I dont recall the Nords having anything at all to do with what Tiber Septim did to Summerset so lets not blame them for something the Nords didn't do. Hell the only thing the Imperials really did was injure Altmer pride a little.

... so? he has an argonian who's job it is to bend over backwards for him and die to protect him. Has nothing to do with whether they are racist are not. Personally i find them racist because if anyone was like that in real life we'd consider it racist. The stormcloaks are just a bit more subtle. Maybe it's more prejudice. They support segregation.

Another butthurted stormy.

There are degrees of racism, just because the stormcloaks aren't loading dunmer onto trains set for the gas ovens doesn't mean they aren't racist. You can feel the exclusion as a non-nord talking to stormcloaks and joining the stormcloaks as a non - nord feels pretty damn awkward as well. That discomfort non-nords are made to feel is a form of racism, not even an especially subtle one. Racism can get much more vague and subtle than that while still unmistakabley being racism.

Um yes, it is. In case you haven't noticed, intoxication effects the human mind, and you'd be lying if you said he could remember everything he said. Alcohol is a powerful substance, and if you have the unfortunate experience of knowing anyone effected severely by it like I do, then you would know.

This is the kind of post that gets threads locked.

Atmora had been a frozen wasteland for almost two eras before the birth of Tiber Septim.

The three beings who make up Talos are Tiber Septim - a man who may have been Nord or Breton, Wulfharth - who actually was Atmoran-born but was undead by the time of Tiber Septim, and Zurin Arctus - who was either Nibenese or Akaviri.

Wasn't Zurin Tiber's battlemage?

Yes.

'Jarl, how go our plans to expel the elves from Skyrim?'

'We are making good progress, Galmar. They now have a full quarter of our important government positions, and freely own plenty of homes and businesses.'

Truth is Talos was half nord, half breton, half imperial, and half agonian/high elf/orc.

Are the Stormcloaks racist? Probably yes. Are they more racist than the Empire or Tamriel in general? No, I have no reason to think they are. In fact, from what we could read about the Nords and Skyrim(nation) before Skyrim(game) came out, I would have expected the Nords to be much more anti-Mer than they are showed to be in the game. The Nords as a whole seem to be a pretty accepting people at this point.

What I think the problem with this perception comes from is that there are many NPCs who accuse the Stormcloaks of only wanting Nords in Skyrim. Even though there aren't any Stormcloak leaders who confirms this in any way, it is repeated often enough for people to just assume it is true, probably supported by the less-than-nice picture that is presented when people enter Windhelm for the first time.

Of course, I also think that the fact that the Nords are white humans have a lot to do with it. I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the racism we see the Stormcloaks display would be almost taboo to even bring up if it was a Redguard movement. I'm also almost positive that no one would make the Ulfric = Hitler comparison either. Or make racism a big issue, at least not on the scale it tends to come up for the Stormcloaks.

At the end of the day, I think of the "Stormcloaks are racists" argument as a red herring. A position meant to distract the argument away from what I consider more important parts of the discussion. Like...

- Empire's 200+ long year decline, losing all of their provinces save for Skyrim and High Rock

- that the Empire allows the Thalmor to kidnap, torture and kill civilians on very vague grounds,

- that the Empire is more than willing to scapegoat whenever it suits them(Markarth Incident)

- That Elisif is a vain young woman who enjoy Elenwen's parties and will be little more than a puppet

- The Elder Council/Emperor problem that comes in the game, which is related to...

- The Elder Council's history of weakening the Empire whenever they had more power than the Emperor

- that the Empire is willing to kill people they know are innocent. The player at the beginning of the game, where Hadvar confirms that they don't have a reason to kill you, but they do it anyway. Or, if you think that is just one jerkish captain, the Empire is willing to let their officers kill innocents in front of their superior officers, even after it has been pointed out that they are innocent, without penalty.

- the breaking of the Covenant with Akatosh, removing the Empire's mythic support. And the mythic is a big deal in Tamriel.

You know, there is something no supporter has ever been able to explain. They come up with theories, but nothing supported by character dialogue or notes/books.

"Did you know it was his decree that forbade the Argonians from living inside the city walls? I hope in his next life, he's reborn as an Argonian forced to live in a slum because of some bigoted Nord dictator. I'm joking, of course, but I'm a lot happier seeing the Empire running things in Windhelm."

Scouts-Many-Marshes.

I would never compare Ulfric to Hitler, but he still is racist.

I wouldn't say there are none. Jarl Kuvar from Winterhold, for instance. And Markarth's Stormcloak jarl.

And there is this argument used by SC supporters, "Oh, but Ulfric lets them...". Irrelevant. You will find people from all races working and living in Morrowind but damn, do the Dunmer hate those filthy outlanders. It doesn't equal tolerance.

So if I was drunk in a bar, and was calling people the n-word, do you REALLY think i'd be excused because I'm drunk? No. You're still responsible for your own actions. I know a couple people who are terrible drunks, not in the good way. My roommate being one of them.You'd be lying if you said that when Vulwulf called me an Imperial bastard at 3pm on Morndas, he wouldn't remember it. That's never an excuse.

Y'all gotta admit it's rather odd that every stormcloak soldier and officer are Nords, for such an un-racist group. Seems mighty odd to me anyways.

It is a pro-Nord cause.

People just need to put their big boy pants on. This is Tamriel. You don't get coddled here, no matter who you are. Even if the worst people say about Ulfric is true, he's still sunshine and roses.

Talos on a cracker, Bethesda is never going to be able to write a serious game again. All the hand-wringers would faint dead away.

Assuming they aren't all away doing TESO.

Uh, OP just because someone hires someone a different race then them doesn't mean the employer isn't racist, I can bring up a lot of notable examples.


ESO is Zenimax Online, Bethesda is just publishing it.

Bethesda aren't making TESO. ZeniMax Online Studios are.

No, you wouldn't be excused, but you would obviously be in a state of mind not suitable to base your opinion of an entire people on. I'm certain in Morrowind you will find drunken Dunmer spouting crude things regarding other races. Also, you should take into mind the man has been wrecked by the loss of his daughter, and has turned to the bottle.

As I have said countless times in the past, even if he did count as racist, that's FIVE out of hundreds. It's not enough to call a whole people racist on account of five.

I guess Imperials must be the most xenophobic and racists people in Tamriel cuz of thesehttp://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Hackdirt (sarcasm)

It's not five out of hundreds actually, i'm almost certain every non-essential Stormcloak soldier has been programmed with some sort of racist dialouge eg. "filthy elves" etc. so there's quite a bit more than 5

He really isn't though, Ulfric isn't all "sunshine and roses" he doesn't even seem that way in the game. He is arrogant and a loud-mouth who is probably making more promises then he can handle.

I've sided with the Stormcloaks in nearly every playthrough I've done, and the most "racist" dialogue I've heard refers to the Imperials, such as "Damn faithless Imperials" etc. My sister played a High Elf stormcloak and has heard nothing of the sort.

Although, admittedly, there are more than just 5 bigoted Stormcloaks, at least that I can imagine. The cause of "make Skyrim independant and push out the Imperials" just seems to attract those kinds of people. Doesn't mean the cause as a whole caters to those people.

I think he was saying Ulfric is "sunshine and roses" compared to some in Tamriel.