The wording of "Unarmed Attacks" and "Unarmed We : Fallout: New Vegas

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:18 am

I want to start an iron man character for fun. Some of the unarmed perks describe the effect with Unarmed Weapons, others don't. I'll list them here:

Piercing Strike 12 Unarmed 70 1 All your unarmed and melee attacks negate 15 points of DT.
Slayer 24 AG 7, Unarmed 90 1 The speed of all your melee and unarmed attacks is increased by 30%.

Purifier 14 1 You do 50% extra damage with [melee and unarmed weapons against centaurs, nightstalkers, spore plants, spore carriers, deathclaws, super mutants, and feral ghouls.
Ninja 20 Melee Weapons 80, Sneak 80 1 +15%( 15 luck skill) critical chance with melee and unarmed weapons, +25% damage with melee/unarmed sneak attack criticals (I know it's bugged but im banking on Ninja being fixed)

Obviously, I won't be using an unarmed weapon, though I will be using unarmed attacks exclusively. Do the listed "unarmed weapons" perks actually work with no unarmed weapon equipped whilst still receiving their benefits?

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:11 am

If you dont use an unarmed weapon even at 100 skill it will take you like 5 punches to kill a bloat fly.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 8:54 am

If you dont use an unarmed weapon even at 100 skill it will take you like 5 punches to kill a bloat fly.

It's an ironman build, and nothing that you have said has answered my question.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:18 am

Considering unarmed weapon means anything that uses your fist and your fists are obviously unarmed fighting.....Don't know why you are using your fists as you'll get owned if you fight like that :chaos:

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:49 am

Also I have an unarmed character now and no matter what the perk says they only apply if you are using an unarmed WEAPON like knuckles, power fist, ballisitc fist etc.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:29 am

Unarmed-related perks don't require an unarmed weapon, nor do any of them fail to work if you have one equipped.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:39 am

Unarmed-related perks don't require an unarmed weapon, nor do any of them fail to work if you have one equipped.

Not correct. Slayer DOES NOT WORK if you do not have a unarmed WEAPON on test it yourself I just did.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:56 am

I'm receiving contradicting responses. Do either of you know for sure?

edit: Slayer was worded that unarmed attacks are faster. If you what you say is correct, it sounds like they either need to re-word the unarmed perks, or it's a bug. If this is the case, an ironman build would be hopeless. I'll just console myself in a new game to test really quick as well.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:06 am

Hmm looks like I was wrong. In looking at the underlying data, ALL the perks you listed require a melee or unarmed WEAPON to be equipped to work - UNLESS "IsWeaponSkillType Unarmed" is true with no weapon equipped, which I don't think it is. Might wanna use Brass Knuckles.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 4:49 am

Hmm looks like I was wrong. In looking at the underlying data, ALL the perks you listed require a melee or unarmed WEAPON to be equipped to work - UNLESS "IsWeaponSkillType Unarmed" is true with no weapon equipped, which I don't think it is. Might wanna use Brass Knuckles.

It'll have to go from a perk by perk basis, I guess. The descriptions are all blotched, and so far despite what you've found, my results thus far have yielded a different conclusion.

I haven't checked the perks in the GECK yet, though with some testing, Piercing Strike benefits unarmed attacks without an unarmed weapon equipped, and it was worded in the description to benefit melee attacks, appropriately. On armored targets, it displays the armor penetration icon, along with a significant damage increase. (At level 1 with 1 luk, it consistently took 40-41 punches to remove a bar of health from the alpha deathclaw male, as opposed to the several hundred punches without it that I'm not patient enough to carry out complete testing with (I haven't gotten him down a bar without piercing strike, yet, lol).

Going to test the others; which leads me to my next question: Is there a console command to check an NPC's health? :shrug: In any case, I'm probably going to report all of this to the bug section since unarmed perks are kind of sketchy as it is.

edit: Tested purifier, with piercing strike to maintain my sanity. Consistently, it took 26-27 punches to remove a bar of health, leading me to believe Purifier works without a weapon, despite the fact it's worded to only work with an unarmed weapon.

edit #2: Tested, super slam, works without a weapon, worded with unarmed attacks.

edit #3: Testing Slayer, but a 30% increase is difficult to spot. (I added the perk via console, and am simply watching the animation speed with unarmed and with brass knuckles) It seems like Torm is correct that it doesn't work without an unarmed weapon equipped, but it's still kind of hard to tell.

I can't really test Ninja, especially considering it's bugged as is. I guess at this point I can conclude that most unarmed perks without a weapon equipped work. Slayer is bugged, unless it was otherwise intended that the benefits of unarmed perks should only be received whilst wearing an unarmed weapon.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:28 am

It'll have to go from a perk by perk basis, I guess. The descriptions are all blotched, and so far despite what you've found, my results thus far have yielded a different conclusion.

I haven't checked the perks in the GECK yet, though with some testing, Piercing Strike benefits unarmed attacks without an unarmed weapon equipped, and it was worded in the description to benefit melee attacks, appropriately. On armored targets, it displays the armor penetration icon, along with a significant damage increase. (At level 1 with 1 luk, it consistently took 40-41 punches to remove a bar of health from the alpha deathclaw male, as opposed to the several hundred punches without it that I'm not patient enough to carry out complete testing with (I haven't gotten him down a bar without piercing strike, yet, lol).

Going to test the others; which leads me to my next question: Is there a console command to check an NPC's health? :shrug: In any case, I'm probably going to report all of this to the bug section since unarmed perks are kind of sketchy as it is.

edit: Tested purifier, with piercing strike to maintain my sanity. Consistently, it took 26-27 punches to remove a bar of health, leading me to believe Purifier works without a weapon, despite the fact it's worded to only work with an unarmed weapon.

edit #2: Tested, super slam, works without a weapon, worded with unarmed attacks.

edit #3: Testing Slayer, but a 30% increase is difficult to spot. (I added the perk via console, and am simply watching the animation speed with unarmed and with brass knuckles) It seems like Torm is correct that it doesn't work without an unarmed weapon equipped, but it's still kind of hard to tell.

agreed my friend

I was going to convey that message to you I just think the wording is all botched up on all the unarmed/ melee perks.

I can't really test Ninja, especially considering it's bugged as is. I guess at this point I can conclude that most unarmed perks without a weapon equipped work. Slayer is bugged, unless it was otherwise intended that the benefits of unarmed perks should only be received whilst wearing an unarmed weapon.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:02 am

Interesting theory, and results you got there OP. I had always just associated Unarmed Weapons and Attacks as being the same thing since attacks comes from weapons, and unarmed weapons include your fists and all. Unless my reasoning went wrong somewhere down the road there.

edit #3: Testing Slayer, but a 30% increase is difficult to spot. (I added the perk via console, and am simply watching the animation speed with unarmed and with brass knuckles) It seems like Torm is correct that it doesn't work without an unarmed weapon equipped, but it's still kind of hard to tell.

The easiest, and possibly simplest, way would be to simply record a set amount of punches, let's say 20, with fists and the brass knuckles each, with and without the perk. From there, simply time it using the footage. You'll get an accurate enough time to make a conclusion that's correct. I may be able to do it for you, if you aren't able to.

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:03 am

Do you mean "iron man" asin the comic/movie character? or asin "a hardcoe badass who punches people"?

If its the first option (comic/filmhttp://homepage.mac.com/cbauer/files/suitcase_armor.jpg) then i don't see why you'd use your fists instead of using powerfists, displacer glove, ect, ect, seeing as the character wears a suit that aids in his combat much like the powerfist and suit do. (the first stage of his suit even looks like http://www.thebitbag.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/im_mk1.jpg

» Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:12 am

Do you mean "iron man" asin the comic/movie character? or asin "a hardcoe badass who punches people"?

If its the first option (comic/filmhttp://homepage.mac.com/cbauer/files/suitcase_armor.jpg) then i don't see why you'd use your fists instead of using powerfists, displacer glove, ect, ect, seeing as the character wears a suit that aids in his combat much like the powerfist and suit do. (the first stage of his suit even looks like http://www.thebitbag.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/im_mk1.jpg

"Ironman" refers to a gaming challenge where you play without any gear on. Watch the http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWArvEV4tjI runs for an idea.

The wording of &#34;Unarmed Attacks&#34; and &#34;Unarmed We

The wording of "Unarmed Attacks" and "Unarmed We