There is a suggestion that has been eluding the game for some time now, and I for one think that as far as gameplay and immersion it would do wonders for the TES series.
It could have benefitted MW along with OB, but due to the size of DF it would not have mattered.

One thing that is hard to pin down in the later two games is the sense that other places exist outside the gameworld. OB with its boarders and no trade routes. MW set up on Vvanderfall, unable to cooperate outside its island structure, and influenced in slight bit by the imperials. Though in MW the imperials are hardly representative of what we saw in OB (even from just the armor).
Sure there were a few references but if felt like there was a core of a game world to exist outside of the gameplay. That is something that I have been hoping for for Skyrim, actually. An existing world that the game takes place within. A world set up so missions, quests, or goals do not become checkboxes for a 5 minute list but, like achievements, but something that you can actually aspire to on top of sold gameplay. To actually find that full suit of Daedric. And before people get up in arms about the time they have to spend on a game after a long day I will use that set of Daedric armor as an example.

It is not a hoop to jump through for gameplay, plot, imporvement, or otherwise enjoyment. It is there as a part of the world, on top of gameplay. Something that would be a real achievment. It would take you the same time as it would take me. If you want to take the time for it then do so. (and please do not compare this statement to the ongoing argument of fast-travel, though it might follow pattern)
I think in the open world and history of TES things like this are important, going beyond basic game functions into something that can be entertaining to people from whichever genre. An idea that depth is only 2 paces away and not with forced imagination.

So for the suggestion, and I will explain. Bananas. With bananas in the gameworld, either from Summerset or the Black Marsh (wherever they may grow) we can have more proof that there is a world which exists beyond whichever version of barriers we encounter in the new game. With trade routes for these bananas we can see the interaction, indirectly and probably scipted, of the different provences. In fact why not include just a few unique meshes for weapons hailing outside of Skyrim, to accentuate the loot people so often leave behind.
Ancient bananas, of great power, hidden far with no markers and just the slightest clues. Not entirely auspicious either, but subtle and tiered.

Bananas to break the monotony of whichever scene we will witness. Monotony which in time will grow in whatever game. Things that can remind you that you are existing within a game world as well as playing a game.




This is not to say bananas have been entirely absent from the games. For instance, MW had its ash yams which are similar in shape to bananas. And OB with the tomatoes, apples, and strawberries amongst others, covered the fruit category very thoroughly.

It's not like the old days of Tamriel. They have refined agricultural magic now. Bananas could be grown in Skyrim, even, if you had the right people at your disposal.

Now, postcards. That's what I want to see.

"Wish you were here at White Gold Tower!"

As jovial as it might have sounded it was not a joke.

Cobl did just that for Oblivion, importing ingrediants and books from other elder scrolls games. It'd be nice if there was a big Library in the capital of Skyrim that stocked every book from previous games and merchants stocked ingrediants from all over tamriel for alchemy purposes. Hunting trophies in the house of a nordic hunter, with heads of creatures from previous games and a stuffed Cliff-racer hanging from the ceiling.

Something like this do you?

My good man, neither was my response!

Then I did not quite get your point, would you mind expanding on it?


Indeed, but it is lost on OB for me. 360.

Fine, you got me. I was joking :sadvaultboy:

Absolutely. Enchanted bananas have been a staple of the Elder Scrolls lore since the beginning. I cannot believe we have overlooked such a timeless, essential aspect of Tamrielic culture like ancient bananas.

Bananas, eh? I see what you mean. The bananas themselves are unimportant, but the concept that the play takes place in a single province that is but one part of the greater whole of Tamriel indeed sounds like a good thing to pay attention to while developing the game. It's that magical "immersion" word that gets tossed around so often. We've already got some reminders of that... Books, obviously, as well as the presence of all the other Tamrielic races. Events in other provinces were alluded to in Oblivion by the NPCs, so I'm certain it's something that Beth is aware of. More of it, whether it's food items, clothing, paintings or weapons from other provinces (as well as the trade to reinforce the idea of its presence and scarcity) can only help. Yes, Skyrim might be all about the boar and cliff racer jerky, but I'd certainly enjoy seeing the odd banana.

I love that thread already. It started with excellent sentiments, lost me with words, and ended up in complete bananas. I'm feeling like I'm reading some manifesto from the Unseen University Librarian.

In honor of this thread, I shall immediately eat one.

Pretty much.



Terms get thrown around enough that I wanted to create an impression of what I see as the important part of TES.
Even provided an example in my little speech. The last three sections were completely allegoric and mostly superfluous. Surprise, surprise. However that is the hook that grabbed peoples attention. It was out of place, yet entirely fitting to the point.

Point being: expanded game world (culture)

OP, you are bananas! :teehee:

But, yes, having items from other provinces present in the game would have been nice. Hence the mod "Tamrielic Ingredients" for TESIV (I think it was in TESIII too?). Having shipments and imports would make sense if there were commercial shipping ventures (as in, trade) going on in Skyrim. Also, foreigners wearing foreign gear makes sense, or wealthy NPCs wearing expensive, non-native armor/weapons/clothes/etc.

EDIT: to be honest, it was all tl;dr

Good stuff! Instead of just a restaurant, it's a Hammerfell style restaurant. Maybe a holiday or two from another culture could be talked about.

At least in Skyrim I hope they have traveling/trade roads even though you can't go down them.

I remember oblivion - no roads leading off into Valenwood to trade bows or other stuff that can't be created by wood elves. Only believable place was anvil with its port and some sailors that never seem to leave.

Its just wierd how Cryodiil has no roads going off into other lands....

It felt fenced in to this degree.

I've been bringing up Fallout 3 a lot lately, but Bethesda actually captured this immersion thing pretty well in that game.

NPCs coming from or going to areas outside Washington D.C. (Ronto, The Commonwealth, Great Lanta, even The Pitt- until the DLC of course!) were referenced all over that game, and imports from other regions happened too- in Point Lookout, merchants from D.C. started stocking Punga Fruit, and by travelling to Point Lookout itself, you could see these fruit growing in their natural habitat, and take some back home. And hey, they even look a little like bananas.

Even New Vegas had roads leading out of the region, even if you couldn't head down them.

Something like that in Skyrim would be most welcome.

I would try to stick to historically preservable and therefore transportable fruits. Dates, for instance, did not grow in north west Europe, but they were brought there. I feel like having something so blatantly foreign would do more harm than good in that respect.

I think Morrowinds evidence of trade and smuggling gave it that connected feel. You were isolated on an island, but that's a natural setting for isolation. OB really should have made the borders more unique. How come we didn't see more villages that were strictly Argonian, or Khajiiti, or Hammerfellian?

Of course there is the fact that post empirical breakup, there may not be a lot of trade with other provinces. Oblivion tried to make the links with the rumours, but that's about it. "I hear the Nerevarine has moved on..." "Wonder how s\he did that - there're no roads leading out of here".

One game that really did that well, albeit with a lot of work, was GTA SA. There was one mission where you returned to Liberty City to off a guy, or whack a guy or whatever. Skyrim would really benefit from a mission like that. Imagine if you had to return to some small section of Oblivion or Morrowind to complete a quest. Maybe the mage's guild teleports you to just the mage's guild of Balmora to deliver a message. An ash storm keeps you from actually leaving town. Oh wait, all that was destroyed.... But you get my idea.

Yeah. It was so nice to meet that Camonna Tong party near the border of Morrowind, in a familiar landscape. I wish there had been more of this.

I was amused by the original tone of the op, but I *do* agree. It would be nice to have a land that's not so fenced off, varied villages, specific products... Weird and kind of irking to be able to buy just about anything, anywhere. The landscape is varied ; you can't find any alchemy ingredient anywhere : why not expand more the concept to human societies ? There's a start with the architecture, but it's barely enough. Plus that'd make some NPC conversations worth more than mudcrab talk. Eh, why not even expand on the "black horse courier" concept, and make it so that you could follow stuff happening outside of Skyrim ?

*edit* Outlaws. With crates and crates of good stuff, not boxes containing one set of poor clothing and for some reason, yarn and an onion. Make it worthwhile to track down road bandits or smugglers in remote areas !

You touched on something else that I really, really enjoyed in MW.
The caves, the named NPC's, the time when my 20+ level character wandered into a cave armed to the teeth weapon drawn, encountered the hostile cave dwellers, then on the looting and return I saw a textile set-up.

I felt like an [censored] so much that I reloaded a save and steered well clear of that cave. Those people made clothes.

I could probably pull up the cave name, but for now let me say that moment was the pinnacle of immersion and completely threw me for a loop.
I would love to see that level of detail in Skyrim.



[] also glad I could make a few people chuckle with my rant

I see, said the blind man.

About Anvil in Oblivion, taken into Skyrim in another city:

It would be great if ships arrived to the ports with exotic wares and crate full of stuff from Morrowind, black march, summerset isles. Loading of their cargo and transporting them to the waiting merchants in the cities of Skyrim.

-"What's that purple fruit you got there sea men?"
-"Ongala Bongala Bananas from Morrowind! Only ten septims each!"

It's such a shame that the majority of people won't have the knowledge if lore or geography to have the effect mean anything. While it would be great for us lore buffs (who unfortunately make up a slim minority in the elder scroll's fanbase), it would confuse and probably anger anyone who is new to the series.
"come, adventurer, these are the finest boots, straight out of the forges of Hammerfell!"
"Hammerfell? hmmm where's that?"
"It's far to the southwest, passed the mountains."
"So... I can't go there?"
"Nope."
:|
that new market, man
It's all about the money, and this isn't going to draw in anyone who wouldn't have bought the game anyway.

So here is to hoping Beth is not so capitalist to give up quality for flash. :foodndrink:

Hmmm, not sure. I got dropped totally new to the series in Morrowind, and I liked the feeling of understanding zilch. Even if I didn't know it, I could feel there was a sizeable amount of backstory (Like in meeting Barenziah. Kinda was right about it ), which I didn't know, what with being a n'wah and all. Really gave the feel of a country being discovered. Cyrodiil in comparison felt as flat and sickly sweet as an open coke.

Well, it's not just people not KNOWING the lore
it's those who aren't willing to find out

I think the plot, leveling, or glitches would be a game breaker before a few references toward external events threw off a new player for good.