In Morrowind, as I'm sure you're all aware, you had the option to join the Tribunal Temple-- and not just join it, but become a major figure in it. Then you do the Tribunal main quest, and surprise! Two of your major deities are dead. I thought it was aggravating that my options in Tribunal were being a loyal servant of the Empire, or being Almalexia's stooge. So, this mod will aim to change that.

The majority of the Tribunal questline remains the same- with one exception: when you arrive in the Clockwork city, Sotha Sil is still alive. I won't ruin my questline, but I think it should more or less make sense according to the lore, and create a more satisfying ending for those of us who did do the Temple questline.

Myhttp://s203.photobucket.com/albums/aa289/spaceinvader91/?action=view¤t=surprise.jpg, which some of you may or may not have seen last night, uses Oshiel's Animation Replacer and Oriphier's Sotha Sil armor, as well as a mask that I created using the resources in Masks of the Gods. There is some distortion and clipping, obviously, and some of the combat animations look a little ridiculous, but you're not supposed to fight him- if you want him dead, play the original quest

Expect progress on this to be relatively slow. I'm trying to figure out scripting, which has been a bit of an ordeal. This mod may not be pretty when all's said and done, but with any luck it will work

iirc Vivec could still be alive. You don't have to

Princess Stomper was working on a mod where you do not give the Barilzar's ring to Almalexia but iirc, she didn't want to expand this idea so much and I don't know how far this idea went.
Then I proposed Almalexia could attack him, and the only way the Pc would have to survive, is to wear the Mazed Band and be teleported to the CLockwork City, and meet Sotha Sil alive,
Anyway, a mod where Sotha Sil is still alive, is something I wanted to see, so consider me recruited

Also, I could try to create a new animation for Sotha Sil, and it would be nice if someone could make a robotic voice for him. There are around some programs that can produce spoken voices, and maybe someone can use them.

Let me know how you wish to proceed and your idea more in detail.

always a sad moment finding sotha sil in that shape he?s in orginally.
if you can fix that it would be a nice thing

Spoilers from my quest to follow: Maybe you all can help me perfect it.



Antares- I'd be thrilled if you wanted to give him new animations. At the very least, maybe you could take a look at the version I've cobbled together and reduce the mesh distortions/clipping somewhat? I'll PM you the link if you're interested.

sure. I imagine he moves as a robot. Or, perhaps, he could be similar to how he is in Tribunal, I mean linked to the machines that he is part of. THe only difference is that he can move, attack etc...


ABout the plot, I understand, you want to preserve all the Tribunal and keep it alive. I agree, but the final boss should be something more than a dunmer. Perhaps another evil god?
It is the final fight of Tribunal, after all, and I would expect none less than a god at the very end, like in the other main quests (Hircine and Dagoth Ur).

Ooh, computer generate the voice and then auto tune it!

I have Vista, so the only computer generated voice I have is Microsoft Anna. I don't think anyone wants Sotha Sil to be a soft-spoken woman

It would be fantastic to see something like this realized one day.

I'm concerned about one thing - if you pay attention, you pretty much know all along that Almalexia is... not quite herself anymore. I mean it was her who ordered the Nerevarine to release ash storms on Mournhold, and I think a couple of other things are also strongly suggesting that she's actually the one that's gone mad.

I think it would be kind of lame to just say "ah whatever, it actually wasn't like that, Almalexia is alright and her motives were very noble".
How about this - instead of changing the end, why not expanding it? There could be a bunch of new quests coming from Sotha Sil. After all, he's the one who supposedly changes the world from within his Clockwork City. Personally, I loved his role in the 2920 series - especially the very last scene where he watches one of his devices and notices that something has changed, and will never be the same again. He could get the role of a silent observer of what had been going on - noticing that Almalexia's behavior had changed lately, and trying to figure out why.
And that's where you'd come in.

Just... that's something I'd like to play. I wouldn't just throw in the King of Worms and some new Dunmer character. Expand upon the characters we've met during Tribunal.
Example. I can't quite remember all the details of Tribunal's main quest, but I still know that King Helseth always tried to keep the Temple in check. Maybe he could be the man behind Almalexia's madness? Just think of "A Game at Dinner" (in-game book), where you really didn't know what he was up to until the very end. In Tribunal, he tried to kill you on several occasions, but that doesn't mean he wasn't already using you against Almalexia. Or was maybe using somebody else against Almalexia. He could have poisoned her in one way or another in order to drive her mad and destroy the Temple by destroying the image of the Gods, or by getting them to kill each other. (He could have also made a pact with Sheogorath to drive Almalexia insane or something like that, but I don't know whether that would contradict lore somehow.)

In the end, though, he couldn't be the one held responsible for all that, since he's still the King of Morrowind in Oblivion. However, the player could help Sotha Sil and Almalexia (after curing Almalexia of her madness) to finally win the struggle for power with the Royal court, and defeat Helseth by making him not only a puppet of the Empire, but now also a puppet of the Tribunal.

That'd probably a very stealthy and diplomatic ending of the main quest, but I'd really enjoy that, especially after all the dungeon delving of the add-on.



Okay so those are basically all my thoughts concerning this subject. You may pick and choose what you like. Maybe prolonging the main quest isn't a good idea after all, but I'd really prefer having Helseth or some other important character as the villain, and not simply throw in some random TES villain (I'm sure there'd be a funny tvtrops link for that kind of storytelling).

Well, Mannimarco wouldn't just be "thrown in." In the Shrine of the Dead quest, you have to purify the shrine of liches and undead who have taken it over. That's what gave me the initial idea. There are already undead arguably working to undermine the Temple in Mournhold, I've just added a motive If you're curious about who the new character is, you can read about her http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Morgiah She's not a "new" character, just new to the expansion. She has done deals with Mannimarco in the past, no reason why she couldn't do so again. And I think she fits with Tribunal.

In regards to the Almalexia thing, yes, it is hinted that she isn't quite right, but that doesn't mean murderous. She is fiercely protective of her status in Mournhold, and is willing to go to great lengths to those who would threaten her, but that doesn't necessarily make her a murderer. Don't worry, I'm fairly confident in my writing abilities and knowledge of the lore, it will all make sense in the end

EDIT: Also, in regards to references to Helseth in Oblivion, I honestly don't care about that. This whole mod goes against the lore as established by Oblivion. I'm not making an Oblivion mod, so I don't feel like it's incredibly crucial to make sure that the story works with Oblivion

I knew I should've avoided mentioning Oblivion
Maybe I should've said "It's canon that Helseth stays the King of Morrowind for some more years". You can of course still overthrow things like that in a mod, but if there are alternatives, it's always good to consider them.

About Morgiah... shouldn't she be on the other side of Tamriel? I also think that - especially after Oblivion - it gets kind of boring to always have dungeons full of undead as a sign that the King of Worms is around.
But maybe that's really just me. And it's your mod and everything, you asked for creative feedback and I gave you everything that came to my mind, I don't intend to convince you of it now.

And it seems as if you've already got a story figured out. The appearance of Morgiah will surely be interesting. I'm excited to see what you'll come up with.

(Ah, one thing about Almalexia: Of course, I can only look at the story now in retrospective and am therefore biased and all, but I think the plot really has you witness the decline of her sanity step after step, with the killing of Sotha Sil being the shocking, yet consequent finale. I think this downfall of hers should definitely be explained or used in the story, not just ignored by saying "she's just very determined".)

Believe me, I'm working on it. All will be explained in time...

I like this idea, but I'm not up to date on all the lore. You got me thinking, though, about how the sewers underneath the city are basically a huge labyrinth of evil so I could see some character (presumably part of the royal family) getting lost in the sewer and becoming some sort of evil sorcerer adept. Then being so conveniently under the temple he/she sends madness and greed (maybe? like that one quest with the lady with the machines that shock you and how she went insane) up into the chamber. And perhaps the same with Helseth, with greed and anger. But again I'm not an expert on lore so feel free to completely disregard this post

An ending that involves the survival of all three Tribunal members?! YESH!!

I'm definitely looking forward to this mod.

here is an example of the voice I made.

Tell me what you think.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYnjmys_pAg

Ooh, I like It's very robotic

I think it's a bit TOO robotic, If you've already decided then It's fine, but maybe make it a little bit more human.

Excellent! The lack of choices and consequences in Tribunal hasn't really been tackled by modders yet.

I appreciate that you don't want to spoil the story, but... I think the Tribunal main quest should be at least slightly different depending on whether you've destroyed the Heart or not. Integration between MW, Tribunal and Bloodmoon is lacking.

If you could make a patch for Great House Dagoth integration, I'd be delighted. That mod gives the player more choices for the Vvardenfell main quest, although I felt that NPCs should have more dialogue for the aftemath of the mod's events.

Argh, right now progress on this is not happening. I can't wrap my head around the script to make the big bad appear. Without that, it doesn't matter what dialogue exists I'm going to keep plugging away at it for a few days and try to get it in some sort of working order, otherwise I'll ask you all for help.

EDIT: O.o Wow, logged into the wrong account.

Well good luck with the scripting. I don't think the voice is too robotic, but it could stand to be a little lower, or perhaps a little slower? But really, anything at all would be fantastic. *chuckle*

I appreciate the idea of Morgiah being a baddie, but like Fearabbit said, I feel that to make Almalexia NOT be a baddie, you'd have to change her behavior throughout. The way things are, it's pretty obvious that she's crazy and power-hungry, and it just doesn't make sense to, in the end, say "Oh, she's fine after all, nothing wrong there." Unless she was driven mad by a third party or something, which would have to be made clear in the end.

I like having the Tribunal survive, I just wish they had more involvement in this new storyline. I've always wanted to see Sotha Sil's magical abilities...any way you could bring in at least a scripted fight between him and a baddie?

I think having Morgiah involved is interesting, but she's still just a dunmer, even if she might be powerful. What about having the King of Worms himself show up along with her, and the pc and Sotha would team up to fight them off? That would be epic. (I do think it's a bit of a stretch to think that Morgiah is a combat-type baddie...before she just seemed manipulative, but she didn't seem exactly like a martial character, so it feels weird to me to have her fight anyone in combat)

Whatever happens, I really do want Tribunal to be ABOUT the Tribunal, and Morgiah to have legitimate reasons for doing what she did. I really hope the Tribunal aren't just pawns...they're too powerful for that, even for the King of Worms.

Remember to make sure Sotha Sil has no legs. They were cut off in Ald Sotha by Vivec in order to save him, replaced by wire, and he supposedly uses levitation to move. Try to make his dialogue cryptic and mysterious as it usually is in the lore when he talks. Just some suggestions to help make it more lore correct.

http://s203.photobucket.com/albums/aa289/spaceinvader91/?action=view¤t=surprise.jpg

Sotha Sil is a chimer wizard, a humanoid. He was not constructed or something, despite his appearance. I disagree on this idea, he should have normal voice.