akavir
C) Sever everyone from the Heart when you feel up to it
D) Make some deal with the Tribunal and Ur
E) Continue exploration of the Heart's umbilical link to the mthopoeic (perform some miracles, Chim and beyond)

Why can't you just remove Dagoth's connection with the heart with the tools and then reverse the order to make yourself take his place? You could weaken the version of him in the heart chamber so he can actually be killed, then run up to the heart, hit it with the tools, but change the programming so you get a dialogue about Dagoth and his kin no longer being divine..then you become a god and get a massive power boost.

But when you walk out into the next room, Dagoth managed to resurrect one last time. But now that you're a god he's extremely weak and dies in like two hits.

I've actually already managed to script the process I mentioned earlier, where you'll just need to activate the heart. Later on, when you speak to Vivec, you'll state that you knew what to do purely out of instinct.

would this be suitable? Or would a more complex method work better?

Also, where would the temple most likely have another city to be located? I was thinking I'd put it on Dagoth Ur, over the ruins, but no one wants to live there. Would it be better for the new city to be located near already temple areas, and expand slowly, growing over time, or would it be better for it to be located in another totally different place, claiming different patches at a time. If the latter, what would be a likely place to put the new city? I would expect somewhere not too close to another city, and in a pretty hospitable place. Grazelands, maybe?

Also, to save another thread, how much power would the PC get from this? I don't want to be so strong as to break my weapon every time I swing it, for example.