Hey Kivan and all of you dealing with the UOP:

I don't know if this has been mentioned before, but there is a a bridge height issue: when you leave Bruma and go to Hermaeus Mora's shrine following the road, you have to take a bridge and then turn right up the mountain. The thing is, if you are riding a horse, this bridge is too low on both ends. Big beasts (like minotaurs) can't pass under it as well.

Also, this is even more obvious when you use the option in wrye bash "bigger nords/orcs", but then again, this is an option.

I'll make a screenshot tomorrow to show you which one I'm talking about. It's fairly easy to find, but a picture is always nice. I can also prepare a screenshot with formid finder if this makes things any easier.

Cheers!

Thought this was fixed long ago:



If not, if you could get the ID's with console/click of any affected ones that would be appreciated. It's also possible, as no one has reported this in all those years, that something is overriding our changes.

@Kivan
Just for my info... did you manage to fix the Glass Armor hole bug not properly fixed in previous UOPs, which also removed the glossy effect?
If yes, did you properly modify the 3D model mesh or "stretched" the vertex to join parts and hide the hole (like previous fix did when casting spell)?

I thought that was fixed as well. I ran into that problem in one of my games but didn't run into it again, so I thought it had been taken care of.

It seems that the name of the place is wrong. It's called "Timberscar Cave" five times in dialog and the four in journal you noted. The only thing that calls it "Timberscar Hollow" is the place itself (including the map marker.)
The dialog is the determinant...



Not yet. Kinda dreading it. Armor weighting was difficult enough when I was practiced at it.
I'll probably leave it until last. That way I retain the practice for Skyrim.

Kivan and team UOP,

Here are two screenshots done with formid finder. I noticed the spelling mistake in the nif file "brdige" instead of "bridge". Maybe that's why your fix doesn't work?

http://tesnexus.com/imageshare/image.php?id=104974
http://tesnexus.com/imageshare/image.php?id=104975

Hope this helps!

Ironically, if you used formID finder, neither of those contain the formID. 90C68 is the ID of the object definition.
You can do this much more simply by opening the console with the ` key and clicking the object then writing down the ID at the top of the screen. That's all that's required.
However what you'll probably find is that the first two digits aren't 00. I don't see this object in that cell. It appears a mod added it.

Alright, I'll go back and write down the ID. The thing is, I don't use mods that alter bridges, at least I don't think I do.

I'll be right back

EDIT: okay, I've looked it up in the CS. Here is the file, under "worldobjects -> static -> bravil -> BravilBrdigeendpoint01", ref 00090c68. In game, I get this: 0000CE5A and 0000CE59

Verified those are the correct ID's (they are) and yes the UOP fixed both. Went there (cell is -6,34) and was able to ride a horse under both stays. Summoned a Minotaur and it fit under both too. :shrug:

doh..did not read cleary enough..

Alright, then something must be overriding the UOP in my modlist. Thanks for taking the time to check it out!

Heya, nice to see you're back in action! (y)

Anyways, There is this "bug" with UOP, if you would call it that. In vanilla Oblivion, the silver weaponry scabbard are quite bugged (with the colours and all) and they got fixed in the original UOP with black leather/a bit silver. But then in the supplement patch they got a whole new makeover. With pure silver appearnace but still, the weapon icons shows it got the black leather/a bit silver style instead, as the vanilla/UOP patched oblivion.

Any ideas?

Don't know if you're still taking submissions but I ran into a couple of minor things concerning NPCs with the latest UOP and supplementals. First, Wilbur at the Count's Arms in Anvil follows me around like a suspicious shopkeeper instead of staying behind the counter like other innkeepers. Next, the NPCs in Skingrad have a conversation topic about Falcar in the local mage's guild, but Falcar is actually in Cheydinhal not Skingrad. That's all I've got for now!

Thanks. I will have a look at that... thrown it in the To Do.




Sure am... always. Even after Skyrim's out I will still be collecting finds. Nice find... I was surprised as I thought we'd fixed that one long ago, but there they are unfixed. They are the "Things at the Mages Guild seem tense. That Falcar fellow sure keeps a tight rein on things." and "Falcar at the Mages Guild seems to be angry all the time. I avoid him when I can." lines. Thanks for pointing that out.

What I'm planning on is to release the UOP just as the small update, not the massive 120MB archive, so a new install will need both. This is good for two reasons: there are vastly more existing installs of now than there will be new as Oblivion isn't a new title, and also it enables me to quickly fix it if there are problems found. After a month or two of stability, I'll upload the huge complete one. That way I can sneak in any small fixes we might encounter in the interim.

Back to work.

Hi Kivan! Sorry it's taken me so long to get back to you on the "differences between WEPON fixes and UOP/USIP".

I finally had a chance to start tonight. I spent 2 or 3 hours recording differences between the latest UOPS/USIPS and WEPON, and the reasoning behind the changes I've made, only to remember that I've already done so! These two pages on the Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages already describe all WEPON fixes that are not copied over to UOPS/USIPS, along with the argument for making the changes:
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Unresolved_Minor_Issues, http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Shivering:Unresolved_Minor_Issues

I believe that referencing those pages, in conjunction with comparing the "Fixes Only" WEPON with UOPS in TES4Edit, would be the fastest way to make a decision on what to add to UOP/USIP. (If the reasoning for any WEPON changes is unclear, let me know.)

Will this approach give you what you need? Or would you still like me to write out the differences, the reasons for those differences, and their Base IDs?



Edit: These are the only changes in WEPON that ARE NOT recorded on the UESP pages listed above.
55FB2 (Grummite Deathdealer): USIPS gives it two Grummite Bows by mistake; this should be changed to 1.
16CF4, 1F3CD (Amber Sword Matrix and Madness Sword Matrix): The names should be changed to ___ Longsword Matrix, to match how the weapons themselves are named.

OK, had a look at those pages. I bookmarked the SI one for now and did the changes for the UOP one:

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Battle Axe of Fracturing. In every weapon set Dwarven and better, the four Blade weapons have generic Disintegrate Weapon versions, and the four Blunt weapons have generic Disintegrate Armor versions. The only exception is the Glass set, which is missing this weapon.
In order to fix this I'd have to create the item, add the LL0 leveled list and add that into the higher-order one. I'll leave this one.

Arrow of Hexing. This is the only ammunition found in the Construction Set that does not exist in-game.
I'll leave this one as well; there are other arrow sets that don't have a damage or even drain magicka effect entry. It doesn't have an LL0 leveled list entry either; if it did I would definitely say it was an oversight and put it in.

Generic magic weapons missing from NPC weapon lists. These weapons are missing from the LL1NPCStaff2Greater100 used in NPC inventories: Greater Staff of the Weary (missing from list entirely), Greater Staff of Corrosion (missing from level 17 of the list only).
Greater Staff of the Weary is a member of LL1NPCStaff2GreaterLvl100, which is a member of LL2NPCStaffLvl100, which is carried by 4 NPC's. Not unused, just not random loot. Greater Staff of Corrosion is a member of 4 LL0 lists, including that of liches. Also not unused.
Is there anything that indicates that they should be a member of any others? Otherwise I should just leave this one.

Soul Trap Weapons on NPC weapon lists. The NPC Battle Axe weapon lists include Soul Trap weapons, while the NPC War Axe weapon lists do not. Soul Trap enchantments provide no benefit to NPCs (NPCs will not recharge their weapons even if they are carrying Soul Gems), so these Battle Axes likely are erroneous additions.
I wouldn't get rid of these as I have been in battle with an NPC who used a soul trap effect on the player and it's rather creepy. Adds to the game that they can do things that you'd only expect from the player.

Claymore of Jinxing. The Unofficial Oblivion Patch renames this weapon Claymore of Curses. This is likely a mistake.
Nope... well, not to me at least. The Curses items use the 30-magnitude enchantment but the Jinxing ones use the 20. This was a Jinxing one that used a 30, so it either had the wrong enchantment or name. To not weaken it as this wasn't necessary, I changed the name instead.

Mace of Doom. This weapon, which is not normally found in game, is incorrectly characterized as a Bladed weapon.
This item was never supposed to be seen by the player as with the whole area it's in, so fixing it would be like arranging tree placement outside the invisible borders. I'll leave this one.

Rusty Iron Bow, Rusty Iron War Axe. Most Rusty Iron weapons have 70-75% the damage of their regular Iron counterparts. The exceptions are these weapons, which have 100% and 63% respectively (8/8 and 5/8) the damage of their regular Iron counterparts.
Fixed. Changed both to 6.

Rusty Iron Dagger (CGIronDagger used in the Tutorial Dungeon). This version has the same damage (5 points) as a regular Iron Dagger.
Fixed. Changed to 3.

Arrow of Discord. This is the only arrow in Oblivion with an area effect that does not have a -5 modifier to damage.
Fixed. Changed to 4.

Rusty Iron Bow, Rusty Iron Shortsword. Most Rusty Iron weapons have half the health of their regular Iron counterparts. These two weapons are the exceptions--they have 80% and 57% the health of their regular Iron counterparts (90/112 and 56/98) respectively.
Fixed. Changed to 56 and 49 respectively.

Rusty Iron Dagger (CGIronDagger used in the Tutorial Dungeon). This version has significantly more health than most Rusty Iron Daggers (60 instead of 35).
Fixed. Changed to 35.

Dwarven Arrow. Most standard ammunition weighs the same as its enchanted varieties. However, the Dwarven Arrow weighs 0.15 pounds, while all enchanted versions weigh 0.1 pounds. Since arrows of both lower and higher quality than the Dwarven Arrow also weigh 0.1 pounds, the standard arrow's weight likely is a mistake.
Agreed that this appears to be a mistake for that very reason. Surprised I didn't catch that one before. Well, that's why there are forums. Fixed to 0.1.

Silver Claymore, Claymore of Depletion, Claymore of Dispel, Claymore of Jinxing, Claymore of Sapping. The Silver Claymore and its enchanted counterparts weigh the same as the Dwarven Claymore (38 pounds). Meanwhile, the Steel Claymore weapons weigh a full 12 pounds less (26). It is likely the Silver Claymore weapons were meant to weigh 32 pounds instead.
Fixed. Changed to 32. (Also Claymore of Jinxing was already changed to Claymore of Curses as noted above as it has the 30 magnitude enchantment.)

Steel Battle Axe, Battle Axe of Diminishing, Quality Battle Axe Ember, Quality Battle Axe Soul Trap, Quality Battle Axe Spark. Typically, Battle Axes increase in weight by 7 pounds for each increase in material quality. The exception is the Steel set, which at 35 pounds weighs 8 pounds more than the Iron set and 6 pounds less than the Silver set. Interestingly, at 30.6 pounds the Fine Steel Battle Axe only has the correct weight if all Steel Battle Axes are reduced to 34 pounds.
Fixed. Changed to 34.

Fine Steel Dagger. Virtually all Fine weapons weigh 90% of their regular counterparts. This weapon is the only exception (3.5 pounds instead of 3.6 pounds).
Can't believe I have to write up about an 0.1 discrepancy. Fixed.

Rusty Iron Bow. Most Rusty Iron weapons are worth about one third the value of their regular Iron counterparts. This weapon is the exception - it is worth 91% (10/11) the value of its regular Iron counterpart.
Fixed. Changed to 3.

Rusty Iron Dagger (CGIronDagger used in the Tutorial Dungeon). This version is worth more than the normal Rusty Iron Dagger (5 gold instead of 2).
Fixed. Changed to 2.

Longsword of Depletion, Longsword of Dispel, Longsword of Frost (Martin's version), Longsword of Jinxing, Longsword of Sapping. Most generic magic weapons have the same base gold value as their unenchanted counterparts. However, these weapons only have a base value of 80 gold, while the Silver Longsword is worth 125 gold.
Fixed. Changed to 125.

Rugdumph's Sword. Most enchanted Silver Claymores have the same base gold value as their unenchanted counterparts. This weapon, however, has a base value of 125 gold instead of 130.
Fixticated. Changified five-fold to one-thirty-point-nilification.

Battle Axe of Jinxing, Claymore of Jinxing. The Unofficial Oblivion Patch erroneously assigns these weapons the same enchantments as ...of Curses class weapons.
Battle Axe was changed by UOPS for some reason... changing it back. The Claymore unmodified has the 30-magnitude (Curses) not 20 (Jinxing) enchantment so the UOP renamed it to "Claymore of Curses".

War Axe of Enfeeblement. The Unofficial Oblivion Patch erroneously assigns this weapon the same enchantment as ...of Weakness class weapons.
Another UOPS change that will be undone.

Claymore of Jinxing. The Unofficial Oblivion Patch assigns this weapon more charges (1600) than most generic Silver magic weapons have (800).
You're right. I wonder why I thought it was half what it should have been. All of the others are 800. Back it goes.

Arrow of Cleansing, Arrow of Fire, Arrow of Hexing, Arrow of Immolation, Arrow of Jinxing, Arrow of the North Winds, Arrow of Savage Frost, Arrow of Silence, Arrow of Stillness, Arrow of Storm Strike, Stormcall Arrow. These arrows have random enchantment values, and, because enchantments factor into a weapon's gold value, these arrows have gold values that frequently exceed higher quality arrows, or lag behind lower quality arrows.
I don't see the problem... they all have the same value as their base unenchanted counterparts (which you indicated was correct above: "Most generic magic weapons have the same base gold value as their unenchanted counterparts".)

Akavari Warblade [sic]. Most Akaviri bladed weapons have a speed of 1 hit per second. At a speed of 0.9 hits per second, this is the only exception.
Fixed. Changed to 1.

Most magic staves have a Reach of 0. This can cause game crashes, especially in heavily modified games.
The bow reach crash/BSOD was immediately noticed by thousands of people right after Oblivion was released. It's also an engine fault caused by division by zero so is unaffected by mods (unless of course they change the bow reach!) It would also happen repeatedly and immediately whenever the player or an NPC equipped a bow with zero reach. Never seen anything on this in five years for staffs. I'd need some evidence showing this happens, otherwise have to conclude it's incorrect.

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This and auditing all the publicans for "creepy following" took an inordinate amount of time, so I must now attack the little remaining on my To Do list. Hope nothing else big turns up.

If you're going through the publicans, could you give Manheim Maulhand a services package that doesn't have armor unequipped? He has greaves, but no pants.

Or just give him pants

The perfectionists among us thank you!
I wanted to post a quick reply on all of those you decided not to implement, but of course it's your decision.




Yeah, I can understand your hesitation in adding weapons of dubious value. That said, I've already added the weapon, leveled list, etc. in WEPON so you could just import them from there The point is, the Oblivion generic magic weapon sets are all complete except for this one.




That's fair. I debated what to do with this in WEPON as well. In the end I included it, because I decided that if Bethesda left it in the game resources, they probably intended to include it in game. And I wondered if the empty arrow leveled list (which UOP removes) was meant to be for this arrow. I also figured more variety in enchanted ammunition wasn't a bad thing!




It is true that Greater Staff of the Weary and Greater Staff of Corrosion are both available in-game to NPCs. However, they are not available as frequently as weapons appearing both on LL1NPCStaff2Greater100 and LL1NPCStaff2GreaterLvl100. I would argue that Bethesda meant to include these two on Greater100, since they are both on GreaterLvl100, and all other "Greater" staffs appear on both lists.




Fine with me! Though if you do leave the Battle Axes alone then I'd recommend adding the War Axe equivalents to their leveled lists. (UOP does add a few, but not all of them.) It doesn't make any sense to me that the Battle Axe Soul Trap weapons are available, but not the War Axe ones.




Here's the reasons why I think the WEPON fix for this weapon are more in line with what Bethesda intended:

• All other silver Damage Magicka weapons are in the "...of Jinxing" class, with 800 charges. The only "...of Curses" weapon in vanilla Oblivion is an Ebony Bow, with 1600 charges. If this weapon is moved to the "...of Curses" class then the Silver group is missing one weapon.
  
• The UOP fix requires two changes: the weapon's name, and an increase from 800 charges to 1600 (though you did just undo the 1600 charges). My proposed fix only constitutes one change: the enchantment itself. That fix also brings the Claymore in line with all other Silver weapons.

That said, I can understand your thinking on this! I just believe Bethesda screwed up the enchantment, rather than both the name and the charges.




Speaking of which, I do have some floating rocks in Elsewyr you could work on...




I find myself completely lacking a response here




Well, I'm using bad terminology here. First, I should have said "random charge sizes", not "random enchantment values". Second, "base gold values" and "gold values" mean two different things to me. The base gold value is the value of the unenchanted version of that weapon/ammo, and the gold value is the base gold value plus the gold value due to the magic enchantment & charges. So, what I'm saying is that, even though the BASE gold values of all of these arrows make sense, the random charge sizes of these arrows make their final gold values...well, random. That's why in-game we frequently find fairly weak enchanted arrows that are more valuable than much stronger enchanted arrows.
For example: the Arrow of Stillness (Silence 20sec, Elven Arrow base, 156 value) is worth more than the Magebane Arrow (Silence in 10ft for 20sec, Daedric Arrow base, 147 value). This is because the Arrow of Stillness' number of charges is so much higher than the Magebane Arrow's. Setting the Arrow of Stillness' charges lower gives it a more reasonable gold value relative to Magebane.




Yeah, I think this was an unnecessary change on my part! Arthmoor & I previously discussed it, and now I agree there's no reason for it in UOP.

Actually I think in the case of this particular arrow the enchantment doesn't actually work so there's no point in putting it in and it smells more like an asset they forgot to remove.

The enchantment doesn't work? I hadn't noticed that. Yep, that's a good reason to leave it out then.

Just to be sure: the 0-reach staffs don't cause issues with mods that allow the use of staffs in melee?

Ever though of assigning race appropriate hair to the few NPCs that have none assigned, like Quill-Weave? This would stop her, say, from randomly getting Ren's hair every time the bashed patch is rebuilt.

A recent evening trip to Leyawiin reminded me of something I've been meaning to report for quite some time. The campfire at the rear of White Stallion Lodge doesn't illuminate its surroundings. Whether this is a vanilla fault or not I do not know. I do know that if I approach the lodge with torch in hand, at a certain distance torchlight is visible on the building wall (and elsewhere), though the campfire, which is closer to the structure, casts no light.

-Decrepit-

Probably, but they would have to change some non-zero others too as their reach values aren't appropriate, so they may as well change the zero ones too.



Looks like Arthmoor already took care of Quill-Weave (figures ) as she acquired "hair" between 3.2.0 and now. Got a list of the others? I can find it if not.



Noted and thanks.