Two Nuclear Detonations

Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 6:21 pm

EDIT: closer inspection actually reveals a third detonation, which I have detailed in http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1526246-the-glowing-sea thread.
In the trailer, we see two https://youtu.be/GE2BkLqMef4?t=1m6s missing from the crib during the post-war shot inside the house. I believe that this is highly significant, as it would suggest that there were actually two nuclear detonations in the Greater Boston Area, and not just one.
If there were in fact two detonations, the most likely targets would have been military. The two most obvious military targets in this area are https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Hanscom+AFB,+MA,+USA/@42.4579544,-71.2795356,9590m/data=http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1526198-two-nuclear-detonations/!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x89e39954e1a07787:0xa78914159fad3330 and https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@42.3727175,-71.0531491,9603m/data=!3m1!1e3. Lets assume that both nukes missed their intended targets due to long-range inaccuracies and a relatively low yield. Instead, the first one hits https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@42.4288801,-71.3163945,9595m/data=!3m1!1e3, and the second one hits https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Prospect+Hill,+Somerville,+MA,+USA/@42.3835755,-71.095343,4801m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x89e370cc9331544f:0x92cd86c6ff3ab428.
The Lincoln blast is the one we can see from above Vault 111, which is located inside the https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Minute+Man+National+Historical+Park+-+North+Bridge/@42.4693009,-71.3503406,1199m/data=http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1526198-two-nuclear-detonations/!3m1!1e3!4m3!3m2!1s0x89e39be8e710f8a5:0x70924b001f6c7b2f!4b1. The vault is located near to Liberty Street, just South-West of the red marker. This park would also appear to be the real world location of Sanctuary Hills (the vault can actually be seen immediately above and behind Sanctuary Hills at https://youtu.be/D5esyZPt5Jo?t=24m34s in the E3 demo). Note that Sanctuary Hills is located along the lower half of Old North Bridge just South of the marker (running NE to SW). The Old North Bridge has been moved lower down along the river where we can see the words "Old N Bridge" and is now facing South-East instead of East, as per the E3 demo. Also, the Minute Man Monument, as shown at https://youtu.be/D5esyZPt5Jo?t=12m6s is now on the other side of the river just past the new location of the bridge. All of these locations can be verified by careful study of the footage.
EDIT: the bridge we see is actually more likely to be the one running South-East on Monument Street, and the Monument itself would be moved to the far end of this bridge across the river. This would also require moving the vault, which would need to be built at the top of a hill. A perfect location for this would be just west of Monument Street on Cedar Way, where we can see a large circular driveway. This actually looks strikingly similar to the top area of vault 111, and it also fits in with the camera angles we see from the top of the vault. As a final note, Sanctuary Hills would need to have been built in the open area just East of Monument Way.
If all of this information is correct, then the distance from the vault to ground zero would be around 6.8 km, or 4.3 miles. This would allow around 20 seconds for the blast wave to hit on a 1:1 scale. Lincoln is due South-East of the location I have shown for vault 111, which is consistent with the shadows cast above the vault at 9:47am on 23rd October 2077, as seen http://suncalc.net/#/42.4696,-71.3538,12/2077.10.23/14:47 (note that the impact point would be slightly to the left of the dark orange line. Also, the time as shown on the site is GMT and is therefore 5 hours ahead of Boston). This distance would be far enough to leave Concord relatively undamaged as seen in the showcase, whilst still proving potentially deadly for those standing above the vault. Finally, the town of Lincoln has a very obvious connection with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Revere, as well as an implied connection to both https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Lincoln and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Lincoln Lincoln.
The crater from the second blast can be seen in the showcase demo at https://youtu.be/D5esyZPt5Jo?t=4m45s, near the top right corner of the image. Note the http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-o/01/c5/27/db/a-view-from-the-water.jpg in the lower left of the image, as well as several other easily identifiable landmarks. If we look at the centre of the crater, we can see that it would in fact be in the area of Prospect Hill as shown above. Prospect Hill is also highly significant to the http://www.muldermedia.com/prospecthill/history.html, due to the part it played in the events leading up to the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Boston on April 19th 1775.
Thanks to PCDug and RedwoodLynx for providing additional location details.
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Nikki Lawrence
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:29 pm

Interesting.....and all from a baby mobile lol. I like it!
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Yung Prince
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:34 pm

The question we now need to ask is how this effects the 'Glowing Sea!' Would we have two zones with radiation storms, or would only one area be affected due to the presence of some other anomaly?

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Meghan Terry
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:01 pm

your theories are starting to get a little too close to "half life 3 confirmed".

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Auguste Bartholdi
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 7:43 am

The point is that whatever caused the crater we see in the concept art would be much too far away to be the detonation we see from above the vault. It is also in the wrong direction in relation to the vault, as confirmed if you zoom out on http://suncalc.net/#/42.4696,-71.3538,10/2077.10.23/14:47 image. Also, the concept art clearly shows a massive level of destruction around the crater consistent with a nuclear blast, and so it stands to reason that there would have been at least two detonations.

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Far'ed K.G.h.m
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:55 pm

2 Bombs is possible.From what I've seen in the trailer I'd say that one hit somewere south-east of concord.The one from the artworks seems to have hit somewere just north of Boston.

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Yvonne
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:26 pm

If the image you posted is the correct direction of the explosion of the trailer,It is actually perfectly compatible with the crater from the concept art.

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Victoria Bartel
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:55 pm

Blast radius, and survivability at any specific distance would greatly depend on the bomb yield. 4 miles and change would be fine for a sub-100 kiloton bomb, but, starting going beyond that, and the 'total destruction' radius expands scarily.

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FirDaus LOVe farhana
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:25 pm

If you zoom out a couple of steps on the 'SunCalc' link, you can see 'Somerville' on the map, which is basically the same area as Prospect Hill. Looking at the image, the yellow line (which would be the position of the sun at sunrise: 7:08 am Boston time) and the orange line (position of the sun at 9:47 am) are both in the wrong place. The shadows cast above the vault just before the nuke detonates are almost exactly behind the people standing in this area in relation to the fence.

The further away from the vault we go, the more we can see this discrepancy. Because of the very slight angle of the shadows, the point of impact would actually be just to the left of the orange line. And so as we get near to Prospect Hill, we would be looking at an impact somewhere just South of Brookline. And this simply does not match what we see in the concept art.

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Chantelle Walker
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 6:21 am

There are 4 mole rats in e3 trailer, 4 nuclear explosions confirmed.
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Jani Eayon
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 6:50 pm

Now that you mention it the crater seems to me to be spot on in Somerville

EDIT:I mean the concept art crater.

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Stefanny Cardona
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:50 pm

The two missing rockets from the mobile may well be pure coincidence, or it could be one of many easter eggs put into the game by the devs.

Either way, the evidence is very clear that we are most likely looking at two separate detonations in the Greater Boston area. And even if there was no evidence to suggest this, do you really think that only one low-yield nuke would have been fired at such a large area?

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Andres Lechuga
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:18 pm

If we want to take concept arts for granted we see three nuclear blasts in the last Drawing.

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TRIsha FEnnesse
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:27 pm


I'm not a low yeast nuke expert.
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Andrew Perry
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 5:49 am

Concept art is just that: Concept art. Although much of the concept art that we were shown is strikingly similar to the in-game footage, it does not mean that everything in the artwork will make it into the game, or look identical. The concept art is one of the first steps in creating the game world, and it's quite possible that the devs changed their minds about where the bomb fell. Note that when he mentions the glowing sea, Todd only says "bomb" (singular).

As for the Rocket mobile... I thought the three pre-war rockets represented the three family members, and post-war, there's only one left... The Sole Survivor.

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Rinceoir
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:29 pm

As a resident of real life Concord MA I'm not buying that the wooden bridge we see in the E3 demo is the Old North Bridge; unless they have radically changed the layout of the monument, the stuff surrounding it , and practically everything about it, it can't be the same thing. Where do you see "Old N Bridge?" The spotting of the 'Shot Heard Round the World' Monument is a good spy though- my guess is that the wooden bridge we see is the bridge in the link below, or possibly the bridge over Lowell road.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/42%C2%B028%2716.7%22N+71%C2%B020%2759.5%22W/@42.4714555,-71.3508589,16z/data=http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1526198-two-nuclear-detonations/!4m2!3m1!1s0x0:0x0

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Brittany Abner
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 3:16 am

https://www.google.it/search?q=minuteman+statue+concord&rlz=1C1SAVM_enIT562IT562&espv=2&biw=1920&bih=979&tbm=isch&imgil=69CNWWJmdz9y0M%253A%253Bw7z5KryFgngFaM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.uplandjournal.com%25252Fcgi-bin%25252Fikonboard312a%25252Fikonboard.cgi%25253Fact%2525253DPrint%25253Bf%2525253D3%25253Bt%2525253D65238&source=iu&pf=m&fir=69CNWWJmdz9y0M%253A%252Cw7z5KryFgngFaM%252C_&dpr=1&usg=__kFFDDKirQBwLKQNexLX17qZlG5A%3D&ved=0CDIQyjc&ei=il6aVcipIoO9ygPxw4SwCg#tbm=isch&q=minuteman+national+park&imgrc=9v1p9Mn3V54AYM%3A

This shot.Look at the Gameplay you can see the bridge and the minuteman monument on the left.The player is running from the east towards the bridge.The bridges have the same support Structure and beams protruding from the sides.

EDIT:Your link points to the wrong bridge.

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Amy Melissa
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 12:30 am

Either way, the devs have clearly made a number of changes, some of which will be to do with the scale of the map. Whichever bridge in this area has been used, we can see that the in-game Monument is at the far end of a NW-SE bridge on the other side of the Concord River. So at the very least the Monument itself has been moved.

EDIT: corrected reference from 'Charles River' to 'Concord River'

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Eliza Potter
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 5:31 am

The only link I could get to work in this area is the 'generic' one to the Park itself. For some unknown reason, this points to the North Bridge.

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Ilona Neumann
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:08 pm

Not necessarily.If we place Sanctuary Hills in the area of "The Old Manse" or Ripley RD, the in game shots are consistant with the real life area.

EDIT:Nope,the compass points the wrong way.Either way,The statue and the bridge are identical.As for the area layout,my guess is as good as yours.

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Nikki Hype
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 4:56 am

PCDug, that's what I'm saying- the wooden bridge in the gameplay video is just some bridge over the Concord River (possibly the one I indicated)- not the Old North Bridge. Look at that picture you pulled off google; see how there are no buildings or lightposts, and that the road is gravel, not pavement? The road the PC is on in the demo is a regular road- the Old North Bridge is only for foot traffic. Trust me, I go over that bridge when I run every morning. Obviously Beth is going to be making significant changes to the layout of Concord and the surrounding area, but adding two ruined buildings right next to the Bridge in the middle of what's a historic park makes no sense gameplay or atmosphere wise. I could be wrong, but I think we need more video than that 2 second shot to know for sure.

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Siobhan Thompson
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 1:30 am

well,we know for sure that sanctuary hills is just north of concord and there is a minuteman looking statue just out of town.but yeah,the old north bridge is not compatible:in real life the statue is on the west side.in the gameplay it is on the east side.sorry for no upper characters,my keyboard is acting funny.

EDIT:Are there other statues in the area other than the one by the old n bridge?

BT,that looks a nice neighborhood for morning runs.we don't get places that nice in Italy.

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Nikki Hype
 
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Post » Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:51 pm

It would actually make more sense if it was a regular road, I didn't realise that one was actually gravel.

Let's say then that Sanctuary Hills is accessed via Monument Street, and the bridge you have suggested is the one we see in-game. With a few minor changes (our protagonist is facing due SE when he exits the house), this could put the vault at the end of the roundabout on Cedar Way. This does actually look surprisingly similar to the area above the vault, although it would still require the vault to be built on top of a hill. Note that this would also require the Monument itself to be moved to the end of the Monument Street bridge, which would actually be quite fitting.

EDIT: information regarding the more viable location has been added to the OP.

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City Swagga
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 4:59 am

Considering the July 4th reveal of some art that portrays a moon landing, and implies there was military action on the moon, if the writing behind FO4 is as detailed as you imply, then, with this:

http://cdnstatic.gamesas.com/bethblog/2015/07/MoF_MURAL1440px.jpg

... the two missing rockets could imply something more plausibly relevant to American military fighting on the Moon.

:)

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Alexandra walker
 
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Post » Sat Nov 28, 2015 6:23 am

(sorry gkk7z, I don't know how to quote)

but in response to your post, ya, I could see things being moved around that way. I give Beth a lot of latitude with the layout of things both because it's a videogame and because Pre-war is an alternate reality too- not just post war. Lots could change in the layout of a place between now and 2077.

That being said, I feel like we can't make any sort of definitive statements about where anything is until we have the game in our hands, or, at the very least, a reporter gets a "first hour" free play sort of thing. The problem is that there are cuts between each of the shots in the gameplay demo, and we don't know how much distance is traveled. Sure, Vault 111 could be somewhere by the Old Manse... or you might not get to Concord until 30 minutes in, and 111 is way out by Bedford or something. We just can't know until we know how much distance is traveled by the PC.

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Tyrel
 
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