For some time now there has been a horrid confusion in the lore community. As a result, there has been an unnecessary amount of vitriol (and other things that monkeys are known to throw) flung in the direction of the Elder Scrolls Online developers. It is well known by all that the heartland of Tamriel, Cyrodiil, was once a vast jungle. Such information can be gleaned from numerous NPC's as well as a rather unequivocal account in the Provinces of Tamriel:

And the Pocket Guide to the Empire: First Edition:


With these two clear accounts in hand and with the knowledge that no author could possibly mistake the climate of his home province, which is right outside his window, people were shocked and horrified when the developers of the Elder Scrolls Online claimed:


"What nonsense!!!" The community cried. How could an Imperials mistake the climate of their own province!?? Errors by Imperial scholars are well documented (such as the laughable claim that the Hist are a strain of Argonian) but an error such as this is beyond the realm of possibility.

Moreover, we already have a much better explanation:


Tiber Septim used the power of CHIM to reshape the land into a climate more favored by his people. This explanation was confirmed twice by in-game texts. First, the Mythic Dawn Commentaries:


Next, by the prophet Heimskr in Skyrim:


So why would the developers abandon this perfectly good explanation in favor of a unbelievable and boring one? This is where the confusion began. The "transcription error" is not in the Pocket Guide nor is it in the Provinces of Tamriel. The transcription error was on an Elder Scroll.

Elder Scrolls contain all knowledge of how things are, how they were, and how they will be. Yet, what is written can be changed. The future is not set in stone. Nor, it would appear, is the past. Talos Stormcrown, master of the Mundus, saw the transcription error on the Elder Scroll. "Cyrodiil is an endless jungle'....this cannot be," said Tiber. Using his mighty pink metaphysical-eraser and his powerful elder-pencil, Talos re-wrote the Elder Scroll. This change occurred past, present, and future. The famous line about 'breathing in royalty' of course refers to Talos blowing away his eraser shavings.

So you see, its was all a big misunderstanding. There is nothing to be upset about. All is as it should be.


PS:

There is apparently some fool scholar claiming that the transcription error was indeed on the Pocket Guide:


This fool, of course, should be ignored. His ramblings are merely an example of the frailty of the human mind. A person of such low intelligence cannot possibly be expected to comprehend the power and significance of the Elder Scrolls.

I was already thinking that TalOS could have CHIM'd away the jungles so hard that he erased them in the past, but I think Cyrod-as-Jungle would just be more interesting to explore.

If they had actually been erased in the past, wouldn't no one know that the jungle ever existed?

Which explains the scholar's ignorance.

Also worth mentioning that the jills are never perfect. Note that the Warp in the West and Red Mountain have many conflicting accounts.

Where did you find this quote? Tell me they didn't actually publish this somewhere, please!

Sadly they did:
http://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/137/~/is-cyrodiil-a-jungle%3F

Why did they even feel the need to do anything about this? They just retconned something that didn't need retconning.

And here I was thinking it was only a Twitter thing.

My favorite part is how, even disregarding everything else that's wrong with this, they've still managed to [censored] things up for themselves.

Translating "Jungle" to "Uplands" is completely nonsensical, since Cyrodiil is a massive bowl with the Great Forest, Heartland, and Nibenay Basin (the parts that were originally tropical) at lower elevations in the interior. That's current lore, from Oblivion's own landscape. Unless there's some obscure definition of "uplands" that in fact means "lowlands", I see no way for that quote to make a damn lick of sense.

Maybe Phrastus is unaware of the changes Tiber Septim made? Is it general knowledge that Tiber Septim changed the environment? I know it's a reach, but explaining away things seems to be a TES lore tradition.

Unaware and probably incapable of comprehending them. Man's a fool if you ask me.

This is just the result of "streamlining" for mass appeal. If you thought it was a bad trend before, just wait until you see what the MMO guys are going to do. Their entire careers have been built around streamlining IPs in order to make them successful as an MMO. To them, "lore" is that stuff that makes their game too "nerdy" to be a financial success.

I think you missed the point. I wasn't complaining. I was trying to offer an alternative.

Oh brother.

Softening the blow, eh?

I really hope that Bethesda just keeps TESO non-canon.

One of my favorite lines from Oblivion: "I don't know you. And I don't want to know you."

Sums up my feelings about TESO. I really wish people would tag threads on here so I wouldn't open them up expecting to read real lore stuff and it's about the silly MMO.

The word transcription error in the title wasn't good enough for you?

And like it or not, this stuff is going to be considered canon. I see no reason to think that is a bad thing and I think people like yourself are writing them off too quickly.

This thread is about lore. Its about TESO lore which is part of the Elder Scrolls Series. It isn't about MMO game play or some such.

So TES:O lore is going to be canon? What?!

I've only been reading lore and learning about Tiber CHIM'ing away the Cyrodiilic jungle for a few months and it bothers me. I'd hate to see the reactions of people who've been reading this stuff for years.

That bit is still fine. Just because some moron scholar in TESO says it was a transcription error on the PGE doesn't mean it was. The true transcription error was on the Elder Scroll but Tiber took care of that for us.

This is how I'm interpreting this, please correct me if I'm wrong:
In PGE and a couple other sources, they wrote down that there was a jungle/rainforest in Cyrodiil. Tiber CHIM'd this jungle away for the red legion, because he loved them. Now rolling around to TES:O, which takes place before Tiber was born. A scholar in TES:O says it's a transcription error in PGE, ect. and there was no jungle to begin with, meaning Tiber CHIM'd it from the past too, right? Or if there was no jungle to begin with, which makes sense with the transcription error, then what did Tiber CHIM away?

I'm so lost ._.

And while the CoC was busy stealing an Elder Scroll the Grey Fox had sent another Thieves Guild member to steal the other artifact required to remove Nocturnals curse: Tiber Septims eraser.

I think it's a case of two timelines existing in the same space thanks to the jills, like how some people can still remember Vivec as a mortal while others will insist he was always a god.

No, I didn't know what it was about til I read the OP.

I'm ignoring TESO, because everything that I have seen or heard of it is just as silly, uninteresting and illogical as I'd have expected. You can say that their stuff will be canon and we should just accept it, but that's far from a settled question.

S'all in the OP brotha.

But ya, basically. It used to be a jungle. Tiber changed it past, present, and future by CHIM and fiddling with an Elder Scroll. He decided that Cyrodiil as jungle was a transcription error from the Universe and changed it because he can do that.