» Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:38 pm
I've read 2 or 3 pages of this and I just can't take it anymore.
I just can't.
Some of you... just.. :dead:
The worst part is that most of your arguments are;
1) based on data and trends from at least 3 years ago, often closer to 6.
2) usually more dependent on the engine (ie; the game itself) than the hardware as pertaining to actual results (eg; number of cores you have vs what performance you'll get).
Some of the crap you guys have been peddling as facts.. or rationality.. Akatosh save me.
Anyway. I'm building a new rig just in time for Skyrim, which is a happy coincidence. All I am wondering about is the maximum memory usage we'll have (I'm going to have 16gb of ddr3 - and yes, I'm very aware I won't be close to all of it for many years), and the optimization of the cores (as I'll have 6 - once again, I'm aware of the excess, thankyou), and how many its "built" for (I suspect core2duo and quad core i7 optimization). Anyone who starts rambling about pedantic [censored] to try to show how much they know; saying it'll run fine even if its only really designed for a dual core or what have you.. I'll just ignore. Yes, yes, you're very knowledgeable, we're all very impressed, and equally, I'm not a simpleton.
I'm getting a hex-core CPU. I'm tempted so badly to just say that, and wait for the first moron to say "LUL DERS NO SUCH THING U PROLBY MEAN ONE OF THOSE MOTHERBOARDS WITH MORE THAN ONE CPU SOCKET LUL" - symptomatic of point 1 - and then pounce with a vengeance.
I'll do it though, i7 980. While yes, I'm very aware at the present time 6 cores is overkill as it generally won't be optimally utilized, neither am I new to this. The same happened with the introduction of the quad cores. I'm building this machine for the long run. Not to mention the clock speed is fine, 3.33 with a 3.60 "turbo boost" (No, I don't need you to tell me that's just a factory preset overclock).
I finished typing this up, and I realised I had a sort of basic guide for those of you who are hardware illiterate. Apparently you frustrated me enough to type this all. So enjoy.
So I don't know a thing about this hardware business. I want to play Skyrim. What do I need to know, without getting too technical on my plebeian proverbial?
Well first off you need to be aware that all this computer magubbins is not as simple as I'm going to try to make it for you. Everything depends on everything else. However, a general rule of thumb is you get what you pay for. The more expensive, the better, and you will notice results.
Graphics Cards:
Please note I didn't say GPU. This is because I know what I'm talking about, and am not simply trying to sound smart. Basically the GPU is the processor that handles the graphics, but it is not the be all and end all of a graphics card.
People after new graphics cards - be aware that benchmark results do not merely depend on the graphics cards, and especially not just the GPU itself. Nor does the performance you'll get in a game, or even the framerate or what graphics settings you'll be able to use. Remember I said everything depends on everything else? Also internet benchmarks are generally unreliable. Look around, they'll contradict each other. This is because most of these benchmarks are consumer submitted (submitted by people like you and me, and everything depends on what? Exactly. They all have different systems around their cards, and so get different results. Not to mention that different benchmarking methods... Look we'll leave it at that okay?). Note I didn't say GPU, because that's not all that matters on a graphics card. Everything matters on a graphics card. VRAM, GPU clock speed, even cooling. To buy a card based on only one factor is folly.
I'd prioritize in this order:
- Roughly how much can I spend?
more = better.
- Has it got decent cooling?
If it's a s[censored]y tiny fan, I wouldn't risk it if I were you. Not if you want to push the card for a few years. If it has lots of metal fins, pipes, and a nice chunky radiator, or multiple fans.. That's a good thing. Trust me, when you're pushing what your card can handle, it's detrimental to its lifespan, and it gets damn hot. So you want to keep it cool and give it the best chance of reaching old age you can.
- How much VRAM has it got?
People think this is much more important than it actually is, but its helpful.
- How much is it and what series number has it got?
Spend as much as I can and look for the highest series number. Eg; get a 580 instead of a 570, if I'm satisfied with all the prior points.
Also the Nvidia vs ATI race has basically cooled. Now you'll basically get the same sort of results for the same sort of money. Personally I'm going for a GTX570 (a good version) because I've been reading all sorts of confusing as hell stuff about the different ATI cards and what they're designed for, plus general consensus is that the 580 is the best inclusive of ATI, and this factory overclocked, masterfully cooled 570 isn't too far off. Also considerably cheaper. Basically I'd just buy whatever is most expensive that you can afford, and make sure it has good cooling. I've burnt out graphics cards before, you don't want that.
Also be aware, your PSU (Power Supply) does matter, but unless you're running SLI, or CROSSFIRE (that's multiple graphics cards guys), or a bucketload of hard drives, you should be fine if your upgrade is marginal - ie; going from a 9 series geforce to a 250 or something, not a 6 to a 500. 500W/600W is generally enough for a basic "generic" modern system. If you have anything less than about a GTX 250, go pick up something for ~$100. It'll be an improvement. Be aware of bottlenecking your system, unless you have a good dual core, you'll get a heavy bottleneck on a graphics card that level or above. Also be aware new cards are massive. If you're running a geforce 7 series or earlier, also note you may not have any PCI-E slots on your motherboard. Really, its time for an upgrade (of your whole PC).
CPUs:
As for CPUs, Intel. As much as you can spend. That's that sorted. If you're buying a CPU generally you'll need to buy a new motherboard as well. AMD are dead and for good reason (7 years ago they were generally better. That was 7 years ago.) Anyone who is new to PC's, you can only put certain CPU's on certain motherboards. Be aware of that. If you didn't know that, do not build it yourself. It'll only go badly. For the rest of you, keep in mind you'll need an X58 board for a high end i7.
If you insist on building a system yourself, find a CPU you want, and buy a motherboard for it. Core2Duo's and I think Core2Quads (I don't use one and I'm not checking for you, you have google too) both use LGA775 sockets, screw i5s frankly (if you're going to upgrade, get a damn i7.. also see the point about googling), and i7s use 1366.
If you want to overclock, please don't use the damn stock fans they give you. It's insulting.
If you're buying a new PC I would personally stress spending as much as you can on a CPU, at the expense of other components. Other parts (graphics cards, hard drives, RAM) are much easier to upgrade later. For this reason I'd suggest getting a beefy PSU as well.
Memory/RAM:
If you're confused about the difference between "memory" and "RAM" see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdREEcfaihg.
I'd suggest you won't need or even make use of any more than 4gb of memory (I'm aware of how it looks when I said I'm getting 16gb). 4gb is normal these days. With memory, amount is more important than speed (though speed is always good). If you don't have 4gb, you have no excuse. It's cheap. If you aren't running a 64bit Operating System (then you are running 32-bit aka x86), you can't use more than 3.7gb of that RAM. If you're using 64-bit (x64) operating system, you can basically run as much as your motherboard will support. Most newer consumer level motherboards will support 24gb.
I'm ugly so I need a tl;dr:
Guys, if you have anything similar to what I'm running RIGHT now (minus my upgrades since I bought it)...
- Intel Core2Duo e6400, 2 cores @ 2.13gHz
- Nvidia GeForce NX7950GT (Now running Nvidia GTX250 it's heavily bottlenecked but I fried my NX7950GT - for the purposes of this pretend i still have the 7 series)
- 1gb ddr2 RAM. (I now have 4gb RAM, pretend I still have 1 for the purpose of this again.. Believe you me, getting 4gb is a massive performance increase overall)
Then it's probably time for an upgrade. That is, if you want to play Skyrim without going totally insane.
If you have a dual core of ~3gHz or better, you have 4gb of RAM and you have a decent graphics card, you'll most likely be fine running on reasonable settings. If you want max performance, I'd say 6gb of RAM just in case the game can make use of it, a 3gHz or faster i7, and a 5 series Nvidia card (don't know enough about ATI to comment on those). Though its likely even top systems won't be able to fully max out.
To finish:
Reason I didn't talk about PSU much or anything else stupid is because it won't give you better performance. You just need enough wattage for what you're running. Use a power supply calculator (google it). Getting a reputable brand is important for any component, including power supply (I'd probably stress it most for PSU, a dodgy one is easy to buy by accident, and can harm your other parts - its impossible to buy a bad brand CPU for example), but whoever said wattage wasn't important, just brand.. wow.
Keep in mind all PSU's (even reputable brand ones) should be considered to have a +/- 5% of actual wattage vs stated wattage. ie; buy a 500W, you might only get 450W. You might also get 550W. So keep some room. Also if you like hard drives (I'll have 12tb soon - that's ~12000gb's), be aware they svck power.
To the OP:
Don't know if this is worth a quote, but it might be something to think about. Also I'll edit this up if needed.
Aside from that, I hope this helped some of you. Thanks for reading.
Also people like the guy who's already nitpicking (incorrectly so) are the reason for it.
