[Jade Barnes-Mackey]

You're one to talk; my mother is a bandit

Good point. Me and your mother got on quite well LAST NIGHT IN BED.

I was just suggesting that he could maybe make more of his posts and elaborate more on how the steel is made so that it defines his character as a very skilled, and needed, smith. I didn't mean to come off in a way that sounded as if I was berating him for following game mechanics to a T. However now that I've gone back and read it a few times I can see how it would be interpreted that way; I kinda went off on a tangent halfway through .

I simply wanted to elaborate on how steel is made so that he might perhaps in turn work it into the RP to add more of a realistic feel to what Gorbad (the character) is doing. Instead of saying he dropped corundum and iron into a smelter and out popped steel he could explain the process a little more in depth to show that it is complicated, and few can do it right. It would make his character sound like a much more valuable asset to Valton. As I said in my earlier post, if it was as simple as throwing some ore into a big melting pot and letting it liquefy then what's the point of having an extremely talented smith do it?

Again, I didn't intend to make it sound as though I was telling him "No you're doing that wrong do it this way," but more like "Hey, maybe you could work this into your posts to make smithing things more interesting and give it some pizzazz."

Also, there's a difference between game mechanics and lore. Game mechanics are things implemented to make the game run properly and function as a video game. Lore is the world that the game is based off of. At least that's how I see it. I would never run around going "And Fred shot a fireball at Bob who retaliated by using a paralyze rune on Fred. Fred dodge it and used ice spear on Bob," which is what you do in the games because there is no possibly way to convey the concept of magick (which has infinite possibilities) through a video game that runs on absolute values and scripts.

Placing corundum and iron ore into a smelter, and doing nothing else, to create steel is a game mechanic in my point of view. Since there is no absolute value in reality for things of that nature (There's no such thing as 1 iron ore + 1 corundum ore = 1 steel ingot. There are specific proportions and what not you have to follow), I believe that particular game mechanic can be ignored and replaced with a more immersive and realistic one.

Aah, in which case, I take back my rather snappy rant too. I totally agree with the point that detail is best - actually I think Gorbad is generally really good at this. He gives the mundane a lot of love (one of the main reasons I picked him as a GM).

The only bit of what you say I do have issue with is

Also, there's a difference between game mechanics and lore.

Which to me is tantamount to saying gameplay and story are something different in games (They are not). The gameplay itself is a text. Of course there are degrees to how seriously we should take it, many mechanics clearly should not be taken seriously, and are a simplification. A part the in-game sources tend to play is filling in the gaps, and helping the bits that don't make sense to fit into the world we are meant to be inhabiting. Gameplay mechanics are part of the lore, but often the part we can toy with the most. The connection between magicka reserves and the casting of spells, for instance, is something we only learn from gameplay. When we write, we can build on this, but also ignoring the bits that are clearly there for the structure of the game (like the numbers, or certain rigid spell structures). I'm not one for making big distinctions. Everything is lore, but some lore we are meant to take more seriously than other bits, is all I'm saying. Broadly, I think we agree on this.

I was hoping for a positive response after it took me ages to fix up the sheet with Gorbad's points.
Ah *sigh*, let me just go to play some Bobby Mcferrin's 'Don't Worry, Be Happy' for a moment..

*comes back sniffing* I'll just give him up, I suppose. Hard crush on the old morale in me though.

Ah man, I'm really sorry. I feel like such a swit for this. Honestly I love the CS (especially the first one), might be my favourite CS we've had in the entire RP. But it just didn't fit. Maybe you could try it in OPAP or somewhere? Sounds like such an awesome character.

[latrina]

Good point. Me and your mother got on quite well LAST NIGHT IN BED.

I feel so sorry for you...

[CRuzIta LUVz grlz]

Good point. Me and your mother got on quite well LAST NIGHT IN BED.



Aah, in which case, I take back my rather snappy rant too. I totally agree with the point that detail is best - actually I think Gorbad is generally really good at this. He gives the mundane a lot of love (one of the main reasons I picked him as a GM).

The only bit of what you say I do have issue with is



Which to me is tantamount to saying gameplay and story are something different in games (They are not). The gameplay itself is a text. Of course there are degrees to how seriously we should take it, many mechanics clearly should not be taken seriously, and are a simplification. A part the in-game sources tend to play is filling in the gaps, and helping the bits that don't make sense to fit into the world we are meant to be inhabiting. Gameplay mechanics are part of the lore, but often the part we can toy with the most. The connection between magicka reserves and the casting of spells, for instance, is something we only learn from gameplay. When we write, we can build on this, but also ignoring the bits that are clearly there for the structure of the game (like the numbers, or certain rigid spell structures). I'm not one for making big distinctions. Everything is lore, but some lore we are meant to take more seriously than other bits, is all I'm saying. Broadly, I think we agree on this.



Ah man, I'm really sorry. I feel like such a swit for this. Honestly I love the CS (especially the first one), might be my favourite CS we've had in the entire RP. But it just didn't fit. Maybe you could try it in OPAP or somewhere? Sounds like such an awesome character.

How do you write such long posts...?

[jesse villaneda]

A lot of ranting in here lately, what's going on?

Not really much for Roymund to be doing until Jormaw sorts out his wound. Unless someone comes across to talk to him, or something similiar, i wont be posting until Daroska arrives.

Alguidar can also take care of that, he has some alchemy skills. It could be more interesting to have Jormaw heal Roymund because of the events with the farmer but if you just want to get that out of the way while Jormaw's busy, you also have that option.

I'll post tonight, guys.

Oh, you big tease!

[Dan Wright]

About Roymunds arm, there a priest / healer in town now, so you could have Roymund stumble upon him instead of searching for Jormaw. (since the job of a healer is to heal, and now we got one )

And about the new character: If I understood right, disturbing's character is to be a guard in Valton? In that case, is it OK if I edit in that into the "Class" section of the char-sheet?


*Ahem* Now I feel like I must read through the ranting.

I was just suggesting that he could maybe make more of his posts and elaborate more on how the steel is made so that it defines his character as a very skilled, and needed, smith. I didn't mean to come off in a way that sounded as if I was berating him for following game mechanics to a T. However now that I've gone back and read it a few times I can see how it would be interpreted that way; I kinda went off on a tangent halfway through .

I simply wanted to elaborate on how steel is made so that he might perhaps in turn work it into the RP to add more of a realistic feel to what Gorbad (the character) is doing. Instead of saying he dropped corundum and iron into a smelter and out popped steel he could explain the process a little more in depth to show that it is complicated, and few can do it right. It would make his character sound like a much more valuable asset to Valton. As I said in my earlier post, if it was as simple as throwing some ore into a big melting pot and letting it liquefy then what's the point of having an extremely talented smith do it?

Again, I didn't intend to make it sound as though I was telling him "No you're doing that wrong do it this way," but more like "Hey, maybe you could work this into your posts to make smithing things more interesting and give it some pizzazz."

I appreciate feed-back of how I can improve my posts, but honestly, I didn't think it'd be very interesting to read about how the corundum bubbled while Gorbad was moving it around and taking the good stuff out of it, before adding some iron into the mix and repeating the process 12 times. (I actually never thought of doing it that way either, it just didn't feel important. It's the actually smithing that is the hard part, not the melting of the ore).
But now that you've pointed out that it could perhaps be worth it, I'll put more detail into the smithing and actually note the melting of the ore as a hard part. But right now it'd feel just a bit weird to in my next post have Gorbad suddenly become puzzled and very concentrated on the smelter, when he earlier sort of just shrugged and yawned while doing it... But let's just explain that with "he was actually doing it the hard way all along, you just didn't read about it."

As for the whole lore-game mechanic compared to real-life, I agree with Vincent in that it is one universe TES is in and the lore is the same there. Thus, we should also RP by it. If there is something in lore that is done in a different way than it's done in real-life, then we should always follow the lore way. By following the game lore and lore outside games, we can actually create a new hold that fits seamlessly into the games and the non-game world, as if it was actually there.

But yeah, I'll try to make the simplified things in-game a bit more complicated in-RP to flesh out the story. But I also hope you understand how much more dull and simple a smiths job could potentially be written in an RP. To the point of where it's just "He molt some ore and made the spear, while waiting for the next customer". I've tried to make it a bit more interesting, and the smelting turning more complicated will do it. So, well, I guess I should say thanks for pointing that out.

[Rachel Eloise Getoutofmyface]

It just doesnt feel right when it lacks realism, Gorbad :/

[Sherry Speakman]

It just doesnt feel right when it lacks realism, Gorbad :/

Talking generally, or specifically about my latest post (in Rp thread, not here) O_o

[Rachel Cafferty]

About Roymunds arm, there a priest / healer in town now, so you could have Roymund stumble upon him instead of searching for Jormaw. (since the job of a healer is to heal, and now we got one )

And about the new character: If I understood right, disturbing's character is to be a guard in Valton? In that case, is it OK if I edit in that into the "Class" section of the char-sheet?


*Ahem* Now I feel like I must read through the ranting.

I appreciate feed-back of how I can improve my posts, but honestly, I didn't think it'd be very interesting to read about how the corundum bubbled while Gorbad was moving it around and taking the good stuff out of it, before adding some iron into the mix and repeating the process 12 times. (I actually never thought of doing it that way either, it just didn't feel important. It's the actually smithing that is the hard part, not the melting of the ore).
But now that you've pointed out that it could perhaps be worth it, I'll put more detail into the smithing and actually note the melting of the ore as a hard part. But right now it'd feel just a bit weird to in my next post have Gorbad suddenly become puzzled and very concentrated on the smelter, when he earlier sort of just shrugged and yawned while doing it... But let's just explain that with "he was actually doing it the hard way all along, you just didn't read about it."

As for the whole lore-game mechanic compared to real-life, I agree with Vincent in that it is one universe TES is in and the lore is the same there. Thus, we should also RP by it. If there is something in lore that is done in a different way than it's done in real-life, then we should always follow the lore way. By following the game lore and lore outside games, we can actually create a new hold that fits seamlessly into the games and the non-game world, as if it was actually there.

But yeah, I'll try to make the simplified things in-game a bit more complicated in-RP to flesh out the story. But I also hope you understand how much more dull and simple a smiths job could potentially be written in an RP. To the point of where it's just "He molt some ore and made the spear, while waiting for the next customer". I've tried to make it a bit more interesting, and the smelting turning more complicated will do it. So, well, I guess I should say thanks for pointing that out.

I understand, and I think you've done a great job so far. As for adding detail I wasn't necessarily saying that you should detail how things boiled and bubbled around. Just that he was measuring out the right proportions of charcoal, corundum, and iron for the specific type of steel he wanted to make and how it was crucial he got the mix right, so that the steel wouldn't be too brittle or too flexible. Just things like that that get more in depth with the science of metallurgy, not necessarily the visual aspect of smelting or forging.

And as for the lore thing I think you guys have misunderstood what I was trying to say. I wasn't saying we should abandon lore for what is realistic. However there are some things that are present in the game that contradict how lore works.

In a game there are certain boundaries and limitations that wouldn't be there if it was real and followed lore to a T. I believe wholeheartedly in using lore to it's fullest potential and sticking to it as close as possible. Without the lore there is no TES universe. In games though there are set parameters for a ton of different things. Video games, at their most basic levels, run on scripts (lines of code with variables and conditions that allow the processor to process information and output a result). Scripts run on absolute values, therefore the amount and variance of the results you can receive is finite and limited.

I'll use magick once again to explain the point. In Skyrim when you have fireball equipped to your right hand and you press LMB a signal is sent to activate the fireball script. That script then runs through a set of "conditions" that checks for variables. These conditions run in a linear format, once one condition is met then the script moves to the next condition and so on until it runs into a condition it cannot meet and then terminates. For magick the most obvious condition would be if your magicka level, the variable, meets the required numerical value to execute the script.

A short version of this would look like this: (take into mind I'm not a scripter and this will no way work in a game, it's just to explain the concept. It's based off of some basic scripting I did in Morrowind a while back.)

Start "fireball_on_target"get_magickavalueif < 50 playsound "005673", Endif > 50 playsound "005674", activate_visualFX "005670", activate_damagetarget_fire "45", End.

However, theoretically it would be possible for a mage to cast a fireball even with a low magicka level. The fireball would be less powerful, but it would still be possible. The concept of magick can't be put into a game through scripting because with magick there are infinite possibilities and scripts run on absolutes. The same can be said with smithing, however, it would probably be possible to implement all the procedures into a game properly, but would take a lot of time. With smithing it's logical to say that even in TES universe melting metal X with metal Y and not having specific proportions would yield a different product every time. Even in TES universe there has to be specific proportions and formulas for creating things, without them yielding the same product over and over again would be impossible.

In Skyrim smithing, in my opinion, is a game mechanic. While not as obvious as the example I gave with magick, smtihing has been "dumbed down" to make it easier to understand. Yes melting metal X with metal Y in a smelter will create metal Z, but what would happen if you added three more metal X ores to the mix? In the game it's impossible to do this because it's a game mechanic and limited to certain values. Since an RP is not limited by game mechanics it then can be said that possibilities, such as altering the proportions of the different metals in an alloy, can be explored to their fullest potential.

While I don't believe in dropping lore for reality, I do believe in dropping game mechanics for reality. Yes game mechanics introduce us to lore and are a channel through which lore is delivered to us, but compared to the lore that is written in text format they are extremely limited. That is why I replace game mechanics, not lore, with realistic processes whenever I can. It allows the full potential of TES lore to be explored and experimented with.

[Shiarra Curtis]

Well, one ore of corundum and one ore of iron doesn't mean that the amount is the same. An ore-bit can be in-RP of any size, while in the game they are limited to the same size. The amount of each of them can be taken as an important feature of it, but I simply didn't do that in the latest post... So could you read that through and say what you think. (or did you already do that?)

[Julie Serebrekoff]

Well, one ore of corundum and one ore of iron doesn't mean that the amount is the same. An ore-bit can be in-RP of any size, while in the game they are limited to the same size. The amount of each of them can be taken as an important feature of it, but I simply didn't do that in the latest post... So could you read that through and say what you think. (or did you already do that?)

Exactly. This is what I was referring to as getting rid of game mechanics. Perhaps you could mix reality with Lore in this situation. Corundum is sometimes used to alter the quality of steel. Like when they put a corundum coat on a piece of steel to make a type of rough file. The concept could be twisted a bit and used in a different way. You could make the traditional type of steel by using Charcoal/Coke and iron in certain proportions, and then when the steel has fused and is still liquid you could use the corundum to enhance the quality of it?

And no I haven't read the RP thread yet, I will in a minute. I'm at school right now and I've been skipping a few unnecessary lectures to get on the computer, so it might take a while for me to read through the thread.

EDIT: I liked that post a lot man.

It made it sound like Gorbad was actually doing something and getting into it. Maybe you might want to work in the process of tempering steel into forging the arrow heads? It's pretty simple to be honest. Just heat it to red hot, shape it a bit, then quench it in a trough of water. Just repeat until the arrow head is finish. Then perhaps polishing and sharpening?

Maybe when creating a quality sword for someone you could go through the process of making a folded steel blade?\

Idk, just some ideas. I like coming up with stuff like this.

[Flash]

It's pretty hard for me to write a detailed arrow-head making post, since I actually don't know what tools should be used and such. I know the basic, heat it (but not so it's liquid) and shape it, (with a hammer?) and put it in the water to sort of "save your progress" and then continue heating and fine-tuning the shaping. Of course, a finishing sharpening at the grindstone will be perfect.

Yeah, I think I can post something like that there, if that's what you want to read I'll try to come up with interesting things for Gorbad to be wondering about, reflecting about, seeing and planning while he's working too.

[stevie trent]

It's pretty hard for me to write a detailed arrow-head making post, since I actually don't know what tools should be used and such. I know the basic, heat it (but not so it's liquid) and shape it, (with a hammer?) and put it in the water to sort of "save your progress" and then continue heating and fine-tuning the shaping. Of course, a finishing sharpening at the grindstone will be perfect.

Yeah, I think I can post something like that there, if that's what you want to read I'll try to come up with interesting things for Gorbad to be wondering about, reflecting about, seeing and planning while he's working too.

For an arrowhead I would think that they would use some sort of mold rather than forging it with a hammer. Packing sand into two pieces of a wooden box (think of it split down the middle with a hole in the middle of one side) then placing a wax mold of the arrowhead right under the hole in the sand. Bind the box together tight so that the wax mold is held firmly in place and the sand won't budge. Then pour the liquid steel into the hole. The wax will melt and evaporate as the steel takes the shape it was in.

Of course that's just a guess at how it could work.

[Janette Segura]

My character isn't a guard yet but he will apply to be one when he gets to Valton.

[Deon Knight]

I shall wait around the Inn until the evening, Should Jormaw come and heal me then grand. Otherwise i'll go looking for the priest, Perhaps Gorbads chap can direct me as i'm due to pick up my arrows from him at similar time.

[Brandon Wilson]

To all the petitioners waiting around the Jarl's court, it is probably best for one of you to step up and address Radwulf Spurvhauke directly. That makes the most sense right now, I think.

[Gemma Woods Illustration]

Post for Astien coming sometime soon. I used up what energy I had left for that last post.

Had a long day today.


Wrong thread. As you can see I really am pretty damn wore out.

[Kaley X]

Sorry I havent posted yet, having a rough time here on the homefront.

[Motionsharp]

Post for Varyn and possibly Roland coming tomorrow. Have some studio work that needs to get done. Lore to write, worlds to create, etc. Time to get crackin' Vincent.

[trisha punch]

I shall wait around the Inn until the evening, Should Jormaw come and heal me then grand. Otherwise i'll go looking for the priest, Perhaps Gorbads chap can direct me as i'm due to pick up my arrows from him at similar time.

Jormaw will come. I'm just waiting for Person from Anticlere to get going or else I'll just have to re-edit the post to head Jormaw's path back down
to the inn. Hopefully to have a conversation with the new argonian to the hold, heh. So yeah, a lot of waiting for posts here, at the moment.

[Sarah Bishop]

Hmm, think we can move to late afternoon? Or is there something that needs to be done yet before it?



Hmm, half-blood doesn't really happen though lore-wise. I'm not entirely sure how we should interpret your character disturbing. He's either a nord, or a redguard, with very subtle hints to the other race. It all depends which race his mother was. Oh and "normally taking on 5 bandits.." is perhaps just a bit too tough. Two bandits is ok, but even those you killed quite easily. (your char is wounded...). Three would be possible if he wasn't wounded and four the absolute maximum he could beat, if he had some help from the godess of luck. Of course, your character is a warrior.. But still. Try to tone it down just a little bit, mmkay?


I went a little crazy there in my post hehe. Currently got a situation going on with nuramon (in his house) and the priest argonian Itan-Ru.

[Sarah MacLeod]

jaiks ?? a situation in my house ? guess I should read the IC thread then.

[lucile davignon]

Hmm, half-blood doesn't really happen though lore-wise

*cough* Fiona *cough*

Half-Bloods have been found throughout the lore. Hell, Bretons are half Aldmer half Nedic. The Reachmen are somewhere between Breton and Nordic, with a bit of everything else thrown in. And the Bjoulsae? Don't get me started.

Generally speaking though, a Half-Blood will likely be the same race as his or her mother, but with some attributes from the father. There are no strict rules here, you could imagine a Redguard born of a Nordic mother and a Hammerfellian father (though he would probably look somewhere inbetween the two). Oblivion even had built into it's character generator a way of simulating this.

For the purposes of this RP though, it is best to identify with one established racial group, for simplicity's sake. So a Reguard that looks very like a Nord, or vice versa.

[Zualett]

Disturbing, I couldn't help but think about this while reading your post.

You're guy got stabbed with a dagger right? I'm guessing in the abdomen area from the way it sounded it your post. He then ran for an hour straight, walked for four hours, and then fought off a group of bandits? A wound large enough to leave a hole the size of a coin would be worse than getting shot by a .45 caliber hollow-point round, much worse. Most of the time getting a blade to the abdomen spells death within the next ten minutes if you don't get help. He would no doubt be bleeding profusely from this wound and running/fighting would increase his heart rate and the rate of blood loss. I've given blood a few times, and when they take a pint from you it makes it hard to walk straight for about 20 minutes. He would have lost much more blood from his wound than a pint.

I just kind of find it hard to believe that he was stabbed, ran for an hour, hobbled through the woods for another 4 hours, and then fought off bandits.

[Victoria Vasileva]

Disturbing, I couldn't help but think about this while reading your post.

You're guy got stabbed with a dagger right? I'm guessing in the abdomen area from the way it sounded it your post. He then ran for an hour straight, walked for four hours, and then fought off a group of bandits? A wound large enough to leave a hole the size of a coin would be worse than getting shot by a .45 caliber hollow-point round, much worse. Most of the time getting a blade to the abdomen spells death within the next ten minutes if you don't get help. He would no doubt be bleeding profusely from this wound and running/fighting would increase his heart rate and the rate of blood loss. I've given blood a few times, and when they take a pint from you it makes it hard to walk straight for about 20 minutes. He would have lost much more blood from his wound than a pint.

I just kind of find it hard to believe that he was stabbed, ran for an hour, hobbled through the woods for another 4 hours, and then fought off bandits.

He might've been stabbed in a particular area in the belly that didn't have any important organs, basically between two of them; extremely lucky. I do agree with you though, killing two bandits that easily while wounded -after you've traveled quite a distance- is a bit unrealistic. Anyways, turns out the bandits were only illusionized skeletons, quite easy to kill actually. (summoned and illusionised by the mage the guard killed).

[Jessica Nash]

yeah, I didn't pay much attention to it but Asap's got a point. anyway, maybe he sortof took care of it good enough to make it to the city ?

anyway, if things keep going like this Nuramon will need a special room where he can put all his patients. I hope your character doesn't mind laying on the table, Disturbing? Nuramon isn't goin to offer his own bed and as far as he knows Sargon is still asleep and Nuramon has only one guest room. and the couch has been taken as well. Wow I'll have to organise things