Ok...I started playing FO2 a few weeks ago (haven't kept up since I haven't had time, and children freak out when they see things on the computer) and I am constantly getting my butt handed to me by freaking Brahmin! COWS! I had to stop playing FO1 because I kept dying and it was irritating me. I see a Mr. Handy while I'm trying to figure out how to get to the Den in FO2 and 2 hits and I'm robochow. Are there like tips for not svcking so much? :sadvaultboy:

How are you losing to cows? You shoot them in the head, they have like 20 health. What're your skills, what's your SPECIAL?

QFT.

Whats your character build? What weapon are you using? Did you do all the quests in Arroyo so you could level up before setting out into the wasteland?

Plus it's not FO3 don't get shooting everything! It's best to take a much more defensive approch in the beginning few levels.

Or flee, I had to run a lot at the beginning, then I got to New Reno and did everything there, then I headed over to Vault City and stole from everybody, then my unarmed skill was high enough for me to kill a raider with two punchs to the head.

S 6
P 4
E 6
C 7
I 9
A 5
L 3
I tagged Doctor Science and Speech and the Brahmin cornered me! I couldn't move!!! And no, I didn't do all of the Arroyo quests, I wanted to talk to real human beings. I have Sulik now...but I don't know what to do with him and I don't use guns...yet, just got one. How do I get to the Den from Klamath?

I'm gonna watch this topic, I still can't get hooked on FO1 or 2, despite how much I want to. :sadvaultboy:

Den should be on your map if you talked to enough people in Klamath. As you go to each new city try and find more people to mark new destinations on your map.

Give Sulik a sledge. Oh and holding shift should highlight items on the ground.

I thought it got more fun in the end when you just slaughtered everything, Fallout 1 at least. No Super-Mutants could seem to stop a turbo plasma rifle and hardened power armor.

There's your problem right there. Bad choice of tag skills - your character is terrible at combat, and you expect to win?

Reroll, tag either Small Guns, Melee or Unarmed.

Indeed.

...I don't expect to win, I expect to impress peoples wiff mah fancy booked learning XD

I'm playing it just like I play FO3 and FNV...should I not play it the same? I don't personally enjoy combat.

The game can be completed that way. Just rely on your companions to kill things.

I did a playthrough like that and it went smoothly if I gave all my friends the best guns. Then again I have beaten it 6-8 times before that.

No, you should not play it the same.

Playing a non-combat character is admirable, but to have no combat skills at all to finnish the game would take someone who has played the game before and knows it inside out. If your character has very poor combat skills, you must avoid combat at all times - your character simply doesn't have the skill to hit that side of a barn. Do not willingly enter combat, and run for the exit grid in any encounter.

For a "Normal" runthrough, at least one of the early combat skills tagged is a must (Small Guns, Melee, Unarmed) - and I'd throw a lot of those skillpoints you gain in early levels straight into it - it is without a doubt the most important skill you'll have and will keep you alive.

I'd drop Science as a skill - there are only a handful of places where this is useful, and around 70% skill is enough - hacking is a very rare thing in Fo2, and Science is only used once that I can think of in FO1.

cool, I'll just make a new chick Thanks...talked to everybody I could...still can't get a map to the Den...figured out I had to get Jenny...but the dialogue option doesn't come up...she says she doesn't remember or something. I'll try harder.

Agreed. There are rewards for having a super high science skill, 130% I believe can get you a pretty good companion provided you do all the missions that get you access to them. And a Science skill of around 170% will allow you access to an uninteresting easter egg hidden at the end of the game. If you want to raise it that high then tag it and pump it from the get go, otherwise just raise it with books.

The key to combat in Fallouts 1&2 can be summed up in two words: Hit and Run. In that order. Hit something then run away, let whatever it is waste its action points getting to you and then hit it again. It works better the more action points you have, meaning you want a higher Agility. Strength is not too important in Fallout 2, so you shouldn't need more than 5 at the start, if you are really not interested in combat I'd take it down to 4. Also if you are avoiding combat then you won't need a ton of hit points so you can also take Endurance down to 4 as well, if your brave take it down to 2. Then use your extra points and pump up Agility and Luck.

What Traits did you pick? I'd suggest getting Gifted and Good Natured then setting up your character like:

S - 4
P - 8
E - 4
C - 8
I - 9
A - 9
L - 5

For Tag Skills Speech is a great choice, Doctor is better than First Aid (first aid can be raised with books) and they both give you XP for using them. Lock Pick is also very useful. And as others have said, tagging at least one combat skill will make your life much easier.


For a non-combat character you might want to go back to Fallout 1, you can actually reason your way through that one.

And I still don't get the map from Jenny. I didn't know I had to like...think about my character this much. :brokencomputer:

I'll have a go at this...

(But I'm not sure exactly what you want to know... Tip for combat, or to not hate TB combat?)

Tips:

• Everything in the game has APs, and APs govern movement as well as attacks, and even item use (usually stims or reloading weapons). APs in Fallout 1 & 2 directly equate to time management; What can your PC do in a few seconds. More APs reflect better mobility, and the use of less APs (via perks) reflects better speed & efficiency. So the first tip is see what your opponent can do in the first round ~watch carefully. If they are a melee fighter, they have to expend APs to close distance with you in order to strike. Something as simple as taking two steps back at the end of your turn, might keep them from being able to attack you twice per turn.
  
• APs unused imply readiness, an directly add to your armorclass at the end of a turn. If you do nothing at all and just end your turn your AC goes up, equal to your [unspent] APs. This can actually make it difficult for some enemies to score a hit... If you have NPCs in the fight, you can play defensive, and let the NPC's finish off your attacker for you. This is not generally the best plan, but it has its uses sometimes.
  
• This may seem obvious, but the closer you are to the target, the easier it is to hit them (or for them to hit you) with range weapons. It really does reduce their chances if you step back from them, and stepping behind their allies forces them to shoot past friends if they want to hit you, and they do occasionally hit their friends instead.
  
• I have actually dropped live bombs while running from melee fighters and had them end their turn near the bomb, and get blasted.
  One critical effect option is to knock out the opponent; when this happens, you can kick them when they are down... but...
  I find that it is usually better to steal their ammo while they are knocked out...(Especially if it works in your own gun. Its even possible to unload their gun and let them try to shoot you on an empty clip, Or you can steal any knives or stims, or grenades. When they wake up, they can only fight with fists).

Liking Turn Based, (or at least an understanding/ or different interpretation of it).
Consider this strictly my opinion based on experience with the game (as it plays), rather than based on any 1st hand developer info ~(which I don't have). Its quite possible that an original developer might disagree, or perhaps think it a novel way of looking at it:
What is fact, is that Fallout started as a licensed http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/Fallout_GURPS-2.jpg. It was intended to be the best GURPS available on PC. They lost the license due to Steve Jackson's not wishing association with such a violent game. (http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/GURPS)

---

So... Imagine a bank robbery. Six guys storm a bank with 17 people in it. Imagine that the security cameras record the whole thing from several angles.
Now imagine you are a police captain reviewing the videos ~after the fact, trying to see how they got away with it, when 8 of the customers were armed cops.

Turn based combat (in Fallout, and Jagged Alliance, and many others) is all about simultaneity, and the perception there of. When combat starts, time suddenly matters, and the game splits the seconds apart to give the player a full understanding of everything that occurs in those split seconds. If you were to see the battle as as the PC or a raider, it would all happen smoothly without splits or pauses. Pauses are strictly for the player to be able to digest all they have access to, and make a decision ~the NPCs don't pause, and they would perceive the PC's actions as happening alongside their own. Its not perfect.

Consider the captain as having a view of the robbery like the player has a view of combat. He can see exactly when his officer drew his weapon and charged at a robber; He can also pause the video and say, "but if he only shot this guy first, before that guy, things could have been different". He can also see when one robber dropped his clips while reloading, and say, "that was their chance, if they had shot him then, it could have been over". Its similar in Fallout's combat except that its as if the captain were watching it live, and yet with the same insight, and in this case with the ability to control one of the police officers in the bank.

The combat mini-game in Fallout (that's basically what it is) plays out like an interactive "what if" ~ "us verses them" style encounter, where the player gets to see it all, and control their one PC amidst the fray, and hopefully (through careful choice, and gambles) they can turn the tide, and walk out alive (preferably with live NPCs). They get choose from all of the PC's possible actions in the time remaining. This does not mean just pick a guy and shoot.

Players can forgo any attack to reposition their PC somewhere else (more advantageous). They can choose to administer a stimpack or drug to an ailing ally during the fight; (Quite often I will position the PC near Dogmeat, for just that reason). The PC can switch weapons (like changing from the rocket launcher to the combat shotgun, when surrounded by melee fighters). Inventory access takes time, so it costs APs; While you are in your pockets, the opponents are in mid-action themselves, and you likely won't get a shot off before they act.

If you notice.. .The combats have more opponents in FO2 than 3. An encounter might be four or five to 1 (2, or 3) ~or it could even 12 to 1. In a realtime game, all the opponents would open up with their guns and (likely) all shoot the at PC at once. There is definitely a minigame aspect to TB combat, but it eliminates player's time spent in the menu, and allows time to think about one's actions, and not just impulsively shoot the gun. Fallout 2 had several HTH attacks (with differing costs in APs), a player faced with a realtime swarm would never have the freedom to decide a better action, they would just mash the button for whatever attack was selected.

That's a strength in TB combat. RT games typically resort to combo attacks and hot-keys, as there is no time to decide from among many options :shrug:.

---

A good example of many options is the game Toribash. Its a sort-of turn based beat'em-up (like Streetfighter, but not), its even multiplayer, but the player [again] gets split apart seconds to very literally decide the best move from many, many, many options (you have full control of every joint in the fighter's body); and like with Fallout, the combat is considered simultaneous; Unlike Fallout, it lets you see the entire fight in realtime after it ends.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVZN0LRIN9w

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHqB6lEE3Tg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuTVBDezEXE

Wow. Thank you Gizmo! That was amazing :shocked:

Ok...so give Sulik my awesome weapons and run. Can do! In the meantime I'll try to make a new character with more attention to AP, I thought that VATS was a separate thing from actual combat, that's what I get for playing FO3 and FNV before the originals.