You'll need to ask Bone. I don't have a firm grasp of them, myself. I wasn't around when Aldgate was being used.

I have built so much, so many times. Why do I have to start over every time. The grand pyramid to dust, and now my epic underground forest. Can I have no time to build anything. If only there was some way to build my stuff in singleplayer and port it into multiplayer. God that would be amazing.

http://al.tc/uploads/2/lookout.PNG

Oh they are. Members from different time zones will be promoted to moderators in order to stop any griefing. Griefers should be more afraid since mods can teleport to them at any moment. The mods will be checking up on members that are online. Beware. :ninja:

Also if you read bm's post, no war was not the reason for a new map. It's the loss of a community on the server which we once had during the era of Aldgate.

I guess that what is really going on is that the newer members (Myself included) don't know what they are missing. While some of the older (And newer) members just don't want to give up what they built so soon.

Well we of the old Aldgate had to give up a lot of our buildings and such when we moved to Torhemn. And then soon gave up more when we went on to the newest map. How do you think we felt?
I think you guys should be okay.

I think it would go over much better if the mods gave us at least a portion of what we'd be loosing in our current inventories when we got to the new world. For example, if you have diamond tools in this world, you'd be given them to start in the new one. If you have a watch, you get a watch. If you have gold or diamonds, you get some when starting in the new world, except there should be some sort of limit for that (20 or so). At least make us feel like the month we spent in this new world wont have gone entirely to waste.

Maybe that could be arranged. But how exactly would you prove that you had those tools beforehand? And thus how could the mods know if you were just lying so that you'd get cool stuff.

However, I think that it is safe to assume that everybody has had at least one full set of diamond tools at one point. So I don't really see a problem with giving everybody ONE set of diamond tools (Or armor, but not both) to start out the server.

The mods would have to teleport to each player individually. The player would escort them to their storage area, or specifically, the chest with the stuff they want to carry over to the next world, and the mod would have to either take a screenshot of the items in the chest or write them down. Obviously the player has to be on for this to work, so players and mods would have to schedule times.

Sounds like too much work. I like my care package idea better.

Oh my god what is wrong with me?! I'm acting like I would actually have to DO this work! Oh wait... damn! I would! Noooo!

[censored] it we all have to relocate, and we all have to build again. Give everyone a starter kit of gear at least for god sakes. 3 Diamond Picks, 2 Diamond Shovels, and half stack of coal. This would be a fair thing to give to everyone if we have to start over. Especially because "we lost a sense of community" [censored]. For once we have a GOOD server that we can build on in peace and quiet. I think someones waxing too much dod gamn nostalgic. This is the best we have ever had it in terms of being able to build.

I'm not really sure how I feel about what's going on right now.

On one hand, we haven't given this current map nearly enough time to develop into anything. Most people are still building their settlements. A good choice would be to give people a little more time to finish what their working on, develop commuinities, build roads and what not and basically just see where things go. It may develop into more of a multiplayer experience once people feel they're ready to stop building and enjoy the community experience.

However, we're not nearly as active as we were on the old map, and if some kind of community doesn't develop soon, it's only going to get worse because we're already spread so thin and more people are going to want to leave. So having a single town could be good for that.

So I think we really just need to take a vote, or something, and see what people want to do. Obviously everyone isn't going to like whatever gets chosen, and we might even lose more people, but something needs to be decided on soon, before we lose even more people out of boredom.



I don't think nostalgia is the problem, I think we just have differing views on what we want for the server. Some people, like you, want a quiet place to build. Others want a single area where everyone can play together, which, since this is multiplayer, makes at least a little bit of sense. Also, you may have just given me an idea or two.

My idea:

Why don't we build the town in the current map, and force (for lack of a better word) everyone to live there. Hear me out now, people. While there, their current territories will be left alone, and, after having experienced living in a town with other players, if they still want to leave, they can buy their territory back (probably with gold or whatever currency we use), and go live on it instead. This will give everyone a chance to try the town thing, and if they don't like it, they can just go back. If having a map is part of the reason for going to the new server, then hell, we already have a fairly accurate map of the area we're in now, and I'd be willing to draw one of the town if we need it.

Sure, it's not the best idea, but overall it's one everyone is most likely to agree with. It gives people a choice whether they want to start over, rather than forcing them.

I'll apologize if I'm stepping on anyone's toes here, but as a relative outsider (albeit still with an interest in the community) I'd like to offer my opinion.

If this is indeed a community server, then it's probably best to heed the will of the majority, even if the admins think otherwise. And I'm willing to bet that the majority will be quite disappointed to see the slate wiped clean on their creations. Antibody correctly states that this is a game that revolves in large part around building - like a giant game of Lego. While I've started over many a time in Singleplayer, I have done so on my own terms - I'd be pretty peeved not to have that power of decision in my world's fate.

Perhaps the only legitimate reason I can think of to start over is simple: if the lagginess is caused exclusively or nearly so by the size of the map and/or the amount of people/stuff on it, and not by bugs in the SMP code. The other reasons need not apply, in my mind... Those who wish for a greater sense of community, build closer to like-minded people. Economies don't seem important to me (I'm biased though, because I'm a SP person first) and should be able to work regardless of the map. And I'm ignorant to the intricacies of moderating, but I'm sure there are always ways to improve, no matter the map.

However, If the server is instead run as a co-op, meaning those who have contributed financially to the operation of the hardware have a greater voice, then I as a non-contributor would defer to the will of the contributors. I have no problems with that sort of arrangement, but I'm more easy-going than most. I'm sure others would be more intractable. People would still kick and holler, but the contributors would have the final say... They'd just have to deal with some players not returning, as has already been pointed out.

I suppose that either way you'll lose players, either through the normal attrition or through ill temper. I do think, however, that trying to work with what you have (until such becomes unsustainable) is the best, or at least most diplomatic, course of action.

Maybe you guys have no sense of community, but me, demonicpopcorn (evan), lord, mrconner and tribbles have a very nice group project tht has kept all of us happy for the last month. Maybe you guys should start your own group projects or build a vast nuetral city at spawn. I fail to see the point of making a new map.


Yet on the slim chance of starting a new server I will pm bone or whoever the contents of vault spartas vault, do that all of our hard work will continue into the new map

Another map reset?


Ugh. Why just not split our current map into 2 - 4 different nations and start trading, small skirmish wars and stuff like that. We could have trade going on. We could build villages and towns
in our territory which gives gold (currency) every week for the nations treasury (treasury is shown in OP).

Something like that... everyone can think up more like how wars/trading should work and stuff like that.

Personally, I wouldn't want a new map. We put a lot of effort in our first castle, and also in this second castle. Why can't some of you build a village of sorts in this same current map?

True, I've builded my castle 3 times now, and if we go and start New Aldgate where there is strict building limitations, I can assure that Gray Death Legion will go rogue.

I like this idea quite a lot, with the exception of people losing their territories. People should keep their territories, but be required to set up shop in the new town for a month or so. We would be able to use the resources in our territory to help us get started, and travel back to it as we please to get more materials. This would be exactly the same as starting a new map except all of our hard work and items wont be deleted, and getting the town up and running will go quicker. The only difference being we wouldn't have a map of the new town, but honestly, as long as the new town is organized it wouldn't be hard to make one up.

Yeah, that's basically what I meant. I'm not saying people should lose their territories. They'll still have them in the sense that no one else will be able to take them, but I figured having to buy them back would be a good incentive for keeping people in the village for a while.



How would you feel about having to live in New Aldgate until you acquire enough money to buy your own plot of land for the Gray Death Legion keep? Seems like a fair system that would keep most people happy. You'd still have a chance to try out the town system, like the mods want, and you'd still have a chance to build the GDL keep eventually if you still wanted to.

How would you make them stay inside though? A bedrock box? I think the people who aren't interested in the town would just find ways to ditch unless you put them into a tiny box. Same problem with making them open a shop or something in a central town. The people uninterested in the endeavor will find ways to mostly ignore it even exists. Hell, what's to stop someone from living under a pond and staying away from everyone? (As a person who successfully built a never once greifed log cabin under a pond in creative mode, I can tell you it's very easy to do as long no one no-clips into your home)

I agree with Darth, people shouldn't be forced to live there. People should want to live there. Make it safe, fun and exciting and people will come, force unhappy people to live there and it will fall apart.

Mods are going to start teleporting to people randomly to see what they're doing, and there's nowhere to hide unless you spend all your time standing on a single block surrounded by lava.

But yes, you're right, we shouldn't force people to stay inside, which is why I said in my previous post that we should be free to leave to our territories, and simply be required to participate in the city as well. If it doesn't work out well like this, then we've sent the mods a clear message, which is that we like it the way it is now.

Frankly I see no reason to make a new map. We need to simply build the city somewhere in the current map, and if it doesn't work out, it's because we don't want it. Making a new map is essentially taking away everything we own and are familiar with, plopping us in a city and saying "Go make a community because we say so." If that happens I doubt I'll be participating, being treated like an animal is no fun.

As someone whose moderated a creative mode server, I can tell you that this is good for catching greifing (But only if the mods do it regularly and not just when someone complains on the chat), but if your using it to force people to play a certain way, It'd be very annoying and draconian. I mean think about it, the only way to enforce town usage, or anything in minecraft servers, (even in a trial period, and even if all they had to do was maintain a shop) is to /ban, /kick, or grief the people who don't comply. Anything else isn't really a punishment.


I predict it won't work out well. What will work out well is if you get people to come together to do something magnificent. That talk of building White-Gold tower earlier in the thread? That kind of thing is the key. Massive, awesome, and made of cool community building projects will engage people much better than making them dredge themselves out of their tunnels and towers to visit some city by the spawn. Also, the advantage of community projects is that the people who don't want to work together can ignore it, or only provide resources. Some of the people I liked the most on the server I used to moderate were the people I built stuff with.


I'd recommend just starting a mega project at the spawn.


Also, I notice some people seem to want an economy or shops. Honestly, you'll never have a proper economy because minecraft allows for individual players to be completely self-sufficient.
Edit 1: More on Economy: but if you want an economy, I've got some suggestions for setting one up.

1. Someone should start hoarding diamonds, or mods should sell them in exchange for exuberant amounts of another substance. Let's face it, getting these is a pain in the butt. If someone can consistently sell them or specialize in them it will be a start. Certain players specializing completely in diamond mining would also help.

2. Same goes with Obsidian. Someone should start hoarding it or making it to the exclusion of other pursuits. It's a pain in the butt to gather and being able to buy it in exchange for the much more common gold or iron (or enough cobblestone to build a citadel) would be much more convenient then risking getting your tools burned to a crisp. Also ensure continuous demand for group 1.

3. Accept the fact that the barter system is for you.

In short, it was full.

At the time, Wamp and I were the only active mods and we were both too swamped with uni work to build the expansion and set down updated rules. At this point Torhemn opened up with no set boundaries, and everyone set up shop there. And you saw the mess that became.


By pre-defining an extremely large city boundary things wont get so cramped or full.

I'm not opposed to building the city in the existing map if we can find a large area of land within (or mostly within) the already explored boundaries.

And I agree with the handing out of starter kits.


EDIT: @DarthRav, Aldgate was a true community project. Everyone had their own plots to build on, then the city (ie Wamp and I) used its income from plot sales to commission projects such as the road network, docks and castle.

I want 40 000 blocks of refined stone, 3 stacks of diamonds and 20 stacks of iron.