was mankar cameron Dovahkiin? : V - Skyrim

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 6:34 pm

Wasn't Mankar Camoran descended from a different line of Aylied kings? I could be wrong about that. But think its a possibility that he too could have had dragon blood.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 11:40 pm

Wasn't Mankar Camoran descended from a different line of Aylied kings? I could be wrong about that. But think its a possibility that he too could have had dragon blood.

Mankar Camoran is descended from Valenwood's royal family and fleeing Ayleids were known to have bred with the ancestors of that bloodline, so yes, I would say Camoran has Ayleid ancestry.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 4:17 pm

I figured that Mankar and Martin's stuggle was less to do with being a dragonborn, and more about the entiomorph of the rebel vs. the king. It's symbols that carry the weight. Mankar was the rebel, while Martin was king, which one could boil it down to when it was Alessia was the rebel and the Alyeids were the king.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:45 pm

I figured that Mankar and Martin's stuggle was less to do with being a dragonborn, and more about the entiomorph of the rebel vs. the king. It's symbols that carry the weight. Mankar was the rebel, while Martin was king, which one could boil it down to when it was Alessia was the rebel and the Alyeids were the king.

I see it this way, Dragonborn are like Demigod's in ancient greek. they can just live not knowing who they really are and die in the farmhouse they once where born.

OR

They are destined to shape the world, like our hero in Skyrim, all his ancestors where Dovahkiin but He is the first to realize he is. and Mankar is able to wear the amulet of kings which is directly described as something only those with dragonblood can do.

So Maybe Mankar is Dovahkiin.
that was what I was sayin. not wether or not it was a rebel king thingy like Sheogorath Jygaleg or whatever.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:08 pm

i think perhaps they werent really thinking when he was wearing it.. they probably tried to out it in his inventory and he put it on.. so they thought meh people will come up with theories or whatever so why not let him keep it

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:59 pm

Too literal. Say my original post in the voice of Wayne, from "Wayne's World".

You know, text doesn t carry intonation, so its hard to guess.

AFAIK anyone in Tamriel can be Dragon born, especially IF royalties in Tamriel acted like royalties on hearth... bastards everywhere.
So, if quantity of dragonborn blood in the body ain t an issue,
beeing Dragonborn ain t much of a feat, its more like a sixual accident.

Exceleent! (Wayne s world tone)

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 1:52 am

This is Mankar Camoran, son of Haymon Camoran of the royal Valenwood bloodline. He is a Bosmer who, by his stature, I would assume inherited some of the traits of the Ayleids who fled to Vvardenfell and were known to have bred into the population of Vvardenfell, especially into the royal bloodline. The Camoran family has a long and royal history. I see no reason why Camoran and his kin couldn't have been of dragonborn blood. Mankar didn't come from, a family of nobodies. His father is the Camoran Usurper.

This is most likely the answer. I don't think we will find a solid one until somebody asks a lore friendly developer.

Mankar Camoran is a TOOL.

Fixed

mankar camoran will be back on these forums soon :deal:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Bf5F7Sfju0

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:58 pm

Mankar Camoran fathered every kid in this county...

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:44 pm

I believe it is possible that Mankar Camoran is Dragonborn. Like Martin he might not eve know it. But I also believe that he used magic too wear the Amulet, not because he needed to, but that he believed he did. I am pretty sure he does not know that he is dragonbborn(if he is) since that would probably ensure a line along "Do you really wish too challege a Dragonborn?" in combat.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 7:40 pm

Doesn't he wear it already in Lake Arrius Caverns before he disappears into paradise? That would imply that he was of dragon-blood but we don't know yet what being a dragonborn is really about. We know that it is passed down in family lines but it is also implied that new dragonborn pop up from time to time. And that your character is one of these new arrivals.

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:33 am

He was never really evil thats something i don't think people understand..

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:36 am

He had it on him but that dont mean he was actually wearing it, he just wanted to keep it away from the Emperor.

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:57 am

He was never really evil thats something i don't think people understand..

How do you figure that ? If I read you correctly we could apply that to every evil bastard in history mate, from Genghis Khan to Hitler to Stalin,... all powerful people think they doing what is right even if they are more obsessed about what is right for them by their standards,... we have to look at universal right and wrong,... and what the mass of people want whether it is good or bad for them by our standards.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 5:06 pm

Well todd said he was from a different line of kings do he could be dragonborn.

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 6:45 pm

How do you figure that ? If I read you correctly we could apply that to every evil bastard in history mate, from Genghis Khan to Hitler to Stalin,... all powerful people think they doing what is right even if they are more obsessed about what is right for them by their standards,... we have to look at universal right and wrong,... and what the mass of people want whether it is good or bad for them by our standards.

Hmmmm your right i guess, Its just he didn't strike me as a cold bloodied tyrant but a delusional visionary. Either way he was/is a great character.

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:07 am

OH and btw any1 who boils their own followers in fire without letting them die is evil by my standards,... I'm just saying =3

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:01 pm

I think the OP actually has a good point. I'll be honest, I thought this was another one of those "Are we gonna be emperor?" thread but Baurus said that only those of the Dragon's Blood can wear it (Not just a Septim) and we recently learn a bit more lore that even before the Septim bloodline that there were many Dragonborn bloodlines, and like I said in some of my past posts, the Septims are like the "Noble" class of the Dragon Blood, everyone knows who they are and what they are. And I do not think that Mankar used magic to stay alive, Elven can live for years, look at Barenziah.

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:47 am

OH and btw any1 who boils their own followers in fire without letting them die is evil by my standards,... I'm just saying =3

Wasn't that the dremora who did that in paradise?

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 6:46 pm

I can see it now. Just as we're about to face Aldiun, in a blaze of fire and brimstone Mancar Cammoron apeards with the Champion of Cyrodiil in an epic duel that is portrayed infront of us. The Dragonborn joins in, but is to late and the Champion of Cyrodiil is struck down. With fire in his eyes, the Dovakiin turned to Mancar.

"You! You killed him! You killed my father..'s... father's father....!"

"No...I am your father."

Dovakiin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HOAETv_nVo

I'd probably make more sense with Martin...ehh.

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:00 am

No, he just used magic and the help of Dagon to get around the restrictions. Plus the nature of Paradise may have also allowed him to negate the restrictions.

^This

» Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:39 pm

This is Mankar Camoran, son of Haymon Camoran of the royal Valenwood bloodline. He is a Bosmer who, by his stature, I would assume inherited some of the traits of the Ayleids who fled to Vvardenfell and were known to have bred into the population of Vvardenfell, especially into the royal bloodline. The Camoran family has a long and royal history. I see no reason why Camoran and his kin couldn't have been of dragonborn blood. Mankar didn't come from, a family of nobodies. His father is the Camoran Usurper:

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:The_Refugees

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Brief_History_of_the_Empire

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:The_Fall_of_the_Usurper

This.

And to everyone saying He could wear the amulet because in his realm of paradise the rules of Mundus don't apply I guess you guys forgot he was wearing the amulet at the Dagon Shrine.
http://images.uesp.net//a/ad/OB-npc-Mankar_Camoran.jpg

Unless Bethesda comes out and says it was a mistake I'm going to take it as a high chance he was Dragonborn. Especially when you take into account the Septims were not the only line of Dragonborn, and becoming Dragonborn doesn't only happen by blood. As we see with the Nerevarine and the Dovahkiin. (Skyrim hero)

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:07 am

This.

And to everyone saying He could wear the amulet because in his realm of paradise the rules of Mundus don't apply I guess you guys forgot he was wearing the amulet at the Dagon Shrine.
http://images.uesp.net//a/ad/OB-npc-Mankar_Camoran.jpg

Unless Bethesda comes out and says it was a mistake I'm going to take it as a high chance he was Dragonborn. Especially when you take into account the Septims were not the only line of Dragonborn, and becoming Dragonborn doesn't only happen by blood. As we see with the Nerevarine and the Dovahkiin. (Skyrim hero)

I stand corrected I never remember him actually wearing it but your post proved he actually did tks for the pic

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:19 am

Clearly Cameron HAS to be dragonborn (at least to fit the lore, it's possible that it was just a dev oversight to begin with).

But that DOES NOT mean he was related to the Septims. There's nothing released as yet to say that the PC in Skyrim is a Septim relative (indeed supposedly Martin was the last Septim descendant, ending the line forever) and the Skyrim PC can be any of the 10 races, therefore All Septims = Dragonborn but All Dragonborn =/= Septim

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:02 am

I stand corrected I never remember him actually wearing it but your post proved he actually did tks for the pic

No problem friend.

We've had threads about this before and I've had to clear it up the same way.

Slaying confusion one thread at a time, Outlander's on the case!

Huzzah! :spotted owl:

» Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:45 am

I think the idea of "blood" is really messing with people. As far as I'm concerned, the moniker of "Dragonborn" is a description based on someone's actions or stance, as opposed to any sort of birth. Mankar could wear the Amulet because he was such a strong willed badass that it LET him wear it. You are Dragonborn by your actions, not by your birth. Not to mention, the lore forumers will tell you this (if I recall correctly), that the true Septim bloodline has been broken for ages. Martin was not a direct descendant of Tiber or Alessia.