A decent chunk of people are avoiding the patch/PC users reverting it. Perhaps not that big a backstep as it would usually be seen to be.

I have zero problems with this game, I love it (Xbox 360) however i do appreciate that lots of people do have ligitimate complaints due to bugs. But posting on a forum isnt going to get you answers. Write an email to them directly and you may have more luck.

That said is it not impossible to have one singular thread for complaints and gripes (bug complaints should be in the bugs section IMHO not in the general discussion). Im tired of shifting through loads of complaints to find discussions I want to actually read.

Your average Bethesda employee dosent give a rats ass :whistling: about these forums sorry to say. Its not speculation but hard fact. Its a real shame when a company miserably fails in having the decency to talk to its paying customers, in order to aleviate their concerns regarding the new problems with the patch/game.
But nothing will ever change. All developers are pretty much the same, great at taking your money but aweful in recipricating damage control. :banghead:

Like I said, I wasn't being snarky or offensive or anything. I know it might've come across like that, but I was trying to be gracious. And yeah, sleepiness can cause errors



No. The ballistic rage-fitters are the reason the industry can get away with anything; because why would mature advlts developing and publishing games bother listening to a bunch of tantrum-throwing children? No matter what they do, they'll get flamed, so they may as well not listen at all, and just get on with what they think they should be doing.

I'm not looking down on anyone. I'm merely pointing out the flaws in peoples' arguments. And no, not a laywer. I'm a 17 year-old, year-11.

I've been stung before by stuff like this, but you can't use the example of a car, because a car manufacturer can't magically (and for no extra charge) release something which magically fixes the electronics in the car. I understand that people are annoyed, but it's going to be fixed; everybody knows that, so I don't understand the ridiculous amount of rage. Sure, it might not work for a while, but I don't understand why this is cause for emotional explosion. As I've mentioned, it happened to me with Battlefield 3, and I didn't really find it that life-changing that I had to fire up on the forums. Gaming is my hobby and I'm passionate about being a part of the community, but I often err on the side of sympathising with the developers, because I know what it's like to submit a piece of work that you think is absolutely flawless, only to have the feedback basically [censored] all over it. I feel bad for Bethesda, because it's almost as if people think they released the game with bugs intentionally so that people couldn't play. Bethesda clearly want the problems to be fixed, so I really can't understand why people act like they're a big evil group who don't want to fix anything. Even if you consider them to be totally unscrupulous, they'd at least fix the game in order to have return customers. I know that the guys at Bethesda are honourable and nice, so they'd want to fix the game in order to make people happy, and to put out a more complete product, because they're really bloody passionate about TES.

The new patch makes the game unplayable for some people and introduce bigger bugs than those which fixes. It's enough to wonder why it isn't pulled in the first place. Sh!t happens all the time, I'm not going outside Bethesda's offices with torches and forks. But they should do a course in damage control and management.

This is a flawed anology. Unlike the "fried electronics" these bugs are presumably being fixed, seeing that Bethesda is releasing patches.

Also, if you're in this thread complaining about game bugs or crashes and haven't given Bethesda a bug report with your system specs then get out.

If you understand that people are annoyed why do you attack them? There are many immature flaming people raging without being constructive but you can't put everybody in the same bag. It is the Internet after all. You also have to understand that no matter how childish and stupid somebody may sound, the fact is that he faces problems with the game and that's what makes him act like that. It's not polite but everybody is different. You also can't be certain that the problems will be fixed just because they must be.

I feel for the developers too, I consider videogames a form of digital art but no matter the intentions the final game must work as flawlessly as possible.
Unfortunately the gaming industry as a whole goes down that ugly road of releasing first and fixing later. That's why I accused you, because if you don't talk back to these practises as a consumer you are allowing them to continue doing things this way. We are at least entitled to some form of official communication don't you think? It wouldn't be nice if I sold you something that didn't work as intended and then just tweeted you that I'll look into it without any feedback for days would it?

Is it flawed because games are expected to have bugs? They shouldn't in the first place. They have bugs because we expect them to!
Presumably? That's the problem.
I rest my case!

I'm not saying we shouldn't talk back. I'm saying that people should go about it in a more polite, constructive, or at least reasonable way, instead of the annoying, incessant moaning that goes on around here. Also, I have to say, we're hardly entitled to communication. In what other industry is there the level of communication that there is here? None. We've just come to expect that we'll be able to community, but the point I've previously made is that if people interact with the developers and publishers in the ridiculous, stupid way that they have been, nobody is going to want to talk to us. The blurred line of communication between developers and the community will be erased, and it'll become like all the other industries.

I completely disagree with that!

Reasonable is good, it does also go both ways though.

The last twitter entry is "Vote for #Skyrim as the #VGA Trailer of the Year! Every vote counts! "

Now, I'll admit I'm not a PR bod, but....when that's the last post after - lets be honest - a pretty major crap up, you can't expect people to be happy about it.



People can make any anologies they wish but it does not change that, in my view, this is not being handled well at all.

I agree with him and note that it is hardly realistic to respond to customers on such a large scale in an intelligent or thoughtful manner every single time something happens (good or bad).

Any other software product? Any telecommunications product?

Also, realistically the forums aren't actually a means of communication for Bethesda. I mean, how many devs have you seen respond to someone recently? (Compared to something like the sports interactive forums where the devs and PMs post all the time)

I'm not talking about personal responses.
A couple of posts here and there talking about the game's problems and the patching process.
That's all most people ask.

Could not have said it better myself. It is impossible to bug-test an app for 100% of scenarios. That's just reality. To even attempt to do so is a folly that will lead to no release, ever. The shear number of quests alone makes bug testing all scenarios impossible. You want a 100% bug tested game? Buy Wolfenstein. Wait, HW changed, some new machines can't run it, what?

What are you talking about? There is practically zero communication here. People who come on here to "white knight" Bethesda and pull absolute nonsense like this out of their behinds are far worse than people who are unable to voice their criticisms in constructive ways. That's just my opinion, though, obviously.

You're right, but that's still a blatant straw man argument. No-one (with any sense) is saying the game should be 100% free of bugs, but bugs that force a large portion of the customer base to effect manual workarounds just to get the game working is realistically well below any reasonable quality threshold. It's also the group type of bug that would be immediately obvious within minutes of going to beta test.

This lack of communication is seriously insulting, and as a result I have put off any plans to purchase Bethesda products in the future. No more of my money for your sloppy coders.

Post limit.