I mostly really like Skyrim. I've played it quite a few hours, even started a second character. One thing I just can't get over, and kind of breaks "suspension-of-disbelief" for me, is how early in the story they introduce the dragons, and how weak they are. Many other players have complained that dragons are weaker than bears, giants, saber cats, frost trolls, etc. They're not wrong.

Now, I *totally* get that gamesas needed to introduce dragons early in the game, to setup the main story and give the player "motivation", so they don't feel like they're just kind of pointlessly playing an RPG with no main story.

But, it seems to me they could have, as they did, introduce the dragon in Whiterun, have you defeat it with the help of all those soldier (that dragon at the Western Watchtower ended up, both times I played, being mostly killed by me with only minimal assistance from the guards, and it seemed as though it died rather too easy), then have that be the last dragon you encounter for awhile. Instead, as soon as you defeat that dragon, they start spawning everywhere, and they're all basically levelled to the player. Granted, some of them can be challenging, but having my level 6 character soloing dragons, but getting mauled by bears, saber cats, the occasional tough bandit or Draugr Deathking, feels a bit cheesey.

I mean, I could see, maybe, that right after resurrection, a dragon might be weak. So, if they had you going to burial mounds and killing the dragons just after ressurection, with a character, or a book, or something setting up some lore that a dragon is considerably weakened upon resurrection, that might have been a way to let the player kill off a few dragons early in the story without breaking immersion, but as it is, it's just like "Dragons are Lame.".

This won't work if you are already playing on Master, but what I do when I fight a dragon is jack the difficulty up so they aren't so weak and lame as you say.
You really have to resist the right type of element on higher difficulties because they will kill you fast. On adept they can breath on me all day and I never feel in danger.

I don't know why so many people are disappointed that dragons aren't invincible monsters of ultimate destruction.

They went extinct, for crying out loud. Clearly they're killable. They were wiped out of Morrowind by cliffracers. And cliffracers never conquered Vivec City. Why would dragons be so much better?

The legend and end of the world threat are about Alduin. Not the entire species.

I tend to agree with the OP on this. Reminds me of the cliff racers and Oblivion gates a bit. Beth does tend to go a tad overboard when they have a cool new thing to implement. On my new character I am just completely ignoring the MQ and no dragons are spawning, and it pretty great. I will wait to level 50 or so to start the MQ, and things will make a lot more sense then!

I agree with the OP. Dragons are a nuisance at best, and don't pose much of a threat. I would have preferred fewer dragons who were tough to beat. Instead, we're given dragons who could be beaten by a frost wolf just to support the mechanic of absorbing souls to get dragon words.

Tale, if dragons can be beaten by sabrecats, then their return isn't any more of a threat than a couple of big litters of kittens.

If the guards and soldiers can keep the realm safe from cave bears, they can also keep the realm safe from puny dragons.

You could re-roll.

I didn't touch the main quest till lvl 30+ by which time the Dragons were a welcome addition. Either that or wait on balance mods.

The return of dragons isn't a threat. It's Alduin's return. As I said. And he can't be beaten by sabrecats.

Firstly 'wiped out' or driven out? The latter and the former are not synonymous.

Secondly, the way the story of the dragon war is presented, humans were getting absolutely devastated and were largely unable to kill dragons until they learned the Thu'um from Parthuurnax. They were clearly not so killable to humans. Only the MQ dragons excluding Alduin should be levelled. All others should be static in their level and damn hard to beat.

Wiped out.

This is entirely because

IMHO, the real problem lies in other creatures scaling. Dragons on master level are tough and, as you level up, higher level dragons are even tougher...fought my first Elder Dragon 2 days ago and it was VERY hard even if I had 3 guards assisting me.
Some creatures like bears, sabrecats and GUARDS are wrong, not dragons...a bear is not leveled so it can kill basic dragons if you start the mq early. Guards level with you in a totally stupid manner so they end with A GAZILLION hp and can easily withstand 2-3 Elder Dragon breaths, while you get killed by only ONE.

Anyway, Dragons need some tweaks regarding hp, damage resistance and shouts known...I'm planning a mod for when the kit comes out

Sources please.

I have little knowledge of the former, but the latter; I have yet to come across any information to that effect in-game. The only humans I've heard of killing dragons independent of learning the Thu'um are the Blades, due to their Akaviri heritage.

You might as well have listed the source yourself. The Blades aren't even known for possessing Thu'um. They never needed it to kill dragons.

The rest is present in the game.

Basically the strength of dragons kinda goes up exponentially, then after awhile drops off again due to unholy amounts of damage the character can do in endgame.

I think the strength of the dragons should be static, to give that element of fear that your character is about to be destroyed, instead of "walking along road, hear roar, think lol ok, slash slash slash, absorb, walking along the road".

But there are plenty of other ways to calculate things like this, though im not in the mood to give everyone a maths lesson. bliviongate:

I don't know much, i played up to level 40 on my mage, and when i found my first elder dragon he did a pretty good job roasting me... he didn't semm weak at all and i had lots of destruction cast reducers on my armor plus stagger perk, and he was still annoying.

Dragon's are supposed to be a pervasive threat in the world, which means they have to be around and beatable for you. Now on master difficulty dragons tore my ass up at early levels. Crank the difficulty up if you want to be appropriately menaced by dragons early on.

While you're low level dragon's are comparably weak, though, which probably wasn't the best idea. Static level NPC's tend to tear them up until you get to a decent enough level to get the game spawning some powerful dragons.

The Blades were always Akaviri warriors, a small group of people who have learned how to deal with dragons, because IIRC Akavir was where they came from.

They are the only humans shown as being capable of killing dragons before the Thu'um. A small specialist group of humans does not equate to humans as a whole being able to kill dragons. That sir, is a fallacy of composition.

In fact, now I think about it, it may have even been Esbern who tells you that humans were basically being slaughtered before they learned the Thu'um.

I like to consider them as dragonlings or drakes to get that feeling. Wish Beth implemented a scaled maturity system for dragons while they differed in size and *actual* dragons grew larger and powerful as you leveled up. Atm it looks like same dragon with same skin of 2 or 3 different colours? Only Alduin and the dude on top of the mountain are distinguisable if you investigate closely.

I suppose because you are the Dragonborn you have an advantage in a fight against dragons. That's how I rationalise it anyway!

But sometimes it feels pretty silly. Like as a mighty dragon-slayer with 14 dragons under my belt I meet some npc in the sewers of Riften who kills me with just two bare-fist punches!

No offense to the OP, but who the heck wants to play a dragonless Elder Scrolls game

I love how often they are in the game. I am at the 50 hour mark, and saw my first two dragons that were more unique: one labeled elder dragon; one with actual name - they were tougher

I disagree OP, although I have NEVER fought a Dragon on anything other than Master difficulty...

I'm level 11 and have played every TES/ Fallout game and an absolute ton of other RPG's so I know how they work...but aside from the Dragon in the Whiterun area, I have yet to kill a single Dragon...I refuse to use companions as it feels kinda cheap at times but on Master difficulty, the Dragons are powerful enough.

Have you played until you reached the more advanced dragons? It's true, I can beat a regular dragon with barely any effort, but those Ancient Dragons.. oh man. They aren't so easy...

Ancient Dragons Own you unless you use Become Ethereal every single time they spit fire.

Sorry no Tale is right from everything they said in the game. If you need to have cited source I will site, the game main quest. So go do that.

The Thum did not make it so regular dragons could be killed. It was made to weaken Alduin and it helped fight the other dragons. Could they have really rebelled in the past back then? Considering Alduin could just ressurect the fallen dragons?



Your arguments to Tale are wrong, if I need to go replay the main story with a new char and Fraps every line of the lore I guess I will.

Edit: Did you note when you fight the first dragon and later on regular people can hurt dragons? The blades were regular people with training. And the Thum Dragon Rend came before the blades...

I unlocked the dragons well into the lvl 30s. On master, the first one was a beast to nail down, and still dragons are still those that put up the hardest fight. Now on lvl 51, ancient dragons still get me with a single blow (excuse the pun ) while I laugh at sabre cats.

The problem with unscalable random dragons is that they could potentially lock the game up for you, where you are not able to get anywhere or do anything about them. Usually, if there is a dragon in the area, it's just a matter of time before he engages you. With all other enemies I've faced that were too tough to handle, I've always been able to reload and choose a different path in order to stay clear of them.

I didn't say that humans as a whole were incapable of hurting dragons, I noted myself that the blades, who were specialists, are able to kill them, but the MQ tells us that the dragons were absolutely slaughtering humans and mentions nothing of Alduin constantly resurrecting his killed bretheren during the war IIRC.

so go ahead, record the source and post it here..