No it was not. First assault rifle is considered to be Italian Cei-Rigotti rifle from 1900.

Probably because of Power Armor. Every self-respecting Space Marine or other Power Armor -user uses overly bulky weapons, so they made an assault rifle that's big.


Now, why there isn't many different kinds of weapons of a type (different assault rifles, different pistols, different revolvers), I don't know. They might have had some kind of a silly design philosophy of "Only one weapon for one role! Choices are confusing!" in mind. Or they left the weapons to DLC.


EDIT:



Just a childish reference to other subject where length and diameter/girth are considered important.

Spoken like a Glock shooter

Again you are not at all acknowledging what I said. We get other people opinions don't matter. But I said why can't there be both? Stop cherry picking what arguments to acknowledge. If a Chinese assault rifle shows up will you be upset?


Edit: "Uh what? It's not me who is complaining about rifle model, it's YOU. I am sattisfied with Assult Rifle and like it." I said I was arguing aesthetics, did you even read my post? I said you were complaining about ammo and terminology, not aesthetics

This is inconsequential to the fact that ballistic weaponry hadn't changed one iota since in fact WWI. The most advanced ballistic weapon in America is the 10mm pistol, since otherwise we'd be looking at a 1911 or alternatively a Baretta. The BAR itself was developed in 1918. So by the time the bombs drop, by and large, the American military had huge stockpiles of ballistic weapons over 150 years old in design. Were it not for laser weaponry, which was mass produced and became the general issue service rifle I don't know when, China would have whooped America's ass with superior weaponry long before even power armor became a thing.

Somewhere in FO4's design, I feel Bethesda stuck too closely to pre-50's technology and aesthetics save for a few token sci-fi assets. All I'm saying is that it's okay for there to be a rifle with a lot of stopping power, 20-40 round magazines, and low RoF, but they could have tried for something that looked akin to a rifle sized version of the 10mm just to convince us that yeah, American's weren't literally stuck in the 50's, despite 16" black and white TVs (Seriously!? There IS color footage from WWII!) and the ironic complete lack of microwaves, which I would have thought would be a thing in FO4 just because the term "nuke it" in regards to cooking food would take on a whole new meaning in the Fallout universe.

Or, y'know, the original lore could have not done something as ridiculous as telling us the world ended in 2077, despite nearly every patent in existence in America being over 100 years old. Fortunately, mods and simple ignorance fix a lot of these problems, they're just glaring issues with writing. Poor writing. I have issues with poor writing.

Also, as far as I can tell, all bombs dropped were dropped from planes... How did they get through?

Of course not. I already said so few posts above. I am not type of person who would deny other people alternative just because I am satisfied with existing thing. What I object to is first of all unjust -in my opinion critique of designers, who clearly put lot of effort and time in to weapon design and combat, more then in any previous Fallout games. new modding system is simply excellent and well beyond what other similar games offer. Given i have limited experience with 3D modeling and programming I am also able to realize how much more demanding it is to design single weapon in Fallout 4 compared to weapons in previous Fallout.

Second I also object to reasoning of some posters about why Assault Rifle is "wrong". It isn't. From the point of construction and functionality Assault Rifle fits definition of modern assault rifle. It's heavier, that's true, but that can be explained by power armor use.

If somebody dislike how it looks, it should admit that and not look for false pretenses.

Damn, good response. We now understand each other. Right on man. Respect.

It's ridiculously overbuilt for a service weapon for a Infantryman...especially when the base weapon is semi-auto. It would make sense if the thing was an LMG with a cyclic rate of 1200 rpm. The whole modding system is just a mechanic to limit player weapons access...in NV you started out with a servicable weapon and made it better with mods, in FO4 you start with a mutilated weapon and have to rebarrel and restock it, and when you level up enough you can change the receiver to make it full auto. There is actually less choice than in the previous games.

1200 is bit too much to be practical. Most armies restrict rate of fire of their automatic weapons (including machine guns) to about 600-800 rpm. Despite those weapons being technically capable of higher rates. Don't ask me why, it's just way it is and I assume it comes out of battlefield experience.

Of course, in real life people does not have hit points. One small bullet in to vital organ and you are dead or at last out of action. Automatic weapons does not exist to put as many bullets in to the target as possible in as short of a time as possible (as they do in game), they exist to create what is essentially a shotgun effect, increasing probability that one of the bullets will hit it's mark.

As for semi auto version, I guess it's there as part of new modding system. It does have sort of parallel in real life in civilian versions of automatic weapons which are modified to fire only in semi auto mode for legal reasons. Of course, unlike the game, such modification offers no advantage over automatic version (which in most cases have selective fire switch anyway which can be usually turned to single, triple shot or full auto).

But in this case you have to take in to account game balance an playability so bit of tolerance is in place.

I am glad to hear it, we are all playing and enjoying the same game after all, so we should be on the same side. Those playing Sims are our real enemy!

Yea, maybe i might have expressed myself with wrong terms, i am not native english speaker so that sometimes it might be hard to deliver the full meaning of what i am trying to say.

But in Fallout lore there are the weapons i refer to, as i have effectively posted you the links of them taken from previous game version.

And no, i am not blaming the game (which i like) for the weapons design choices, just voicing what i think about it, and i see some more people shares my thoughts

I just.... like automatic weapons, really do, and sometimes i feel my options being restricted to one-two weapons (3 if i get to use a legendary-plasmas one which indeed is great but not easy to get and use due to being tied to using plasma ammun) and i feel uncomfortable with it, thats all.

What i mean is that it would've took them nothing-much-effortly to put in the game a weapon looking like the ones i linked, even just one, maybe putting it through as a quest reward, or behind some master locked door in the basemant of an old military installation, whatever.

Also the 10mm automated SMG has been removed, and it was quite a classic of every previous title of the serie, it was perfect if you wanted to play the kind of assaultish-automated guy who just fills the air with bullets.

@Hofmann

Wow, thanks you.

Very nice reading your post with cartridge and assault rifle evolution explaination, btw, wasn't the Stg44 design based for very-close-range combat, like cities or bunkers alike? hadn't they discovered it quite late how good generically was?

Its very interesting, tho, the germans delved their occupational field forces with maschinenpistole34 and lately the 42 version of it, while the russians had developed something alike around the 1936, i think it was called AVR36 maybe.

Just be happy they didn't research how huge early night vision scopes were (i.e. Starlight scopes). M16 w/pvs2: https://xbradtc.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/pvs2.jpg

The recon scope to me resembles modern thermal scopes wrt size and bulkiness. Thermal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT8WNKwJqOA

I don't like playing with them because they take up too much screen estate, but it seems like a "realistic" tradeoff (make a sacrifice to gain it's power - it's our choice).

Dunno, so far in those two playthroughs i have finished, after first seeing what the recon scope it was, i totally dropped the marksman approach, i carry a semi-automated 10mm pistol and a [two-shot] sub machinegun.

All scopes i use is the reflex one, looking cool and being viable for my playstyle (even tho id love to find a -special- which allows me to run faster while aiming, but i am unlucky, so its either two-shot or assassin), rather than using something so much unconfortable to my look.

Also the "screen issue" is what set me apart from effectively using laser weapons, as it'd be taking me a good 1/3 of the view while aiming.

Is a bit like walking and NOT seeing weapon on your back or on your side, i mean, its not like you can put a huge rifle in your pockets, maybe you can hide a smaller gun within' your clothes but for sure not a long one

About every ballistic or energy weapon in game have automatic receiver mod. Some are better, some are worst of course but that's to be expected. Modded automatic pipe rifle is solid automatic weapon for early game as is 10mm pistol in auto version. Battle rifle in auto is excellent weapon as is laser auto rifle in mid and well in to late game. .45 SMG is sort of useless as it offers no advantage over pipe auto but uses rarer ammunition. But if it's look which concerns you, there's nothing wrong with it. Assault rifle itself is very good weapon but if you dislike it's look, bate rifle offers classic layout which is close to modern assault rifles, if that's what you want.

If that's still not enough, I guess you have to place your hope on modders. Since Chinese Rifle and M4 clone from NV seems to be quit popular, there's pretty good chance somebody will create their mods. Although I expect weapon modding in F4 to be larger challenge compared to previous Fallouts due to new in game modding system.

10mm would be kind of redundant with auto version of 10mm pistol. Which essentially is 10mm SMG in all but appearance.

Still doesn't make sense, as according to the lore, the regular military had phased out ballistic firearms in favour of energy weapons. So the power armour argument really doesn't hold water.

the weight of the guns is purely for game play balance and not even trying to be realistic.

first off sorry i dont know how to break up the quotes as you did

agreed diferent countries have their own terms but assault rifle is an internationally accepted term. The Ak47 is an assault rifle but their actual term is AK which stands for automat kalashnikova, designation and creator (feminised)

the rifle is named AK as thats how they define it with a name, exactly the same way is the M16 is an assault rifle yet its actual name is "M16" designator "M" which does not stand fro assault rifle but just because thats its name.

the ferrari f40 doesnt have car anywhere in its name but it is a car

no thats the machine gun definition not LMG

the fn minimi (m249) and rpk are LMGs despite basically being bigger ARs its their size and role (suppresive) that makes them LMGs not ARs

Im not judging it by its looks? true i dont like its looks but i always judges it in the post you quoted by its size, weight, bulk and how much of a nightmare it would be to use for anyone not in PA which is why as i stated there should have been 2 assault rifles but also really the weapon we have should be a LMG as by its weight size and bulk thats what it is.

i hate the AUG i think its ugly as [censored] but i dont judge it by its looks and i definitely wouldnt say its not an assault rifle (it is) because of its looks?

what i was saying is the fact that fallout is based in the arts/mindset/overall looks etc of the 50s would have no impact on the design of their weapons just the same as it didnt here. none of our weapons designed in the 80s looked like they wore sports coats over teeshirts with slacks and could rock a sweet mullet, and theres no reason to think theirs would if it takes away functionability. which is my problem i contest that the weight and bulk of it takes away functionability

its true i dont like its looks but the reason i dont like it as a weapon and would rather have a more real world one is weight and bulk

first up what i was saying is that you would not create an assault rifle that size/weight etc becasue it would limit your ability to fight with it, how much ammo you could have and how fast and accurate you could put rounds on target. there is no sense in making such a bulky heavy weapon as an assault rifle and there is no assault rifle in our world thats even close to the size and weight of that thing

no theres no official weight for assault rifles but because you just dont make an assault rifle that heavy ,the reason though weapons such as the FN Minimi (M249), and RPK for example are LMGs not assault rifles (both have auto reciever (rpk is select fire too), both magazine feed (the minimi can take both mags and belt feed) and both fire intermediate cartridges yet both are LMGs) is that minimi weighs 22lbs loaded and is big and bulky the rpk variants only weigh between 10-11lb unloaded which is not much more than assaults but is much bigger and bulkier than them, their modifications for extended range and longer sustained fire require heavier gear that also adds to the overall size not just weight. whereas say the m16 and hk416 both weigh between 7.5-9lbs loaded depending on model and are much less bulkier allowing faster target aquisition and accurate fire rate. LMGs suppress.

although i still wouldnt like the looks (personal opinion) i would accept it no problem (and the others) if they just had a more realistic weight too them or if the FO4 AR had been a LMG and there was a different AR for the assault rifle role in game

agreed, but the term assault rifle was first coined by hitler with the stg44, also it is generally accepted as the first working and successful assault rifle, the intermediate cartridge was messed around with alot but never very seriously until the germans developed the stg44

the federal automat is not an assault rifle 6.5x50 is not an intermediate cartridge, i know many people are arguing that this was the first assault rifle but the cartridge is a full power rifle cartridge.

the ak47 is recognised as the first of the modern postwar assault rifles.

all logic, (ive also said on many posts including one i made myself at the ridiculous weights of all the weapons in FO4) weight is a massive consideration on all modern small arms especially in the military, as said the lighter the weapon the more ammo you can carry with you, the faster you can bring your weapon to bare on target and the faster the rate of accurate fire you can lay down, and also ofcourse long marching, running taking cover etc etc etc . this is the exact reason the standard weapon of militaries around the world are no longer big heavy rifles such as FN FAL, G3, or even something like the BAR. weight of the FO4 assault rifle (and yes all the other bloody weapons too) is ridiculous, if you arent in PA you would be combat ineffective trying to lug those things around and most troops did not have PA and then theres the cops BADTFL etc etc

the AUG is considered bloody heavy for an assault rifle in our world and the HBAR only weighs 8.6lbs unloaded! NZ army is dropping those soon thank god to go to an AR-15 platform purely due to our troops having had long standing complaints about its weight and size (and its a bulpup!!!)

no other of the fallout games had wepaons anywhere near this weight they were much more realistic, FO4 is the only one so far with the very very heavy weights (im sure this has come from beths TES games and its unnecessary as a game balance)

true that but was just making a point as to the style of the weapons in which saying why not a derivative of those weapons (including all ar15 platform weapons), the full length cartridge battle rifles without an assault rifle version was a mistake and it was american generals who convinced the other nato states too (well not convince just flat out told them this is how its gonna be) but see if it hadnt been vietnam that showed the true effectiveness of intermediate cartridges it would of been another conflict, they would of learnt the lesson as they did in our world.

also ofcourse the FO4 assault rifle is 5.56 so they did somewhere and the point of the intermediate cartridge was not just the round itself but also the reduced size, bulk and weight of the weapon firing it.

yep its just speculation on my part on when the timeline split

yep looks is purely individual taste (i dont like, i also dont like most of the armour aswell but at least it looks functionable for what it is) but although i dont like how it looks aesthetically im complaining how it looks in terms of functionability and its stupid weight not just how pretty it is. go to any modern military today with that gun with its bulk and weight and see if any one would be interested for their small arms assault rifle replacement, and it would be nothing to do with looks and all with functionability.

they may be mechanically sound but so are muskets so are blunderbusses so are bows with stone tipped arrows, the m1 garand was absolutely mechanically sound so why arent we still using that instead today? and if you say auto well why not still be using bren guns or BARs maybe mp40 that was badass. Because we get better we create better weapons so why is every single one of their weapons inferior to ours? (not talking laser or anything we dont have yet)

every weapon is way too heavy vs ours and lets say we did have power armour in our world well id rather have an m60 or minmi or hk417, or any of our world assault rifles, or any of our world assaults with a heavy barrel id also take any of our world battle rifles and apart from the minmi which weighs the same all the others weigh half or less!

if we discard 1,2 tactics and NV and only compare to 3, the other beth game, those assault rifles weighed 7lbs and yes they were based on real life ARs but they had a far more functionable weight making them superior in the hands of non PA wearers. wheres the version of that? it doesnt have to be one of them nor something from our world, it can be something completely new and different thats all good but the functionability has to be there.

yes rhe assault and other weapons are mechanically functionable but there is alot to criticise because they are functionabilty inferior to our non as technolgically advanced time.

use a bolt action the right way for your hand and notice how easy it is to work the bolt, you have it tight against your shoulder and offhand is holding the fore grip creating a perfectly stable platform to work the bolt easily, now use one thats for opposite handed and yep she still works right but now you cant hold it tight to your shoulder holding with your trigger hand and aslo your now holding it on a pivot point, it is not a stable platform to work the bolt therefor creating innefficiency

using a bolt action for your wrong hand is inferior to the correct one (peeps had said its an game engine skinning thing so if thats the case then can deal)

yep pistol caliber in a full rifle is mechanically functionable its a gun and it shoots but massively inferior to a rifle cartridge. CQB is only reason and we have those they are sub machine guns not rifles and still theres plenty of excellent CQB weapons with rifle caliber

i can accept the changing calibers thing as game design to have damage progression and im fine with that

but what i dont accept is the weight of these weapons because everything aside they are far too heavy which really does make them inferior to our timeline weapons and not everyone has power armour

yes i dont like the looks but thats just personal opinion same as how you like how they look but the weight and bulk is what i have the problem with becasue it would seriously hinder a non PA user whereas a more "real world type version" would not. And i dont just mean gamer PA users and non users but in the real fallout universe

i would of absolutely preferred real world type weapons because of looks but my problem with the weapons on FO4 is not actually the looks (i dont like but thats me) its the functionability and effectiveness of those weapons which i think you can most definitely criticise because it just does not make sense

like i dont like picasso, not my style, but theres no way im going to say hes not an artist or any good just cause i dont like his style and its the same for these weapons. i dont like their looks or style but im hassling them purely based on their functionability

i didnt mean steampunk just steam punk like as it would suit being in arcanum game for its looks, and yeah i know about the lewis guns

no 308 is not just the diameter it is the moniker for the whole round cartridge and all

308 is 7.62x51mm

the ak47 takes a 7.62x39mm

2 completely different rounds with the NATO round being full length cartridge with much more power than the AKs intermediate cartridge, same as how the 7.62x54R is not 308

The Americans already had the R91 as their standard assault weapon, and the Chinese assault rifle has existed in every other fallout game except NV. Why they randomly dont exist in the Boston area, and why the garbage WW1 era "assault rifle" is the only one that does is beyond me. Just Bethesda being Bethesda I suppose.


Edit: Also, just to be clear, while I think the new, bulky assault rifle looks stupid, that doesn't mean I don't think it should be in the game. It is "fallout lore" now whether I like it or not. I just dislike how they removed all of the other assault weapons that have previously existed in other fallouts.

There is supposedly a mesh still in game of a Chinese Assault rifle that looks pretty much identical to the FO3 one...

I thought a lot of the more 'realistic' weapons we've seen are on the West Coast courtesy of the NCR/Gun Runners? (And what real weapons we did have on the East Coast in FO3 like the R91 and Chinese Assault Rifle don't exist for some reason) If anything, I'd be happy if there's a DLC of a NCR caravan reaching the Commonwealth, because a lot of the current weapons look kinda bad, and not in the good way. Like the pipe weapons for instance have their charm precisely because they look so ghetto, kinda like that one improvised pos gun in Metro 2033 with the exposed magazine. The assault rifle is just the worst; it looks like a WW1 machinegun with a box magazine that has the most modern-looking night vision scope out of all of 'em.

I think we should get away from the WW1 claim for the new assault rifle design, a close look will show that it is the modern SAW or the NV light machine gun design in all but the barrel (this is why the the magazine is loaded to the side, since the design can be magazine or belt feed in real life. It looks to me like some one took a FN Minimi and added a large barrel to it.....its been given the Star Wars treatment in other words.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light_machine_gun

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_Minimi

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Assault_rifle_(Fallout_4)

It should be a simple mod to replace the barrel with something more fitting to the world.

As to the assault rifle debate there shouldn't be one, assault rifle have existed in every Fallout game and we had existing lore designs in recent games......I'll pass on an another argument that an semi automatic base weapon can be an Assault Rifle, since by any definition it isn't and stick to my opinion that abandoning two canon designs in favour of a sci-fied modern weapon just looks out of place in the world was for me a mistake. But to those that like it good for you, I'd have preferred a choice in 5.56 mm designs....at the moment like some other calibres 5.56 mm is for me primarily used as a cash crop since I don't like the design.

Hopefully the DLC (and mods of course) will return some of the strangely missing designs.

I meant that the devs made it big for aesthetic reasons (also, see link below). As to the lore, you could just say it's an older weapon, made before they phased ballistic weapons.

It was a good thing that you posted that link to the FO-wiki, because there's this: http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/f/fa/Fo4_machine_gun_concept_art.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20151216012351

That confirms couple of the things people have suspected.

1. It originally was a Machine Gun.

2. It's big because of the Power Armor.

Funny you mention that. I'm starting to think Beth left the gun list sparse intentionally so they wouldn't have to struggle or reach for DLC weapons that are useful and desirable.

They could have called the new one from FO4 the "Heavy assault rifle" or something, and kept the G3-style one from Fo3 as the regular Assault Rifle.