The AI in Oblivon were really, extremely bland and lifeless. The most exciting life any of them lived was that smelly Argonian in Leyawiin that moved peoples stuff around.

I understand that the AI are getting a significant upgrade, working, talking, etc. but does this also mean there will be thieves around, people breaking into houses, or even hiding in alleyways waiting for someone to come by to mug them? Will we catch People trying to pickpocket others?

I'd love to see a shady looking person and later on visit a jail or get out of jail and see him sitting there in a cell for a couple days.
As everyone in Oblivion is a "goody two-shoes". For instance, if you walk through the Imperial City, or even a slum like Bravil, there is nobody 'misbehaving'. Sure there are quests where, this person did this and you need to bring him justice. But it would be nice to be randomly walking through a busy town street to catch someone trying to pickpocket someone else, then initiating conversation with the victim, notifying them of what was witnessed.

I've always enjoyed watching the guards chase someone down while swinging wildly, it always looked silly to me. Although it really would be cool to see some of the stuff you mentioned.

Ya i think the reason that everyone in OB was so well behaved is because psychic guards who could be around the corner a hundred feet away would instantaniously find out and come to chop you down. the law of Cyrodil is unforgiving if you ask me. death for stealing a piece of bread.

True. there can be no progress in life simulation if the guards are killing the npc;s.

You apparently haven't met City-Swimmer. Or Shameer in Skingrad. Or Ongar in Bruma. Or the Orums in Cheydinhal. All of them can and will try to pickpocket other NPCs and can and often will get caught, sometimes with fatal consequences.

That said though, it would be nice if such things happened more spontaneously, with more variety, in more situations. I expect they will, since they were already heading in that direction with Oblivion.

Why do people do this? Why do people just say COMPLETELY UNTRUE THINGS about Oblivion?

People would pickpocket other people in Oblivion ALL THE TIME. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone slain on the streets because they were caught pickpocketing. I can't tell you how many times I saw someone pickpocket someone else and get away with it.

Saying Oblivion's AI is bland and lifeless is just ridiculous. It was probably the most advanced AI in a video game at the time. What other video game do people eat, sleep, go shopping, talk to other NPCs, practice archery, practice magic, read, make potions, react to weather, and do tons of other things all just part of their daily schedule?

Give Oblivion some credit, for the love of Azura.

They reacted to weather?

All I recall in any Elder Scrolls game concerning weather was Arena's NPCs pulling hoods up in the rain/snow, and Morrowind's shielding their eyes from ash storms.

there were some random "adventurers" who picked up bones in caves. In cities people picked up food and eated it. Remember city swimmer she was fun to watch anyways

They didn't have animations like that for weather, but several NPCs would change their schedules depending on whether or not it was raining.

Have to agree with Velorien 100%. Name five, no, three games with better npc AI than the five year old Oblivion. Then see how many 'rpg's you can name where a shopkeeper, or any normal town inhabitant is even killable, let alone running an AI schedule.
And I have come across several dead npc's in OB with stolen goods on them.

yep whenever it rained beggars in the IC would look for shelter

also big head would pickpocket people and he always died becuase he would be caught

I think the AI is great in Oblivion and will be spectacular in Skyrim.

Risen, The Witcher, Gothic.

I hope AI is more reckless. You made a great point that in oblivion everyone was good, never did anything wrong. I would like to see more criminals in the major cities of Skyrim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vV2HunTUcyE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-zk0eodQHI


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KN7cKO8-P0

crixus just gave 3 simple examples, of games with if not better AI without the stupidity that happens in Oblivion
:spotted owl:

These weren't released in 2006 were they?

Risen no

witcher 07

Gothic 3 06


so yeah :teehee:

and Gothic was open world

Yeah, people way misunderstand the AI in Oblivion. I think, more than the AI, that simply having better animations will be the biggest thing for people thinking the AI is improved. The only problem is that people don't always notice the AI because of sometimes unnoticeable methods of displaying it, but that doesn't mean it's not there.

Another good example of this in Oblivion, of which many people aren't aware, is the skooma smuggling ring. Oghash gra-Magul, who's part of the Orum gang in Cheydinhal, makes a weekly trip to the Imperial City and buys skooma on the waterfront (she owns the paint horse that ends up parked at the gate there). She then returns to Cheydinhal and goes up into the mountains and sells the skooma to the Camonna Tong thugs, then takes the money to Dulfish gro-Orum. That's going on, in the background, all the time.

And again, I would expect more of that sort of thing in Skyrim.

thats the sort of thing I'd expect to be flaunted Pre Oblivion, in addition to it Mattering to the game, I saw the barrel the orum gang owns, it gets a skooma drop off every week by the game, I killed the runner to see if anything changed...

it didn't

so yes hopefully this is more fleshed out and widespread in Skyrim.

Oblivion's AI is well developed, it's just lobotomized daily. AI is victim to schedules.

http://cs.elderscrolls.com/constwiki/images/thumb/4/4d/CLE_TES-CS_AI-Object_Window.PNG/732px-CLE_TES-CS_AI-Object_Window.PNG

AI is fully functioning in itself. When told EAT at 5, they will actually search and find their food on their own. If their responsibility is low, they will even attempt to steal it. There are some NPCs(exampled above) left with "eat" packages for long durations which also happen to have low responsibility who steal food all the time.

Off course anyone into AI will see the abysmal error in that. They don't get hungry on their own, they don't get sleepy on their own. They are being told. These things shouldn't bind to schedules like that but be active at all times. This is probably the most underutilized tech I've ever seen...

Cynically, certainly, I expect to see less of it than would be possible in Skyrim, and I expect to see less of it than however much Todd says will be in it. But I still expect to see more of it than was in Oblivion.

It's all a relative measure - sort of like politics. Sometimes you have to settle for "less bad."


Actually - if you want to get precise about it, Oblivion "AI" (and game "AI" in general) isn't AI at all - it's just more complex scripting that hopefully manages to convey some illusion of intelligence. So, yes - it all comes down to how complex that scripting actually is and whether or not it has gaps in it or conflicts with itself.

For instance, in the Orum gang skooma smuggling ring example, the paint horse that ends up parked by the waterfront gate to the IC belongs to them. It ends up parked there because somebody failed to set it up so that Oghash actually rides the horse back and forth to Cheydinhal, so she only rides it as far as the gate, then gets off and walks back to Cheydinhal. That's because she's not really "intelligent" - she just does what the game tells her to do (or doesn't do what it doesn't tell her to do). And until some quantum leap in game technology, that's going to remain the case.

LOL that is probably not the best A.I. in the world

:thumbsup:

Hahah I've logged around 500 hours on Oblivion since it game out and okay okay save for the what like... 10 NPCs that actually do something everyone kind of just walks around. I know of only a couple NPCs that actually pickpocket.. City Swimmer and all of those ones... other than that I've never seen anyone.. I love OB don't get me wrong, possibly my favorite game for the 360 so far but the AI could have some tuning up.