Tonight I went back to Fallout 3 despite not even being half way through New Vegas. Both are great games, yet F3 has a hold on me that I can't quite put my finger on. Anyway, the idea was to playthrough the game using the following three criteria -

- Iron Man, die once and you start over.
- Realistic weapon carry limit - one dual-handed rifle and any two from the pistol/unarmed/melee categories. Pick up any other weapon and you must drop one from the relevant slot you are carrying.
- Hard setting.

Quite a challenge, I thought. And its just ended.

I decided, perhaps foolishly, to take on the Following in His Footsteps quest. Its quite a big one, with many tough enemies, especially at such a low level. I ended up dying in Farragut West Metro at the hands of a Roamer, having been trapped into a corner. I was between level 3-4 at the time.

I have to say, doing the above is tough. I managed to get a Chinese Assault Rifle very early on (thanks Sheriff Simms) but hardly had any ammo for it for the entire duration. On reflection, a Hunting Rifle would have been a better choice. I therefore entered Farragut West with the Chinese Assault Rifle, 10mm pistol and Spiked Knuckles. I ended up running out of 10mm ammo very quickly and ended up dropping it to pick up a laser pistol from the safe just before you enter the metro utility area. Fine, I thought - I already have plenty of energy cells as ammo. However the laser pistol is a very weak weapon and it cost me my life using it to save precious 5.56 ammo.

Has anyone else tried doing this?

Yep I have been doing something similar for a few months now. No fast travel, I only carry one rifle and one pistol and limit myself in carrying other items (currently for one character all I'm carrying is a .44 magnum, a grimy buisness suit and hat, a metro ticket, some pre-war money, a pack of cigarettes, and a bottle of scotch). I also drop all ammo that is not being used by my current weapon(s) and limit myself to one pair of clothes/armor (I don't use power armor also). I don't play on anything above normal difficulty though because I don't like the "bullet sponge" effect it gives enemies but I limit myself in the amount of stimpacks, radaway and other chems and aid (usually like 15 for stimpacks and like 5 for chems and radaway) so it gives more of a challenge in that respect. Occasionally I like to follow the "hardcoe mode" rules and try to eat, drink, and sleep regularly to add to the realism but sometimes I forget :whistling: ....

Playing like this definetly adds to the enjoyment I get out of the game and gives me a real sense of immersion. I like your rule of "die and start over" but that sounds intense, im not sure I could have the patience to start a new character if I were to die...

I like it, it certainly adds a sense of immersion carrying only a reasonable amount of weapons. I found myself using the spiked knuckles a lot to kill radroaches or lone feral ghouls just to save on ammo. I never thought that I would. I found myself constantly monitoring health and ammo and switching weapons regularly. Hence my untimely death - I simply underestimated the strength of a Roamer on hard setting, especially with a weak laser pistol.

According to the rules I will start over, since I died. The point of this is to fear every battle as if it could be your last and not to underestimate any enemy. Knowing that you can simply reload your last autosave and carry on takes away a lot of the sense of dread, with little at stake. Sneak around a lot and even avoid combat if possible, especially if ammo is low. However, next time I will do things differently. Attempting Following in His Footsteps so early was a mistake. Also, a hunting rifle would be more useful early on than the Chinese assault rifle, simply due to ammo/repair.

Your comment about normal setting is interesting. I must admit that even mole rats were quite tough to kill on hard, even when shooting them directly in the face.

I think that the main thing to overcome when attempting this kind of playthrough is to survive until level 5 or 6. By then, your skills will be high enough to survive against most threats. Before that, even low level enemies are tough, since you do so little damage with almost any weapon. Also, Small Guns absolutely has to be a tag skill, I think. Almost all other weapon types will not get you through those early levels in one piece.

hmm.. thats interesting point...maybe I will start to do it. I like the idea of "fearing" battles.



Thats what I don't like above harder difficulties, the game is never completely realistic when it comes to fighting but on harder settings it just gets a bit ridiculous, a raider taking shots from a hunting rifle like I was throwing rocks just breaks immersion for me.

Yeah, knowing that all of the hours that you have invested so far could quickly end just around the corner really does make a difference.

Also, when I say 'start over', I don't mean all the way back to growing up in Vault 101. Now that would be boring. I have a savegame just before I leave Vault 101 for the first time - I start from there so that I can adjust tag skills/SPECIAL each time. :thumbsup:

Incidentally, my SPECIAL looks something like this (designed for maximum survivability) -

STR - 3 (won't need to be carrying much)
PER - 7
END - 8 (has to be high, I think)
CHR - 1 (this will fail you every speech check, but its not that important when you're being shot at by raiders)
INT - 7
AGL - 7
LCK - 6

Tag skills -

- Small Guns (the only way to get through the early game stage),
- Sneak (don't want to be spotted if ammo/health is low)
- Unarmed (since END is so high, it makes sense to have this as a backup combat skill, since ammo will be scarce)

Just FYI, the Laser Pistol is a fine weapon if you specialize in Energy Weapons, even on Very Hard mode.

I find levels 1-5 to be easy even on Very Hard mode, but it's levels 5-10 that are tough, mainly because I specialize in Energy Weapons and the Laser Rifle just isn't easy to get until about level 10 or so (and sometimes not even then). Not having a long range weapon after level 5 and not having Energy Weapons high enough to counteract the decrease in damage due to game level makes things very rough after about level 5.

Hunting Rifles and sniping are the key with Small Guns, though.

Hmm, thanks for the info. Ive not reached level 5 yet, though it's still quite tough. I'm lasting slightly longer this time, due to mainly not entering the metro tunnels so early. I did find an early game laser rifle, though. It's in a place I never found on my earlier playthrough (this game never ceases to amaze). It's in the unmarked Ghoul Outpost, by the scavenger bridge(the one with the two dogs) and near an entrance to Grayditch. I'm just deciding whether to ditch my sniper rifle and take the laser rifle, or leave it behind.

This is my first time around so I'm still learning and have a lot to learn.
I really like some of these ideas and plan to try them out before long.
I might try some of them this time around.I already play with 3 weapons.
I change them out often just for fun and to keep me on my toes....sometimes I die for my trouble.
I don't want to be able to win every fight,I love it when I make it by the skin of my bum.

I don't normally RP in Fallout (I can only think up Elder Scrolls RPs) but this sounds like a fun idea that could give me some inspiration.

If it's your first playthrough then I'd recommend just experiencing all the game has to offer, pick up as many weapons as you like and try everything out. Only on a second runthrough would I recommend my realism rules as you know what to specialise in and more importantly, what to look out for and where all the good stuff is hiding.

I've reached level 5 and am at Arefu. I'm still alive, though some battles have been quite close. I'm enjoying it immensely, the threat of a wrong turn and possible death means I consider everything I do very carefully. Limited weapons means that ammo is always low - I have 49 .308 for my sniper rifle (from the hollowed out rock) and 82 for my 10mm pistol. After that, I'm completely reliant on my lead pipe to get me out of trouble. :huh:

It's a constant battle to stay alive, and I haven't even dared to enter the metro tunnels yet. I'd hate to run out of ammo down there

Tip: don't go into tunnels or other indoor locales until you level up and can get a good supply of ammo and better weapons (and keep everything repaired, of course). Not to mention a good supply of stimpacks, etc!

I find it much, much better to remain outdoors as much as possible until I level up to the teens (except for quests that force me indoors).

Good advice, in fact I'm trying to do this as much as possible already. I had a brief trip into Farragut West, exiting at Friendship Heights (I'm not ready for Chevy Chase just yet!), but thats about it. I've got my Chinese assault rifle back, but am already out of ammo, which is a constant concern carrying so few weapons. At least I have the Shishkebab schematic now, so I can finally toss that lead pipe away.

I'm thinking of downloading the Operation Anchorage add-on, its one of two that I haven't done yet. I really want the Chinese Stealth Armour. One interesting question....

I think the next stop will have to be Tenpenny Tower - I need that ghoul mask to keep me safe. If I find just one feral ghoul reaver, then its game over.

Yes the safety is off so you will die in real life...

I've done a similar playthru using FWE mod harser settings...

I only will save at home... I won't go all the way back (FWE is hard enough)

but the thought of having to start over hours back in playing... back at base... is still scary...

I find myself running from most battles and since I switched SCC mod to make my followers use ammo I can't support a huge army of followers...

I also adjusted the unconcious timer for 5 mins so if my follower is down he's down for a long time...

Last night I was making my way towards minefield when i ran into a group of Raiders that spawned...

I ran into the town hoping the mines would kill a few as I only had a 32 calb pistol and a chinese officer sword (I had come pretty much naked to loot mines and stuff from the houses)

I ended up pinned by both Arkansas and the raiders who stays just far enough out of range to avoid mines...

I decided to make a dash for arkansas building hoping to catch him and use his rifle/s to pick off the raiders...

soon as I leave cover I get crippled in leg *i shoot some morphine* keep running when I get near arkansas drops some grenades...

by now the raiders are moving into town... some blow up... but the two main threats... one with hunting rifle and another with a sten gun...

they start fighting arkansas... I hide not knowing what was going on for about a min or two before the firing stopped... i pop my head out to check and arkansas snipes me...

evil...

Yea,I am pretty much checking everything out and taking my time.I'm about even with all weapons so I can try them out.
I am playing on easy but I have begun using some restrictions.
I will not save game or fast travel unless I am at a marked location.
I play (mostly) with 2 weapons now 1 one handed,1 two handed and no more than 100 ammo each.
If I pick up something I need at the time I can use it then...but only then.
I will not use better than Talon armor unless I fail a couple times first.
I will most likely move the difficulty up before long.
I will try out your rules for sure.I will try out different builds as well.

Glad you're enjoying it. My first playthrough was one of the best gaming experiences I've ever had. I'd love to experience all that again for the first time.

I actually started out on Normal setting, I found there a lack of realism when playing on Hard. If I shoot a raider then I want I'm to die, not shrug it off and continue running at me. Having said that, I think levels 0-10 on Normal, 11-20 on Hard and 21-30 on Very Hard would be a good compromise, and a good way to compensate for the overpowered weapons and skills that Broken Steel offers.

As for me, I'm still at level 5 and am at Tenpenny Tower. I will do this quest next, before moving on. Gustavo have me a Chinese assault rifle to take out the ghouls with. However, I might store it somewhere safe and just use a hunting rifle for this quest. Precious 5.56 ammo is still relatively scarce at this level.

The key balance is to select weapons that cover mid/short and long ranges. A hunting rifle and 10mm SMG is a good combo, likewise Chinese assault rifle and a scoped Magnum.

Ok, Its all over. I died at level 8, and in the most unexpected way.

I had completed Tenpenny Tower, and was doing quite well - Recon Armour, Ghoul Mask, Chinese assault rifle, Small Guns = 75 and a scoped Magnum. All was looking good, I was rarely in danger. Then, near the entrance to the Flooded Metro, I started taking shots at raiders across a bridge. No problem, I thought, I can pick them off with the scoped Magnum. What I forgot to consider was the huge collection of explodable cars/buses etc right next to me. My death scene was the most dramatic that I've ever seen. Overall, quite a quite disappointing way to end, considering the time and effort I had put in to make myself as tough as possible. Oh well...

I might get back into doing this, I remember having tons of unfinished character, mostly around levels 5-10 because I died of the stupidest reasons, like I didn't want to walk down the bridge from Arefu, decided I would jump in the water and hit a giant rock in the middle of the water and died...

I'm having a blast with this although I will admit it has for the most part become too easy.I love to find new weapons and armor,check them out then put them away.I use combat or talon armor
and alternate between the regular weapons available.As of now almost any special weapon seems overpowered to me.
Even though this is my first playthrough,tonight I will move the difficulty up one step to make me try harder.
I've made it through 3 of the 5 DLC's and am at lvl 17.On the main quest...Dad is gone.Also I've done a hand full of other quest's.Now I find myself wishing I had moved the difficulty up sooner.
I'm thinking you have it just about right...Normal,Hard,Very Hard,0-10,11-20,21-30,and I believe I will give that a try for sure sooner than later.
I have 2 more DLC's to do,finish, the main quest and a ton of other stuff.I am looking for unique places to live.When I play again I will not fast travel thats for sure.
I will not set up shop in Megaton or Tenpenny.I've seen mention of some of the different places people have used for homes but have yet to descover them.

I think that 0-10 on Normal, 11-20 on Hard and 21-30 on Very Hard is a good way to approach it. As you go up in levels your skills, ammo and firepower increases far more rapidly than the enemies attack strength does. So it balances quite well.

I'm gonna play through F3 again, since my iron man/no death playthrough ended in such embarrassing fashion. :blush:

Reading this has given me new inspiration to replay F3 again and try the permanent death scenario. Nice one.

Remember, permanent death AND the realistic weapon carry limit. :thumbsup:

Even though you know where all the good stuff is hiding, its still more difficult than you think. For all my survival boosting planning, I ended up getting killed by a random car explosion.

What about health/food/chem items limits and ammo limits? any1 got any ideas for those?

I tried this mode, but i ended up hoarding EVERYTHING... :shakehead:

As you can only carry limited weapons, the sane goes for armour as well. So this means no stockpiling guns and power armour for easy caps. Therefore all your caps will have to come from selling misc items and ammo.

Regards carry limits for ammo/misc items/chems - you can take as much as your carry limit will allow, else you will be constantly monitoring what you are holding at any one time. It would svck the fun out it. Also, these wil be your primary/only trade items, so selling them regularly is often quite necessary. Also given the limited guns that you can carry, theres no point in carrying multiple ammo types, even though it may be weightless.

This is how I play it.

It sounds like Barter is a pretty essential skill for your character. Do you model your levelling on that? For example, do you pump a lot of Skill Points into it each level and choose Barter-related perks when they are available? Or do you prefer to be like a Wasteland Vagabond, constantly scraping enough Caps to survive? Either way, it sounds like it would be an interesting experience to try.

Im really likin this playstyle, i havent died yet, however my health is low and im not wasting any stims on that rite now. Im onle lvl two, but i am at bethsda ryuins right out of the vault and i have raider badlands, the overseer's 10mm pistol, and a sniper with 15 shots. Im thinking about headin to the raid shack and then to megaton, or keep going north all the way to the republic of dave for ol painless!

Needless to say, im very exicted for my character Quentin. :woot: :woot: :woot: