Water Issue? : IV

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:27 am

Hey Everyone,

Since I first finished my mod list (for the most part) and did some test runs, one of the main things that sticks out to me is how weird my water looks. It is very bright blue in color and transparent, and I'm pretty sure I don't remember the water ever looking like this from when I played in the past. Here are some screen shots:

Spoiler

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1717-40-11-58.jpg

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1717-40-16-66.jpg

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1717-40-46-17.jpg

I want to get OBGE Liquid Water, but I'm hoping that I can fix this issue before doing that just in case this interferes with it in any way. Here is my load order (there are merged files also that won't show up, if you'd like me to check them off and then post that load order I will)

Spoiler

Oblivion.esm
Francesco's Leveled Creatures-Items Mod.esm
Francesco's Optional New Items Add-On.esm
Cobl Main.esm
Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm
Mart's Monster Mod.esm
FCOM_Convergence.esm
Armamentarium.esm
Artifacts.esm
Kvatch Rebuilt.esm
Better Cities Resources.esm
Progress.esm
TNR ALL RACES FINAL.esp
TNR - ShiveringIsles.esp
Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp
DLCShiveringIsles.esp
Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp
Better Cities .esp
Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Bosses.esp
Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Enemies.esp
Francesco's Optional Chance of More Enemies.esp
Francesco's Optional Leveled Guards.esp
FCOM_FrancescosNamedBosses.esp
Natural_Weather_by_Max_Tael.esp
Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael.esp
Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp
Natural_Water_by_Max_Tael.esp
Enhanced Economy.esp
Oblivion Graphics Extender Support.esp
DLCHorseArmor.esp
DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp
DLCOrrery.esp
DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp
DLCVileLair.esp
DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp
DLCMehrunesRazor.esp
DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp
DLCSpellTomes.esp
DLCThievesDen.esp
DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp
Cobl Glue.esp
Cobl Si.esp
Bob's Armory Oblivion.esp
FCOM_BobsArmory.esp
Loth's Blunt Weapons for Npcs.esp
Oblivion WarCry EV.esp
FCOM_WarCry.esp
Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp
ArmamentariumArtifacts.esp
OOO 1.32-Cobl.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Additional Enemy NPC Vars.esp
FCOM_Convergence.esp
FCOM_RealSwords.esp
FCOM_DurabilityAndDamage.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - More Wilderness Life.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Extra Wounding.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Dungeons of MMM.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Gems & Gem Dust.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Hunting & Crafting.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Farm Animals.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Diverse WaterLife.esp
FCOM_FriendlierFactions.esp
FCOM_MoreRandomSpawns.esp
FCOM_MoreRandomItems.esp
OOO-WaterFish.esp
Artifacts.esp
Kvatch Rebuilt.esp
Kvatch Rebuilt - Leveled Guards - FCOM.esp
DLCBattlehornCastle.esp
DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp
DLCFrostcrag.esp
DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp
Knights.esp
Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - City Defences.esp
xuldarkforest.esp
xulStendarrValley.esp
xulTheHeath.esp
XulEntiusGorge.esp
xulFallenleafEverglade.esp
xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp
xulChorrolHinterland.esp
xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp
xulBravilBarrowfields.esp
xulLushWoodlands.esp
xulAncientYews.esp
xulAncientRedwoods.esp
xulCloudtopMountains.esp
xulArriusCreek.esp
xulPatch_AY_AC.esp
xulRollingHills_EV.esp
xulPantherRiver.esp
xulRiverEthe.esp
xulBrenaRiverRavine.esp
xulImperialIsle.esp
xulBlackwoodForest.esp
xulCheydinhalFalls.esp
xulAspenWood.esp
xulSkingradOutskirts.esp
xulSnowdale.esp
xulCliffsOfAnvil.esp
xulSilverfishRiverValley.esp
Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp
Natural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.esp
ProgressRBSP.esp
ProgressRacial.esp
ProgressArmorer.esp
bgBalancingEVCore.esp
bgMagicEV.esp
bgMagicBonus.esp
bgMagicEVPaperChase.esp
bgMagicAlchemy.esp
bgMagicPotionNumberSoulGemValue.esp
bgBalancingOptionalLessHealth.esp
bgBalancingEVLAMEAddition.esp
bgBalancingEVOptionalNPCDiversityLAME.esp
Better Cities Full.esp
Better Cities - VWD of the IC.esp
Better Imperial City.esp
Better Cities - Unique Landscape Barrowfields.esp
Better Cities - Unique Landscape Chorrol Hinterland.esp
Better Cities - Unique Landscape Cheydinhal Falls.esp
Better Cities - Unique Landscape Skingrad Outskirts.esp
Better Cities - COBL.esp
Better Cities - Unique Landscape Imperial Isle.esp
bgMagicEVShader.esp
bgMagicLightningbolt.esp
FCOM_Archery.esp
Bashed Patch, 0.esp

Any ideas on what could be causing this issue?

Thanks!

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:58 pm

I have Better Water installed and the water looks just like that but it is not on your list. I didn't think that Natural Water which is on your list would make it look that way from its description, but I have never used it.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:23 pm

?? could be this one....

Natural_Water_by_Max_Tael.esp

That is in your Load order...

Edit. I dont use that ..does it have an INI file to configure the Water?

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:46 pm

?? could be this one....

Natural_Water_by_Max_Tael.esp

That is in your Load order...

Edit. I dont use that ..does it have an INI file to configure the Water?

I'll check but that file is from Natural Environments I believe, I could try disabling it and see what happens.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:10 am

Looks like your reflections are off, that also affects how the water looks.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:40 am

Looks like your reflections are off, that also affects how the water looks.

Any idea what might be causing that? I was going to disable the Natural Environments water .esp then rebuild the bashed patch but realize that I'd need to go through the tutorial dungeon (for the 100th time :banghead: ) since I wouldn't be able to use the test savegame I have outside the sewer, so I just want to get some opinions on what I should try instead of going out on a limb myself.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:58 pm

That does look like it could be the result of Natural Water with some stuff tweaked like having no reflections. Check your Oblivion.ini to see if water reflections are disabled.

I'd recommend getting rid of everything that comes with Natural Environments and just installing All Natural along with Enhanced Vegetation.

EDIT: I also noticed you've got two Natural Weather esps enabled, I'm pretty sure you're only supposed to be using one of those. I don't know if that would be causing any issues. But honestly All Natural is so incredible as a weather mod and more that your best option would be to get it as soon as possible.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:10 am

That does look like it could be the result of Natural Water with some stuff tweaked like having no reflections. Check your Oblivion.ini to see if water reflections are disabled.

I'd recommend getting rid of everything that comes with Natural Environments and just installing All Natural along with Enhanced Vegetation.

EDIT: I also noticed you've got two Natural Weather esps enabled, I'm pretty sure you're only supposed to be using one of those. I don't know if that would be causing any issues. But honestly All Natural is so incredible as a weather mod and more that your best option would be to get it as soon as possible.

Alright thanks I'll definitely check those out, luckily Natural Environments is installed via BAIN so hopefully I can just smoothly transition to that. I'm definitely out dated as far as my mods go from when I tried modding my game about 2 years ago, NE was the mod to have at that time

edit: Oh and as for my ini regarding reflections:

bUseWaterReflectionsMisc=0
bUseWaterReflectionsStatics=0
bUseWaterReflectionsTrees=0
bUseWaterReflectionsActors=0
bUseWaterReflections=1

hmm...so reflections is on but should I also set the value to the other reflection variables to 1?

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:17 am

I actually used NE for a while before I realized AN existed. AN basically rolls all of the weathers from NE and two other weather mods into a single system, as well as having features to allow dynamic time-of-day and weather-based lighting in interiors (and with Immersive Interiors you can even look out windows and see the town that should be there) as well as an overhaul of the lighting that makes the game a lot more atmospheric. It's probably my favorite mod.

You can use Enhanced Vegetation if you ever used Natural Vegetation to increase the density of the forests. And if you're planning on using Liquid Water there's no need for Enhanced Water.

So you can actually keep Natural Habitat if you enjoy the birds and bugs flying around; those features haven't really been improved on by any other mod yet, though WAC does a pretty good job.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:45 pm

I actually used NE for a while before I realized AN existed. AN basically rolls all of the weathers from NE and two other weather mods into a single system, as well as having features to allow dynamic time-of-day and weather-based lighting in interiors (and with Immersive Interiors you can even look out windows and see the town that should be there) as well as an overhaul of the lighting that makes the game a lot more atmospheric. It's probably my favorite mod.

You can use Enhanced Vegetation if you ever used Natural Vegetation to increase the density of the forests. And if you're planning on using Liquid Water there's no need for Enhanced Water.

So you can actually keep Natural Habitat if you enjoy the birds and bugs flying around; those features haven't really been improved on by any other mod yet, though WAC does a pretty good job.

Alright awesome, I'm about to test them both out now, I did like the Natural Habitat aspect of NE though, so if I use bain and only select Natural habitat to install there shouldn't really be any issues right? I'll update and let you know if this fixed the water too!

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:57 pm

Alright awesome, I'm about to test them both out now, I did like the Natural Habitat aspect of NE though, so if I use bain and only select Natural habitat to install there shouldn't really be any issues right? I'll update and let you know if this fixed the water too!

Yep, you should have no problem with that.

As for the reflections, I'd try enabling some of the other options like statics and see if the problem persists.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:57 am

Yep, you should have no problem with that.

As for the reflections, I'd try enabling some of the other options like statics and see if the problem persists.

Okay, so I just took some screens of the new water. It does definitely look better, but it still doesn't seem like it's reflecting despite the .ini changes, what do you think?

Spoiler

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1720-43-38-83.jpg

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1720-44-00-58.jpg

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1720-44-06-20.jpg

Do you think that this is good enough in that I'll still get the full effects of Liquid Water?

And I installed Immersive Interiors while I was at it....really cool mod

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:28 am

It's definitely still lacking reflections; I really don't know what to tell you. I guess you might as well install Liquid Water and hope that whatever problem that is affecting the vanilla water won't be present for Liquid Water. LW actually improves on the vanilla reflections with a full-resolution reflection map instead of the low-res vanilla one that makes things look blocky, so hopefully its implementation gets around whatever issue you're having.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:55 pm

It's definitely still lacking reflections; I really don't know what to tell you. I guess you might as well install Liquid Water and hope that whatever problem that is affecting the vanilla water won't be present for Liquid Water. LW actually improves on the vanilla reflections with a full-resolution reflection map instead of the low-res vanilla one that makes things look blocky, so hopefully its implementation gets around whatever issue you're having.

Alrighty, just to clarify though (and to make sure I'm not an idiot due to not having played around with .ini's for a while), is the oblivion .ini "Oblivion_default" that is in the same folder as the data and mopy folders? Or is this the back up file that I've been altering which is why no effects are taking place? Because I tried enabling screenshots earlier too and it didn't work, so now I'm thinking that I may not be using the real .ini........

EDIT: Found it....I have OB installed on a separate hard drive that I use for my games, and it turns out my .ini is actually still in a "my games" folder on my other hard drive. Reflections were turned off for the actual .ini, so I just turned everything on and am going to check and see if it fixes my issue :crosses fingers:

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:20 am

You've totally been modifying the backup. Sorry. :teehee:

The actual Oblivion.ini is not in the game's program folder. It's in [your system's documents folder]/My Games/Oblivion

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:48 am

You've totally been modifying the backup. Sorry. :teehee:

The actual Oblivion.ini is not in the game's program folder. It's in [your system's documents folder]/My Games/Oblivion

Hahah yeah excuse the noobi-ness, still working the kinks out of the whole modding thing

Okay, here are the new screens with everything enabled (I can't see my own reflection but I'm not sure if you ever could in the first place?)

Spoiler

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1721-18-50-37.jpg

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1721-18-59-76.jpg

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:23 am

Hahah yeah excuse the noobi-ness, still working the kinks out of the whole modding thing

Okay, here are the new screens with everything enabled (I can't see my own reflection but I'm not sure if you ever could in the first place?)

Spoiler

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1721-18-50-37.jpg

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/GrimZ1113/?action=view¤t=Oblivion2011-05-1721-18-59-76.jpg

Looking good, now all you need to do is install Liquid Water to make it really look good!

I'm pretty sure you can see your own reflection if you enable reflections for actors.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:08 am

Looking good, now all you need to do is install Liquid Water to make it really look good!

I'm pretty sure you can see your own reflection if you enable reflections for actors.

I think I did enable Actors but maybe I'll check again, or maybe I just wasn't in a good spot to see my reflection or something. Now I'm installing Liquid Water but it says I need Wrye 292....I found a link to it but it said that it's sort of a test version, does it install the same way with Bash 291 or should I upgrade to 292 anyways?

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:07 am

I think I did enable Actors but maybe I'll check again, or maybe I just wasn't in a good spot to see my reflection or something. Now I'm installing Liquid Water but it says I need Wrye 292....I found a link to it but it said that it's sort of a test version, does it install the same way with Bash 291 or should I upgrade to 292 anyways?

As far as I know LW doesn't require Bash. I haven't upgraded it since I installed ~~it some time late last year~~ 291.

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:23 pm

As far as I know LW doesn't require Bash. I haven't upgraded it since I installed it some time late last year.

Ohh alright, well it said that you could install it via bain and it contains the wizard data, if I put the archive in the bash installers, ran wizard, and then installed, do you think that would be alright?

» Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:21 am

Ohhh, yeah, installing it via BAIN. I can't say anything for sure, but I don't know why you'd have any problems installing it like that. Just make sure you consult the LW readme to make sure you do the various ini tweaks, etc.

I use Bash for various things but I tend to install everything manually, including LW.

» Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:05 pm

Ohhh, yeah, installing it via BAIN. I can't say anything for sure, but I don't know why you'd have any problems installing it like that. Just make sure you consult the LW readme to make sure you do the various ini tweaks, etc.

I use Bash for various things but I tend to install everything manually, including LW.

Ahh I see, well thank you for all the help in fixing the water!! I like to install everything via BAIN just because I tend to screw up and when that happens having things installed as omods or via bain makes it easier to fix =P Although now that I think of it I'm pretty sure I manually installed OBGEv2 because trying to do it via BAIN ended up leaving out some folders......I'll just do it that way =)

Just one last question, where would I find the shaderlist.txt if I have one?

Thanks again!