I find it odd you won't answer the question but okay. But since you like Skyrim's UI(I think), well go with that. So you like one button hotkeys and agree with there inclusion in Skyrim for map,etc, yes I assume. You do like that there making more information available on screen because of the higher resolutions. And you don't like delays or load times after all you always recommend people to get SSD but you can tolerate a short load time, correct? I just want to know your opinion not what is in Skyrim right now but if you like whats in SR and think those were the right choices to make.

Did you ever use the DarnUI mod for OB, that had a grid system, but instead of the random clutter of MW(which also had icons,just not as many as darn), it had icons you could click on for item,weapons,etc that would collaspe or open that group of items. Like the keyring for Fallout. That way you would not have the clutter, could still find everything and it was all on one screen. But I do see reasons to go with a list view. I hope your right about the dial I read it as click to bring up a dial then, etc ,etc

Even if you did not use them mods like DarnUI were very popular.

I am a pretty patient guy, so UI load times were far from my mind. I do agree that there's room for improvement, but FO3 was far from the worst UI experience I've had. In fact, if you've ever played Mass Effect 1 on the 360, you'll know how a bad UI feels.

I think that considering the overwhelming support the 360 UI has gotten from reviewers, it's safe to say that they're working on on improving it. Todd has said there will be a seperate UI for PC (correct me if I'm wrong, can't find a source), so my assumption is they'll work just as hard on the PC UI. Typically they work side by side with all of their platforms (OB PS3 and MW 360 are exceptions).

Bethesda likes how the interface has been evolving so, for those who didn't like the interface at the latest games, Skyrim's one will svck at best. And I'm a liker of the MW interface also.

I hope your correct. Skyrim is fixing a lot of issue from past games. Fixing scaling,having a more varied world unlike OB,using both kind of travel methods,etc. So I do have hope. And either way the game will still be absurdly awesome.

DarnUI or wz inventory? I think the two mods were compatible but I'm pretty sure the http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/images/10763-2-1205949211.jpg was Oblivion's list system with smaller text, at least tripling the number of items you see at once. I greatly prefer this because I can see my items' stats without hovering over them.

Wz did it first but Darn in a later version did it better, because you could go back and forth between the two, use whichs ever was best at the time in game. By clicking on some icon in the corner of the inventory screen. Now that was awesome. Gird, click, list, click nah I want grid again click,etc

I don't like delay without reason but if that delay is half a second because the map is zooming out to show the entire world, that is fine. Delay is unacceptable except when it's miniscule and has a purpose. Now if the load on the menu was it taking half a second to load the menu with no visual effect, then no and then I would be pissed that I wasted hundreds of dollars on my SSDs.

Hmm, I guess I never noticed that button. Is it that little diamond in the top left corner? Cool feature, but nothing that compares to being able to view/rotate every item and even every spell in 3D.

That's what I prefer, as well. I like to have my items' names and important information laid out in a way easy to see and read. A proper list, though, can not just be alphabetical by item name. You need to be able to reorganize it according to any number of variables to make it easier to use or find what you want, without knowing the specifics.

For example, I should be able to reorganize the list according to item condition, damage, armor value, weight, item value, etc.

Well said. I think everyone's tolerance to this is different. If I press a button twice because I didn't think it did anything the first time, then I have an issue with the UI. Also, the Fable 3 "talk" mechanic where you have to hold down "A" to do anything in that game severly annoyed me.

Ok, now were getting somewere. I think were on the same page here for something. See below.



Yes I think it is(been a while). Your correct about the zoom thing, this feature adds to the gameplay, it not just oh it looks cools, it looks cool and adds to the gameplay. Solving puzzles and whatnot. The map may also do this but I don't know. This could justify a delay because it not just a negative.

Which was my point about removing hotkeys,loadtimes,etc I do not see how anyone could feel that those thing added to FO3 or OB it was only a negative, nothing better was in its place. Thats was my point. I am unsure about SR, but we can use Beth past games to make educated guesses. For example the graphics I assume they would be similar across all systems with pc getting only minor enhancement out of the box for AA and high res. Because FO3 did the that. And it seems to be the case. 2 games in a row screwed up UI(imo) so I am worried about SR UI, I think that does make sense.

Btw, I love when reasonable discussion happens with good back and forth. I wish there was more of it on this board.

Hahaha I'm PC first and console second, but + 1 to this.

Have patience little PClings. A half second extra isn't that bad.

You know the half second affects the consoles too right, and there are plenty of other reasons besides that.

Intertesting thing I notice about the delay. Unlike other things people bring up and some one else disagrees with, no one who said there not bothered by delay in past games is saying it is a good thing, they prefer it like that, just that it does not bother them. Compare that to say people talking about fast travel or attributes,etc

Also someone should note, WHY WOULD WE WANT TO DO ANYTHING LIKE APPLE

The PC UI will be horrible just like all Bethesda games post-Morrowind. It's okay though, we'll have UI mods 3 days after release to make it svck less. Just like Obliv ... and Fallout 3 ... and Fallout: NV.

Itunes UI svcks why not make it more like Audio monkey; hey audio monkey can play all media formats to.

But seriously day one UI mods.

Yes but the Fallout mods could do very little because of the nature of the UI. If I knew SR UI could be messed with like OB I wound not be concern nearly as much.

Morrowind was honestly the only Elder Scrolls game with a practical mouse-driven interface. Daggerfall's inventory was limited to 4 visible slots at a time, and let's not even get started on Arena with the awful NEXT/PREVIOUS buttons.

As long as the Skyrim UI is formatted in XML or some other comprehensible format, I don't really mind. Having to mod add in completely obvious things that should've shipped with the game like spell removal in Oblivion is kind of a joke. But I can kind of understand the UI being a matter of preference. Unfortunately with the giant 3D renderings and fancy constellations I'm not quite sure if it'll be as easy to pull a DarN on the interface this time around.


Covered in large, obnoxious gradients and minimalist hipster iconography. Thankfully I don't think they quite went that far.

Ha! I don't recall Daggerfall UI being that bad, but I did not play for long though.

If I don't care about it, I don't care about it. It's not important enough in my eyes to care, so I can't force myself to care that you care. That aside I think you missed something I was saying..

What does "You know the half second affects the consoles too right, and there are plenty of other reasons besides that." mean? I said I'm PC first. That means I am a PC player who owns a console and sometimes plays on it. I don't care about a half second lag in Oblivion, nor do I care about the fact that I have to stupidly mouse over each individual object in Morrowind to see what it even is, nor do I care about these two things people find annoying in BGS's past TES games in a future TES (including Skyrim) on any system.

I said + 1 to the console comment because he was just throwing a little bit of PC users own apathy at them with the argument that making mods to fix problems is about as considerate of all platforms as making one UI for them.

There are plenty of other reason I have concerns about the UI and I think there was been issue with it, I wrote then in the opening post.

I did not miss what you were saying, you don't care but you also did not say you thought having longer loadtimes, less hotkeys,etc was better, just that it did not bother you. So unlike other issues like Fast travel or attribute,etc were people are do think that the removal is good or not no one here has actually thinks that the concept of longer load time,etc is better. So many people on PC do care, other don't either way sounds like the UI adjustments I am speaking would be a very good idea for pc. As some would not care and more would be happy with the improvement.

I have added this to the first post:
I am noticing something interesting, most people agree that longer loadtimes are worse than shorter ones, that removing hotkeys is a bad idea and more information on screen is a good idea. There has yet to be a person that seem to disagree with the concept in principle, only those that don't care or are not bothered by such things. If this is the case, then it would be good to see these idea taken into consideration by Beth. As the players that currently don't care won't be affect and most that do could end up with a better UI.

I don't know I get what you're saying. It wouldn't upset me if we had insta load times and dungeons and interiors that didn't have to load..but idc if we do.

my main concern with the ui or any mouse controlled interface in particular is the mouse acceleration and mouse lag issues.

some of you might remember or still currently continue to be baffled by the sheer frustration that can ensue with the mouse accelerated ui and toehr crap in F3 and NV...i cant even get back into those games because of this one issue, and i wont ever try again either

im sick of game controls being ported directly form console controls, the most obvious of which is a prime example is mouse acceleration, because the gamepads use this method in the dual anologues its usually forgotten about by devs when porting their titles to pc.

i will most likely get skyrim, but if there is any form of mouse lag or mouse acceleration in the without any work around to fix it, im not going to keep playing the game, thats how much it [censored]in frustrates me.

but anyways... yeah, PC gamers dont sit 10 feet away from their monitors (unless we want to) so why do we need interfaces that could be read from 20 feet away as if it was ripped straight from the top lines of an eye doctors letter chart.

the most suitable thing to so would be to have the ui and most things withing it scalable, its not too difficult a thing to do really

Oh man, this. Although it doesn't bother me to the point where I would stop playing a game. But when using a game interface, my mouse should feel exactly like it feels when I'm just using a Windows application.

You see to get it quite well. It does not bother you either way.Your a pc player who did not bother with DarnUI because it did not matter to you, if it did/have the things I say your fine with it, if not your fine with that. Most ideas on these forums have people strongly against or for. While these basic UI ideas(stuff that has been done in past games) seem to be only a net plus for pc users. Plus there simple(another thing over looked by people wanting to add this or that, or make some change to x, that ignore the dev time required).

In other words the stuff makes so much sense that no one is against the core ideas in theory more or less.