Ah. I see, I thought you were referring to ancient Rome.

I told myself I wasn't gonna get into this but [censored] it, I've got a few hours before a party.

Alright, you said you found it funny how most pro-Legion make stuff up. You also implied that I was making stuff up without backing up my information. It's pretty easy to think you were calling me pro-Legion with those two statements mate. And don't be calling me arrogant, ignorant would be the word to fit better there. Arrogant would be like calling me an ass and I can assure you, that I am not.

Also, "as far as we know", we obviously don't know much.

And as such due to our lack of knowledge, and the lack of Canon material, we can make NO guesses or base ANY argument on the hypothetical/assumed treatment of women on the main of Caesar's land and we can only rely on in game information which points to them all being slaves.

Also I don't imply things. if I want to say you specifically were a pro-legion nutball I would have..

to all you people hating on the legion, Macharius seemed to make quite a good point above.....none of you have cared to rebuff it though :whistling:

Ancient Rome was basically a carbon copy of Ancient Greece on a bigger scale.

The Greeks had city states, Rome had one ultimate city state.

Greeks worshipped Greek Gods, Romans changed the names of some of the Greek Gods

Greeks had a senate exclusive for older men with status,money, and/or power. Romans had the same thing.

Greeks made realistic statues and used lots of colors to paint them. Romans made copies of Greek sculptures.

Greeks used innovative formations such as the phalanx. Romans did the same thing and added archers and artillery.

lol k

The Romans took several Greek concepts, forged them into their own image and made them work ten fold than what the Greeks could. The Greeks couldn't stay united for more than five minutes before fighting each other, Alexander's entire Empire broke down because they couldn't decided on a heir and each one of his generals wanted their own piece of his kingdom. The Romans were far from a carbon copy.

Right on the money 'cept for a few parts. They copied everything from military innovation to their system of government from the Etruscans who were Greeks that colonized Italy centuries earlier. The Romans did use a variation on the phalanx formation with a few pretty key adjustments, namely maniples which were far more maneuverable (along with the pila they would hurl before entering close combat). But yeah, essentially the Romans munched up every thing they liked about the Etruscans except for certain traditions they considered too "Greek" in nature.

I think you have a few things confused. For one, the Romans are the descendants of the Etruscans. Secondly, the Etruscans were not Greeks.

guys....don't try to argue with Dune on this one. he's feeling the mustard flow through his veins like fire....he's not one to be trifled with lightly.

That just defeats the objective of having a forum if we aren't allowed to form a counterargument. I shall never back down! I'm as stubborn as a mule and according to my sister as ugly as one.

Anyway, this is starting to swerve off topic.

you're entitled to form a counterargument only if you strike with the righteous flame of condiments. i was actually hoping for one of these legion-bashers to take exception with something you said earlier Macharius but i doubt any one of them has the intellectual capacity to vault over that solid, unflinching wall of mustard

Hm. Caesar took what he liked from Ancient Roman history and left the rest. Kinda' like how the Romans adopted certain aspects of other societies to fit their needs while, you guessed it, leaving out the rest. He's more similar to them in that respect I suppose.

What? Who ever said Caesar was psychotic or sixist? And I don't find him obscenely offensive, he's just a little blunt, and he's old so he get's irritated quickly like most old people do. He might be a sociopath, but I must argue with you over the other three statements you made about Edward Sallow.

You don't have to like Eddie, but he makes his state safe. Safer than any other area in the Fallout world that I had encountered thus far. Don't break the law and don't insult the lord of the realm and it's just like any other place.

Why is everybody batching about Edward cherry picking aspects of Rome? The US did the same thing, most new things just take parts from a bunch of old things and puke them out to make something beautiful!

What point did he bring up? Really, I want to see if I can play devil's advocate. IT'S A GAME!!! <3

I know right . It's like you can't even [censored] murder and crucify people anymore without someone calling you a bad person.

:clap: ZOMG YOU GUAIZ!!! SOMEBODY FINALLY GETS IT!!!!! :clap:

In all seriousness though, do you hate your government for putting people to death? I assume you're an American, sorry if I'm wrong. But really, would you leave your government because some law breakers were punished?

Rome. It took centuries to build it...
Romulus et Remus started it, the twins born by Rhea Silva's and Marte (some say Heracles).
Yes, Roma had greeck (semi-)godly ancestors... It's sort of accepted.
Roma started as a few huts and one tribe, then it became a kingdom (well, by rough translation).
It adsorbed more tribes, and became a Republic (after several, records say after seven "kings").
By that time, the ruling was by delegation and segregation of power.
The Republic wasn't a democracy in modern terms. The weight by which political decisions were made was called "Census"... Wealth.
To make a long story short, Rome barely survived it's earlier stages. The key to success was sheer Economic power and
sheer Military (Legio) determination. The Senate (Elders) had the control of both. And it took general Marius to turn the Army
into a true power. It's amazing to think that those "elders" were the one lasting beyond their 30th birthday.
By the way, Gens Etruscae (you'd call them Etruscans) were just one of the tribes that were opposing the early romans.
Many tribes became part of the early Senate et Populus Quirites Romanii. Yes, that's S. P. Q. R.
Oh, look... That's THE Old World flag. It didn't have a bull though...
Legio Ottava Augusta (AUG-VIII-LEG) had a bull as their "Insigna" and it's accredited with more than 400 years of service.
Weird. The AVG-VIII-LEG is one of the Legio that accompained Gaius Julii through De Bello Gallicum and
was at his command when he crossed Rubiconem, but was against Julius himself at Pharsalys.
Anyhow.... I'm digressing.
The Republic grew to a stage were nothing, except itself, could stand in it's path.
That's where Gaius Julii enters the show... Edward who?!
Gaius didn't steal power. He claimed it. He was killed as a consequence, because opposition, at those times, was more direct than nowadays, in 2281.
And the rules were more transparent.
Gaius of the Julii did take power on his hands, and he did that for several reasons.
All of those reasons cannot be summarized here
It's a long story, and it's a game
Cheers!

Hate is a strong word but I do oppose capital punishment and a lot of other things my government does.
And yes I'm an American , even worse a Texan.

Anyways this a games forum . I've no desire to discuss real world politics here .
And even if I did, there's a bear with top hat lurking about who will lock this thread quicker than you can blink.

Thanks for getting the joke, though.

It's hard for me to make a believable character that supports the Legion that isn't a sadistic sociopath.

My Energy Weapons Paladin, nope, they want the Brotherhood dead.

My Mormon convert Guns character, nope, Legion destroyed New Canaan and wants all New Canaanites destroyed and Joshua Graham hates the Legion.

Actually the only believable character is my Enclave Remnants character who supports the Legion only because he wants to see the NCR destroyed. He uses them as a pawn for revenge. But still, that's not really supporting the Legion full-heartedly either.

Can someone post their Legion characters so I can get an idea of a sincere Legion character that isn't a sadistic psycho? Please be detailed.

The Legion are a threat to global security and peace.
They have been marked for elimination.
GDI Task force operations group Echo proceding...

Christ, get off your high horse.

You think that the Enclave are a grey faction despite the fact that they commit genocide. More so that the Legion. Reiterate your points again, please.

So....You stole The Enclave's character?

As far as I know many people have made an Enclave remenants character who wants to destroy the NCR.
Unless The Enclave has the rights to the character type,anyone can make it without it being stolen.

No, but it seems kind of suspicious to make such a perfect replica of an unusual character RP. It just seems a little thiefish to me. Maybe I'm wrong. :shrug: