I wonder if you realize that the Stormcloak Jarl of Hjaalmarch, Sorli the Builder, has an Argonian huscarl? http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Teeba-Ei ... Not everything is quite as it seems, eh?

I think they know not all Nordcloaks are racist.

Nevertheless, I felt like it might be nice to point out

I've never seem them as racist, just ulfric

Meh. I've never subscribed to the belief that the Stormcloaks are racist. At most they are prejudiced, which isn't really the same thing. There's a couple of idiots in Windhelm who give Nords a bad name, getting drunk and shouting insults at the Dark Elves. All races hold prejudices against each other. I think people who say that the Stormcloaks are racist are exaggerating.

Well Ulfric isn't racist so you're dead wrong on that.

He let's Niranye own a shop and a nice home in Windhelm and she's an Altmer....sure he sticks those dirty Dunmer in the poor quarter but at least he lets those Morrowind refugees have a small community, no other cities have one.

http://cs.uesp.net/index.php?game=sr&formid=0x000cdec6

I like my stormcloaks like I like my legion.

Dead, with a side of thalmor.

I find it hard to believe that the Stormcloaks are racist when there are plenty of Altmer civilians in Windhelm who have a reasonable life. The merchant...the horse salesman.

In my opinion, most of the "Stormcloaks are racist" arguments are focused on the Dark Elves and Argonians.

And I don't want to sound harsh, but some of the Dark Elves aren't even trying to improve their reputation. Which definitely seems to be possible regarding a Dunmer who owns a farm near Windhelm. Granted he does not technically live in the city, but he does visit it. And well, one of the Dunmers even mentioned how he doesn't care about the murdered women, unless the victim is a Dunmer. How is that going to give your people a good image? Source: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Ambarys_Rendar

Regarding the Argonians, Brunwulf Free-Winter himself mentioned that they should stay outside for their own safety. Source: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Windhelm

Oh welp, hold the phone guys, Sorlis got a lizard housecarl. Irrefutable proof that all the Stormcloaks across the land extend a hand full of chocolates and roses to the natives of the Marsh. And we would have gotten away with it, too.

Sarcasm, love it! xD

I still don't think the Stormcloaks are racist though.

I do not believe that the Stormcloaks are racist, not at all really. Rather, they are composed of genuinely good folks like Ralof and so many others that left their homes and farms to fight for a dream. Racist...no. Misguided?.....well maybe...yes.

I do however think that it is unconscionable that Ulfric has not put a stop to Rolf's racist behaviour, or at least one of the guards put an end to it. There is no way that anyone could be unaware of it, the guy is shouting at the top of his voice for hours every single night. So that in itself reflects on Ulfric and leads people to believe that he is a racist himself.

To anyone who says they're racist, please explain why most high-ranking Stormcloak officials are elves (stewards, housecarls, court wizards, etc.), and why there's recent Thalmor immigrants and a Dunmer among the richest, most influential citizens of Windhelm. The rumours that they're racist come from a contender to Ulfric's title, a known Imperial spy, and one drunk, and are not borne out by the reality we all see.

Elves in the Stormcloak hierarchy? O_o ....Where? And no, the Dovahkiin does not count.

The court mage of Riften, the court mage of Whiterun, the steward of Riften, the steward of Winterhold, and the steward of Falkreath.

And the dovahkiin does actually count, as they can rise to become Ulfric's third-in-command. If they were an elf and the Stormcloaks were racist against elves, that wouldn't be possible.

You mean 'Altmer' yes? Because somehow I doubt Ulfric would tolerate anything remotely 'Thalmor' in his city.

It's the same thing with the Argonians in Windhelm actually... If you talk to the right NPCs in Windhelm, you get an idea that anyone is accepted in the city OVERALL and can live a good life... It's just more if they are willing to gain the respect from others in the city...

There's only a very few Nords that are truly racist and you know the saying... One bad apple spoils the bunch.

That's their racial identity, but they were both born in - and, until recently, lived in - a Thalmor-controlled Summerset Isle, making them politically Thalmor citizens.

Even the fact that Altmer are allowed to freely live and build empires in Windhelm is a knock to the 'they're all racists' crowd.

Falkreath and Whiterun are Imperial holds... If Stormcloaks take over Falkreath, they actually replace the steward with a Nord.

I've seem many negative comments about Ulfric to change my mind, even from those who support him.

1.Most mages are elves,if you want a mage you need to make compromises.

2.Whiterun now honestly do you know who rules Whiterun ?And Farengar is a NORD!!! / NOPE

3.The original Jarl of Riften is not really a Stormcloack . /NOPE

4.The Steward of Winterhold is only Steward because the Jarl thinks he is a spy ,he even says that ... /NOPE

5.If the Stormcloaks take over she will be exiled /NOPE

Ahm you know how long Altmer live ?They could be Altmer dissidents and you know what the Thalmor do with dissidents.

Fair cop, I just remembered Farengar is a Nord. As for Falkreath, Nenya served under the Stormcloak Dengeir in the past, and I'll check but I was sure she continues to do so when he returns to power. Either way, a Stormcloak Falkreath did have an elven steward.

But even so there's a lot of non-human officials in Stormcloak courts - more than there are in Imperial courts, unless I've miscounted, and definitely more than enough to prove the racist policies attributed to them do not exist.

Other than 'yes she is,' I'm not entirely sure what to say to this. What's your evidence?

No, he thinks he's a person of influence within the College. And even so, the fact that he's an elf didn't hold him back, and that's what we're discussing here.

Whether or not she is exiled when the Stormcloak Dengeir comes back, she did serve under him before.

The Thalmor are a government, a marginalized political faction and a militarist regime. They are not the Altmer as a totality. There is no such thing as a 'Thalmor Citizen'. The Altmer in Windhelm are definitely not Thalmor.

That's true, and if you want to count them as merely Altmer, not Thalmor, then that's fine.

But there's still some very influential Altmer in Windhelm, freshly-arrived from Thalmor territory; that's got to count as one in the eye for people who say Ulfric discriminates against elves.