No wacky or gameplay-changing perks. : V - Skyrim

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:33 am

Those were fine for fallout. Fallout isn't completely serious, and is kind of intended to be humorous at times.
But now that perks are in Elder Scrolls, no perks that change how you play. Only bland perks that complement your playstyle. Like the mace ignores armor thing. But perks that radically change how you play- like the perk in Fallout that gives you regenerating health in sunlight- are bad. It changes the way you play the game beyond that of simply being more powerful.

So please, none of these perks. Only perks that you could occasionally forget you had on: only the top level ones should be different. After all, if we will be getting 50 of them from levelling up alone, they should hardly affect gameplay.

And I shouldn't have to go into wild wasteland.

Wait so Elder Scrolls is? The game with the elves and orcs and lizard people?

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:22 am

Wait so Elder Scrolls is? The game with the elves and orcs and lizard people?

A lot more serious than the always tongue in cheek, black comedy that is Fallout.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:15 pm

If there is a silly perk, I expect M'aiq to be involved.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:24 pm

The thing about perks is that you can either choose to use them, or you can ignore them and get something better suited to you and your playstyle.

Bottom line: more options never hurt anybody.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 5:59 pm

I guarantee there will be no wacky perks in Skyrim. They dont fit. Perks will be like the abilities you got from the different skill levels in Oblivion, but expanded.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:57 am

I'd rather just have easter eggs and the occasional funny dialogue option, but it being a choice seems fair. You don't have to take it, after all.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 4:18 pm

How does crazy and wacky not fit with TES when we just got back from the Shivering Isles, the deffinition of cheese...I mean crazy? How would a perk for the Madgod followers among us not fit?

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:30 pm

How does crazy and wacky not fit with TES when we just got back from the Shivering Isles, the deffinition of cheese...I mean crazy? How would a perk for the Madgod followers among us not fit?

Because perks are directly related to skills, not Daedric Princes.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:59 am

Because perks are directly related to skills, not Daedric Princes.

Who's to say they all are? Not all perks were chosen either. Some perks were earned. Earning a perk called 'Champion of the Madgod' that turns the world crazy after finishing Sheogorath's statue quest wouldn't hurt anything. I know I'd check it out for one of my playthroughs.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:13 am

Who's to say they all are?

Bethesda has. Not to mention the example you gave as a perk was pretty terrible and lore breaking. Which is what wacky perks would do, break lore most likely. Expansive, Fallout type perks would require long winded explanations of how they worked lore wise. This isn't going to happen. Perks will be more mundane than a lot of people are figuring. which is whats needed. We dont need wacky perks. also, wacky perks go against Beth's direction of a more serious, gritty TES.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 5:04 am

Howabout this, Wild Wasteland was a trait NOT a perk.
Secondly, TES and Fallout are two different franchises.
Third Skyrim isn't a wasteland nor is it wild. TES has been a much more serious series than Fallout.
Fourth, Wild wasteland was pointless, there was no reason they couldn't have those encounters without the trait. It all came down to whether you want the Alien Blaster or the YCS/186 Guass Rifle.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:20 pm

Bethesda has.

Where then? I remember them just saying perks will be more for skill related stuff. I don't remember them ever saying all of them were.

And how is my example horrible? And how is it lore breaking to encounter more crazy things? Most crazy people who see strange things really don't see anything. Just because we're seeing a giant jackalope as a random encounter or the skellitons of little green men doesn't mean the lore was broken. It means a crazy person just saw something that really wasn't there.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:30 pm

Don't worry, I am confident that they know what they're doing.

Yeah, after several games, I'm pretty sure they've got the system down

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 5:04 am

Where then?

In the interviews and previews of the game.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:30 am

Bethesda has. Not to mention the example you gave as a perk was pretty terrible and lore breaking. Which is what wacky perks would do, break lore most likely. Expansive, Fallout type perks would require long winded explanations of how they worked lore wise. This isn't going to happen. Perks will be more mundane than a lot of people are figuring. which is whats needed. We dont need wacky perks. also, wacky perks go against Beth's direction of a more serious, gritty TES.

Oh my god for one second I wish people would stop busting a nut over lore. Lore, smore, it's a game have fun.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 8:55 pm

I can come up with awesome perks that will not make skyrim comic-ish

1- Conduction: you lightning spells bounce off targets (AKA chain lightning effect)

2- Magic storm: magic missile spell fires more projectiles that dart around like heat seeking missiles towards their targets disintegrating them in a bizarre explosion of pure chaotic magicka (random target acquisition)

3- Fire wall: when you use fire spray on the ground the flames last longer and do more damage to anyone stupid enough to cross them.

4- Icy coffin: you ice blast spell freezes targets for 10 seconds instead of slowing them down, the targets will suffer shatter damage if they get hit with a critical strike.

5- Mind rage: telekinesis super charge (2h telekinesis) will actually lift live targets for less mana cost (telekinesis lift costs mana according to target weight, so humanoids cost butt loads of it), which make them more viable in bigger battles and less of a mana siphon, but cool down remains the same (balance)

etc etc

it ain't that hard

Not to bash, but most of your 'perks' just sound like spells.
But, I do like your Conduction one.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:10 am

Oh my god for one second I wish people would stop busting a nut over lore. Lore, smore, it's a game have fun.

Lore=fun

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:03 pm

Given the examples we have, perks seem to be linked to skills and help further define and specialize your playstyle....

They don't seem like something thats gonna change the entire world or totally revolutionize your playstyle.

Yes, they are simple(+bleed, +ignore armor, +crit), but theres alot of them and it seems like they eventually snowball into helping to form your own unique class.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:23 pm

"One of the elements borrowed from the hugely successful Fallout series is the "Perks" system. Before you get excited about Bloody Mess or Mysterious Stranger, bear in mind that Elder Scrolls isn't nearly as wacky as its post-apocalyptic stablemate. Perks in Skyrim are smaller, more practical upgrades that are assigned by, ah, "looking to the heavens." Each skill type has its own constellation in the menu, and each star corresponds to a particular perk. These might be damage boosts for certain weapons, kill moves and magic abilities, or additional specific non-combat abilities. Choosing between the various perks will allow you to differentiate your character from friends playing the game - even if their core skill levels are similar."

I find it amazingly fantastic that people even have to be explained this. Kinda says how little they understand game sense and how little they listen to what is actually being said. I mean, how hard is it to understand that Skyrim perks will be closer to WoW talents than Fallout 3 perks, in terms of layout? The only reason why they're called perks is because they're called exactly that in Fallout 3. But the name is more or less the only similarity (depending on the perk in question).

In Oblivion, you got skills. All perks are within separate skill trees, one for each skill. In which tree, exactly, would general perks then be placed? There are OBVIOUSLY no general perks in this game. :facepalm:

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:19 am

I find it amazingly fantastic that people even have to be explained this. Kinda says how little they understand game sense. I mean, how hard is it to understand that Skyrim perks will be closer to WoW talents than Fallout 3 perks. The only reason why they're called perks is because they're called exactly that in Fallout 3. But the name is the only similarity.

In Oblivion, you got skills. All perks are within separate skill trees, one for each skill? In which tree, exactly, would general perks then be placed? There are OBVIOUSLY no general perks in this game. :facepalm:

And even if there are/were general perks in the game, like quest related, challenge perks etc. They wont be wacky or tongue in cheek. It just doesnt fit ES.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:18 am

And even if there are/were general perks in the game, like quest related, challenge perks etc. They wont be wacky or tongue in cheek. It just doesnt fit ES.

How does a perk gained from a quest that allows people to rp as a crazy person with odd encounters and dialoge options that don't always make sense hurt lore in any way?

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:51 am

How does a perk gained from a quest that allows people to rp as a crazy person with odd encounters and dialoge options that don't always make sense hurt lore in any way?

Doesnt even matter since nothing like that will be in the game. No reason to write out a long winded rebuke over something pointless that wont even be in anyway, we'll agree to disagree. Wanna go crazy? Get a disease and dont treat it. Wacky, tongue in cheek, comical perks dont fit in ES, there's really nothing else to say about it.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:29 am

In short - ALL perks will be related and relevant to your playstyle. Destruction perks will improve your damaging spells. Armor perks will improve your defensive capabilities.

» Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:55 am

In short - ALL perks will be related and relevant to your playstyle. Destruction perks will improve your damaging spells. Armor perks will improve your defensive capabilities.

This. That's what I'm hoping... keep TES more serious than the more quirky Fallout series. Plus, you don't want to lose that edgey feel to Skyrim with tongue in cheek perks.

» Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:19 pm

I hate long cool down or unique single use items, tvtropes has a long article about it, as awesome but useless. As you can only use it rarely you want to save it to later so you end up not using it, you can not depend on it as it might be in cooldown, as you use it rarely you don't learn how to use it well so I often end up forgetting them totally.
I don't make very rare but powerful potions or poisons for the same reasons, their only use is typically end of level bosses who we don't have in TES.

Valid point. I will be curious to see how the dragonshouts work. I think they have confimed a cooldown for them. As for super lengthy cooldowns I would want more showstopping abilities at the end of the tree with longer cooldowns. Pull out the reserves! I would define it with a more progressive system leading to cooler and more unique abilities. My maint point and concern is that most of these "perks" or "rpg talent trees" are nothing more than a way to debase the skill system by adding unimaginitve hidden +5% damage modifiers that are pretty much found in every game that has the nerve to be labeled "RPG". The use of these terrible systems has and still is starting to cramp and decay(just look at JRPG's) other excellent and deep games. Let's take a look at Bethesda vs. Bioware("Black Isle Entertainment"). Back in the day I would have been had pressed to say who had designed a superior game. Now look at what Bioware has become. They've traded in innovation for "streamlining" or "dumbing down" just for the sake of a buck and to put games out faster. For the record I feel they were on this path well before the EA merger. It seems like since they stopped translating D&D rulesets to platforms they spend to much time making crappy mechanic features and less making a game with true depth.