[RELZ] Unofficial Oblivion Patch 3.2.0 thru 3.2.10 Supplemen : IV - Oblivion

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:21 pm

It seems I was wrong, this problem is much bigger from the looks of it. It seems to happen when I unequip anything from the male body and it happens even with vanilla meshes, I don't know what to say about this at all lol.

May be problems with a body replacer.
Or it could be the Mayu Skeleton Overhaul (or something like that). The Wrye Bash tweak causes crashes for me, so maybe there is problems with the mod too.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 7:47 pm

I'd have to agree, sounds like body mod issues of some sort. If it were the mesh, many people would have complained loudly about it 2 years ago.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:45 pm

Indeed, that was my thought as well. However I don't use any male body mods. and the animation replacer I ruled out since that would only work if I had my bashed patch active (I tested this with only oblivion.esm and it still crashed then)

Anyways, off topic now. I will take my angry ranting elsewhere

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:13 pm

All the NPCs involved in MS23 (Cylben Dolovas, Gilen and Ralsa Norvalo, Grey-Throat, Roland Jenseric, Seridur) need to be fixed, because their AI packages are messed up (out of order, wrong flags and conditions, wrong locations, plus one missing bed in Norvalo house).
Great work with v 3.3. Thanx.

You'll need to be more specific about what's actually broken here.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:39 pm

I think I found a bug in 3.3. I just finished The Hist and Modryn booted me out of the Fighters Guild for killing a fellow member. I've never encountered this bug before but I notice that 3.3 tweaked this quest. Unfortunately it seems to have broken it for me. After getting the quest from Modryn I went straight to Leyawiin, so I didn't even talk to any other FG members before the quest. I also tried it twice. The first time I fought Maglir as usual, which means I nail him as soon as I can. After getting kicked out, I tried again making sure he hit me first - same result. Can you have a look at this again please? If you want help testing, I have a save that I made right before I left the basemant, so I can easily test.

I also had a look in TES4Edit and there doesn't appear to be anything else in my LO that touches this quest.

EDIT: I think I just found what causes this problem. It is definitely the fight with Maglir that causes my expulsion. This time I let him wail away at me and I noticed that he was taking damage anyway. I have damage reflection! So perhaps even though he's attacking me it doesn't register properly. Now as I said, I've never had this problem before. I'm not even carrying the Escutcheon of Chorrol this time which is pretty much a staple for me. I've never had to worry about when I attacked Maglir, although I imagine most of the time he probably got a hit or two in. So in the past I would say damage reflection did not cause any problems, but now it seems to be interferring with the tweaks you made. I can remove the items that have damage reflection and see if that helps.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:13 am

The UOP previously removed Cingor from the mythic dawn to avoid the player getting kicked out of the fighters guild if killed, so the changes made to him should probably be removed or have him not removed and instead removed from the fighters guild when he attacks the player.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:32 pm

The UOP previously removed Cingor from the mythic dawn to avoid the player getting kicked out of the fighters guild if killed, so the changes made to him should probably be removed or have him not removed and instead removed from the fighters guild when he attacks the player.

Actually I've never managed to get him to attack me when I was a member of the FG. When I was testing 3.2.11 (now 3.3), I had to cast frenzy on him to get him to attack. Even then, he wouldn't attack me but attacked townspeople instead. This is how I confirmed he now summons his Mythic Dawn armour. I helped the townspeople kill him and I'm pretty sure I landed the killing blow - I run Oblivion XP and I think it gave me the points for killing him. I didn't get kicked out of the FG... However, as I reported above, I did kicked out after killing Maglir

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:37 pm

Well that was what I was doing with Maglir was having him taken out of the FG before the encounter with him was even possible. It should have worked unless some other mod reversed the edit by touching that particular quest.

Stage 40 does this:

MaglirREF.SetFactionRank BravilFaction -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank ChorrolFaction -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank SkingradFaction -1MaglirREF.setfactionrank fightersguild -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank BlackwoodCompanyFACTION 0MaglirREF.MovetoMarker FGMaglirEndMarkerSetEssential Maglir 0SetQuestObject FGD09JaFazirKey 0SetQuestObject FGD09JeetumZeKey 0SetQuestObject FGD09RiZakarKey 0

The commands to move him out of the FG and into BWC take place before the player is able to encounter him.

Spoiler

This stage is the one that's set immediately following the destruction of the Hist tree.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:26 pm

Indeed, I'm looking the quest and it should be impossible for that to happen at this point

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:04 am

andalaybay, post your load order.
OOO edits The Hist and so does all versions of Choices and Consequences.

Compared to UOP OOO is missing this line from Stage 40:
MaglirREF.setfactionrank fightersguild -1

How do you pronounce "hist" anyway? Like heist or like hissed?

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:10 pm

It's pronounced "hissed", and yes, OOO will need to incorporate the fix to the quest since it overwrites FGD09Hist.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:12 am

I checked TES4Edit and nothing is touching that quest. I don't run any overhauls. Here's my LO:

Spoiler

Active Mod Files:00  Oblivion.esm01  All Natural Base.esm  [Version 0.9.9.5]02  Ulrim's Horses.esm03  Kvatch Rebuilt.esm04  bookplacing.esm  [Version 1]05  CustomSpellIcons.esm06  TNR ALL RACES FINAL.esp07  Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp  [Version 3.3]08  All Natural - Real Lights.esp  [Version 0.9.9.5]09  All Natural.esp  [Version 0.9.9.5]0A  Enhanced Water v2.0 HDMI.esp0B  QuietFeet.esp0C  WindowLightingSystem.esp0D  Book Jackets Oblivion - BP.esp0E  ClocksOfCyrodiil.esp0F  Display Stats.esp  [Version 1.2]10  RAEVWD Cities.esp  [Version 1.8]11  RAEVWD Imperial City.esp  [Version 1.8]12  Reznod_Mannequin.esp13  Harvest[Containers].esp14  Living Economy.esp15  Living Economy - Items.esp16  Map Marker Overhaul.esp  [Version 3.6]17  Improved Hotkeys_Extended.esp  [Version 1.1]18  DLCHorseArmor.esp19  DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.5]1A  SM Plugin Refurbish - HorseArmor.esp  [Version 1.11]1B  DLCOrrery.esp1C  DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.3]1D  SM Plugin Refurbish - Orrery.esp  [Version 1.11]1E  DLCVileLair.esp1F  DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.5]20  DLCMehrunesRazor.esp21  DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.4]22  SM Plugin Refurbish - MehrunesRazor.esp  [Version 1.30]23  DLCSpellTomes.esp24  DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.1]**  GrimbotsSpellTomes.esp25  MaleBodyReplacerV4.esp**  CM_Better Wine.esp26  Darkgreen Glass Armour.esp27  FineWeapons.esp28  Imperial Legion Scout Armour.esp29  RTFemaleReplacerV12.esp2A  Slof's Horses Base.esp2B  Dude Wheres My Horse.esp**  Ranokoas Organized Potions.esp2C  mg19obsefix.esp  [Version 1]2D  Imperial Furniture Renovated.esp2E  BrotherhoodRenewed.esp  [Version 1.0.5]2F  Kvatch Rebuilt.esp30  Kvatch Rebuilt Weather Patch.esp31  Whispered Warning.esp32  DLCBattlehornCastle.esp33  DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.4]34  DLCBattlehornCastle - My Fixes.esp35  DLCFrostcrag.esp36  Kvatch Rebuilt_Frostcrag.esp37  DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.4]38  SM Plugin Refurbish - FrostCrag.esp  [Version 1.2]39  Ulrim's Horses.esp3A  The Lost Spires.esp3B  Harvest [Flora].esp  [Version 3.0.0]3C  NoHFailure_HFlora.esp3D  Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp  [Version 3.0.0]3E  Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp  [Version 3.0.0]3F  AutoBookPlacer.esp  [Version 3.02]40  Bag of Holding.esp  [Version 1.5.0]41  BlackScreenSneakFix.esp42  DecoratorAssistant with OBSE v1.1.esp43  DecoratorAssistant Unlock for OBSE version.esp44  Ingredient Storage Shelves.esp45  Toggleable Quantity Prompt.esp  [Version 3.1.1]46  Quest Award Leveller.esp  [Version 2.1.0]47  Quest Award Leveller - Battlehorn Castle.esp48  Quest Award Leveller - Vile Lair.esp  [Version 2.1.0]49  Quest Award Leveller - Mehrunes Razor.esp  [Version 2.1.0]4A  encumbrancemodx50.esp4B  Kyoma's Spell Renamer.esp  [Version 3.0.1]4C  TigerpawsGateCloser.esp4D  SupremeMagicka.esp  [Version 0.89]4E  SM_DLCSpellTome.esp  [Version 0.80]4F  SM_Scrolls.esp  [Version 0.84]50  SM_SigilStone.esp  [Version 0.83]51  Lightweight Potions.esp  [Version 1.1]52  Oblivion XP.esp  [Version 4.1.5]**  All Natural - Indoor Weather Filter For Mods.esp  [Version 0.9.9.5]53  clearHDR.esp54  Bashed Patch, 0.esp

As I said, the odd thing for me is that I've never had this problem before. Done this quest at least a half dozen times...

Now I just looked at the quest info in TES4Edit and I don't have the faction removals. Here's what I've got:

StopQuest FGInterimConversationRiZakarREF1.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1GeelREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1JaFazirREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1JeetumZeREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1

Was there another fix to 3.3 after its initial release? I think I grabbed it immediately. I am running 3.3 - here's a portion of the readme from OBMM:

Spoiler

Unofficial Oblivion Patch Supplemental v3.3
-------------------------------------------

This supplemental patch corrects several remaining flaws leftover in the UOP after Quarn and Kivan stopped maintaining it.

It seems there is no end to the supply of bugs to fix!

Installation
------------

Installation of the Unofficial Oblivion Patch v3.2.0 is REQUIRED. Failure to do so may result in unpredictable behavior.

Manually unpack the files into your Data folder, overwrite the ESP when asked.

UOP Changes for 3.3
-------------------

* SQ07CreatureStormAtronach02 was assigned the wrong skeleton mesh and has been corrected to use stormatronach.nif like the other SQ07 atronachs.
* The DarkSister topic fix placed the two required voice support files in the wrong folder and has been corrected.
* Addressing an old complaint: The fire at Vilverin has been exchanged for one that makes smoke.
* Another old report: The dock lamp north of Vilverin has no light source.
* Laythe Wavrick gets marked non-essential at the end of the Stolen Painting quest, which can leave him vulnerable to being killed before the end of Sins of the Father.
* Fixed the CS warnings about path grids with too many connections.
* In quest "The Wandering Scholar" the player is told to go to a location northeast of Sutch. This should have referenced Anvil instead as Sutch was cut from the game.
* In quest "Sins of the Father" Fathis Ules will continue to stalk the player even if the initial quest offer is declined.
* Several rug pieces in cell ChorrolCastlePrivateQuarters were not grounded properly.
* The bed in Ocato's chamber has been changed to be owned by the IC Palace faction so Evangeline Beanique will perform her intended sleep package.
See: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Evangeline_Beanique#Bugs
* AI pack AhMalzFightersGuild changed to a wander pack. The travel pack type had Ah-Malz standing in place.
See: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Ah-Malz#Bugs
* The replacement columns in the IC Arena have been modified so that mods which may need to move them can do so without requiring the UOP as a dependency.
* The rock in the road in SE Anvil has been deleted, and the sidewalk pieces it was covering a hole for pushed down just enough to cover it with the street instead.
* The subtitle for the rumor in Skingrad about Agnete was wrong.
* Fathis should have slept at The Oak and Crosier between midnight and 9am while Sins of the Father is active. No bed was available though.
The spare room has been marked as owned by the Chorrol city faction so he can use it.
See: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Fathis_Ules#Bugs
.... snipped ...

Did you change the file header for 3.3? The file header for my Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp still says version 1.0, so all I have to confirm its 3.3 is the readme. I have also seen some of the other changes, like the extra bedrolls in the Chorrol Fighters Guild. I also noticed that Honditar seems to shoot into the ground now - at least he's not shooting over the target anymore

I also have the Sigil stone fixes...

So if there wasn't another 3.3 released after the initial, could you confirm that Maglir's fixes made it into the published version?

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:49 pm

As I said, the odd thing for me is that I've never had this problem before. Done this quest at least a half dozen times...

Now I just looked at the quest info in TES4Edit and I don't have the faction removals. Here's what I've got:

StopQuest FGInterimConversationRiZakarREF1.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1GeelREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1JaFazirREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1JeetumZeREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1

Was there another fix to 3.3 after its initial release? I think I grabbed it immediately.

Did you change the file header for 3.3? The file header for my Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp still says version 1.0, so all I have to confirm its 3.3 is the readme. I have also seen some of the other changes, like the extra bedrolls in the Chorrol Fighters Guild. I also noticed that Honditar seems to shoot into the ground now - at least he's not shooting over the target anymore

I also have the Sigil stone fixes...

So if there wasn't another 3.3 released after the initial, could you confirm that Maglir's fixes made it into the published version?

Those faction removals are in stage 10. The ones that were fixed by the UOP (it had others before I got to it) are in stage 40 and remove Maglir specifically from several factions. No changes to 3.3 were made post-release other than those I'm keeping track of for the next update, and nothing for this particular quest since it was fixed.

Check it again with TES4Edit, but if it's not there I have no idea what to tell you because I'm looking at it right now.

The file header has nothing to do with the actual mod version. Check the description field for that. Scroll down if need be, it's at the bottom of the text, under the bash tags.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:32 pm

Those faction removals are in stage 10. The ones that were fixed by the UOP (it had others before I got to it) are in stage 40 and remove Maglir specifically from several factions. No changes to 3.3 were made post-release other than those I'm keeping track of for the next update, and nothing for this particular quest since it was fixed.

Check it again with TES4Edit, but if it's not there I have no idea what to tell you because I'm looking at it right now.

The file header has nothing to do with the actual mod version. Check the description field for that. Scroll down if need be, it's at the bottom of the text, under the bash tags.

Confirmed. I didn't scroll down far enough! I also don't usually use TES4Edit to check quest details... So yes, I'm running 3.3 (it's in the description) and here are the details from stage 40:

MaglirREF.SetFactionRank BravilFaction -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank ChorrolFaction -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank LeyawiinFaction -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank SkingradFaction -1MaglirREF.setfactionrank fightersguild -1MaglirREF.SetFactionRank BlackwoodCompanyFACTION 0MaglirREF.MovetoMarker FGMaglirEndMarkerSetEssential Maglir 0SetQuestObject FGD09JaFazirKey 0SetQuestObject FGD09JeetumZeKey 0SetQuestObject FGD09RiZakarKey 0

I know I hit stage 40 because I got the message about returning to Oreyn. So, any ideas? Are there any console commands that I can use to get Maglir's status? I used console commands to reinstate myself to finish the quest

EDIT: Used console command to confirm Maglir's fightersguild faction rank is set to -1...

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:58 am

Don't know what else to tell you then. If his faction rank is set to -1 the game knows he's no longer in it.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:25 pm

Unless there is something else going on here that is preventing the fix from working right. A script or dialog?

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:38 pm

Don't know what else to tell you then. If his faction rank is set to -1 the game knows he's no longer in it.

Have you been able to confirm that removing him from the fighters guild faction even fixes the problem? As I said, it's odd that I never had this problem previously... I guess I'll try going back to 3.2.10 and see what happens...

EDIT: went back to 3.2.10 and it made no difference. Re-installed 3.3 and tried removing the damage reflection so Maglir didn't take any damage when he wailed on me - no difference. There must be some subtle timing thing that kicks in and it appears that removing Maglir from the FG faction doesn't help. Wish I knew what the magic fix is... At least if you do encounter this, you can restore your status by using console commands. I did this before even talking to Oreyn, so I was able to finish the quest normally.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:24 pm

Arthmoor, how do you make changes to the UOP? Everytime I try and edit it it crashes the CS

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:45 pm

Depends on what's being changed. Sometimes TES4Edit, sometimes loading it into the CS.

The only reason you'd be expelled from the FG is for attacking or killing a member, and Maglir is being pulled out of the faction before the battle is even possible. So I see nothing that can be fixed further about this unless he's somehow been made a member of another faction that you've also been made a member of and THAT faction is causing the expulsion.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:31 pm

Depends on what's being changed. Sometimes TES4Edit, sometimes loading it into the CS.

The only reason you'd be expelled from the FG is for attacking or killing a member, and Maglir is being pulled out of the faction before the battle is even possible. So I see nothing that can be fixed further about this unless he's somehow been made a member of another faction that you've also been made a member of and THAT faction is causing the expulsion.

I've checked in TES4Edit and nothing changes him at all (even TNR, surprisingly enough). Even if he was part of another faction that I was part of, why would getting expelled from that faction cause my expulsion from the FG? After killing Maglir, if I open my factions menu, the Fighters Guild rank is gone, so I know that I've been expelled. The weird thing is, the only message I get when I kill him is from Oblivion XP telling me I've killed Maglir and the amount of experience points I've been awarded (this is normal). I don't get the "you've been expelled from the Fighters Guild" message that you would normally get for killing a member. The first time I did this, I didn't even realize I'd been expelled until I spoke to Oreyn. That was when I discovered the bug. So there is something odd going on here and I guess we'll have to wait and see if others have the same problem.

Now one thing that is different this time is that this is the first time I've imported factions into my bashed patch. I'm also running Brotherhood Renewed (ever heard of that one?

) and when I saw that there was some faction stuff that could be imported, I checked it and the UOP off for import. It doesn't look like it actually did anything. Should I rebuild my patch without the faction import?

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:27 am

I was going to edited the Cingor fix for myself, but it kept crashing when trying to make a separate esp with the changes. I made them to UOP then exported to a new esp with TES4Edit.

The CS is total garbage

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:47 am

I think the whole thing is rather twitchy. I actually had a lot of game instability when I was testing the 3.2.11 patch. I figured it would go away once 3.2.11 became a proper UOP and it did... So I'm not surprised the CS can be twitchy when trying to edit this...

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:38 pm

I was going to edited the Cingor fix for myself, but it kept crashing when trying to make a separate esp with the changes. I made them to UOP then exported to a new esp with TES4Edit.

The CS is total garbage

Not total garbage. You just didn't do it right

The ESP you make has to contain something that edits the Tamriel worldspace. Something as lame as nudging a rock usually does the trick. You also need to ESMify the ESP you want to modify before you do that.

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:49 pm

I ESMified it, but I didn't know I had to make a dummy change to Tamriel. I will have to remember that

» Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:00 pm

Now one thing that is different this time is that this is the first time I've imported factions into my bashed patch. I'm also running Brotherhood Renewed (ever heard of that one?

) and when I saw that there was some faction stuff that could be imported, I checked it and the UOP off for import. It doesn't look like it actually did anything. Should I rebuild my patch without the faction import?

The faction import, like nearly all other importers, only does something if it needs to. If nothing touches Maglir's factions, he won't have an imported faction record in the bashed patch. With the mods I use (and those I keep for testing) his faction records are never touched. FG, Chorrol, Skingrad, Bravil, and Leyawiin. All rank 0. Now unless the game has decided that -1 is no longer "out of the faction" then the problem isn't originating with Maglir. Have you checked to see if anything is directly referencing the player and silently setting the expulsion? It may require more than a casual glance to find it. This is where TES4Edit's "referenced by" tab is helpful. Especially when your entire load order is brought up with it.