eh? Cowboy weapons are largely unaffected it seems. They didn't touch the hand loaded ammo and I don't see Obsidian being brave enough to raise the spreads enough to prevent long ranged torso shots.

Meanwhile, Lol at the .308 weapons getting hardcoe nerfed for the second patch in a row. Now they're taking away the nice ammo.

I've never used that "nice ammo" for .308 weapons and they're still just fine.

I said I'll wait and see. You're probs right. But I wanna see what a slight reduction in ROF actually is, heh ha. Some people define slight differently than I do. My sister suggested I date one of her friends one time, and I would not have described her as slight. She did, though, my sister. But there you go. The Cowboy Repeater's rate of fire is a selling point for me, combined with the way it looks modded, minus the maple stock mod. S'a cool weapon. ^_^

That slightly increased spread matters when you're using a Trail Carbine for main sniping purposes. Damage might remain unchanged but it's not the only thing that's important. Also Cowboy Repeater got double nerfed since it's RoF mod got one as well.

This really makes me a little mad. If anything, they should make .308 a little more scarce, not weaken it even more. It is a powerful rifle round, for Pete's sake!

Unless the spread is raised by nearly 10x of current it won't matter much. Many players have sung the La Longue Carabine praises as a sniping weapon when it has the highest spread (0.2) of all the leaver-action rifles. Trail Carbine will still be the game's most effective long ranged sniping weapon after the patch. I just don't see obsidian raising the spread much beyond 0.1 if it even made it that high. It just won't be as awesome in short ranged combat, but the leaver-action shotgun loaded with nuclear buckshot will fill that gap.

Let's wait and see if Josh snuck back in the DT bypass he took out before release on the .308 & 5.56mm before we go off the deep end. All the hand loads should have a negative to go with their positives. Hot loads *should* wear out your weapon faster.

It looks like what they did with the .308 weapons is rather than admit the initiall smerfing was a mistake and raising back up the DAM, they went with raising the ROF and therefore the DPS, which, in my opinion, is bass ackwards, but hey, it's their game and that's what they did. Add in the inprovements to the crits on the snipers and the twerfing of the levers, and the .308 guns are looking much better now. We'll see how it plays (and if I don't like it, I'll mod it again)

-gunny out.

Yeah. What the hell? DT bypass on buck? Do you have any idea what the energy/area figures are for #OO buck? Those things are .33" diameter (as in completely round) each with less energy than many pistol rounds. They should have DT multipliers, not bypass.

-gunny out.

I am still tying to figure out why .308 ammo has disappeared from my game. A unique glich? :shrug:

I guess they didn't like people switching to the BAR with JSPs for a go-to gun. They really want to force people to the AMR, don't they?

My favorite news out of this:

Splash Damage working. Now all of those characters that blindlessly took it will now come back from the dead with a vengeance.

Worse news that comes out of this: A lot of mods will need updating... more specifically, things like WMX and WME... and Antistar just moved to a new place a few days ago... with no internet... Ah great... Time to manually do it...

My general consensus: I'm liking these changes. Don't dislike anything that they're changing in particular. Seems like they are trying to break apart the "god-tier" of weapons to give the player more variety. That I like.

Well of course since we don't know the exact numbers everything's raw opinion. Perhaps it won't change anything at all. We'll see.

Project Nevada Team is also working on the rest of the modules so they'll have to adjust everything they did to the changes. Not to mention NVSE. Add the fact that Honest Hearts is not far off, modders are gonna have a busy time.

I dunno. I still think they should've made changes to the overall balance of the game (leveling, levelscaling, enemies - all but cazadors, they were fine - skill effects...) instead of just the guns. :/

Looks pretty good, but we should see how it turns out.

As for the sniper rifles, I would think they are now more like their real world counterpart; after all, they are *only* loaded with .308 not .338Lupar or 7.62x54R.

Reducing the damage and add CND penalty seem harsh for JSP, but then again the .308 guns have get their crit multiplier back.

And Gobi would get to see day light again.

Yeah, but tinkering with the numbers on guns is kinda like changing the headlights on your car to xenon blue. Anybody with a screwdriver can do it. Messing with the leveling and creatures seems more like engine work to me (literally and figuritively). Now, where did that engine hoist go......................

I would put 7.62x54R in the same class as the 7.62x51mm (.308) and all the nominally .30" rounds. Now .338 Lapua and .338 Win Mag and larger are a totally differnt story.

-Gunny out.

For some reason I always think 762x54R have a heavier bullet.

Over the .308, generally yes, I'd say. I think the 54Rs I fired this spring were 181gr. It has a lower muzzle velocity, though, so the energy is in the same ballpark. 2600-2800 ft-lb. That's where most of the ~.30 cal rifle rounds rounds are. .338 rounds are more up in the 5000 ft-lb range. Nasty.

-gunny out.

Why god why, My precious Cowboy Lever Actions, WHY?

Because it's not 1873 anymore and somebody designed smokeless powder and fully automatic weapons. :hubbahubba: :celebration: :gun: :rofl:

(don't worry, they won't be nerfed that bad.)
-gunny out.

True, but it does damage the game's cowboy theme. Also, if anyone has the ability to contact one of the developers and ask them for details, I'm sure we'd all appreciate it.

I love my lever guns - I hope they're not nerfed too badly here. The AP cost doesn't matter to me since I don't use VATS anyway.

All this endless tinkering with the game's weapons, patch after patch, rather makes me begin to rethink the idea that there's no such thing as 'too many weapons'...

One another thing, why didn't 5.56 ammo get the -10DT effect, too?

I has some thoughts along those same lines, posted a topic about it and got roundhouse kicked to the head. There was overwhelming support for more and more weapons. But you're kinda seeing one of my points.


Or .308, which has a higher energy/area value. Josh had modeled some DT bypass on both at some point in one of the builds, but took it out. He didn't want the ammo to be too confusing. He decided on a design where all base ammos would have no effects on them and only hand loaded ammo would have effects.

-gunny out.

Do you know of this through looking at the game files? If so, I envy you PC users.