That still doesn't negate the fact that a laser pistol was turned into a laser rifle by adding a stock, or that a pipe pistol was turned into a pipe rifle.

Myself and several others made the logical conclusion that weapons that are only differentiated by a single mod addition

I honestly have not heard a single argument against this that was not based on opinion.

People either say well thats not how it was in old games, which is false because this crafting system is nothing like old games. That has been stayed by BGS.
Or
People say that BGS lowers the amount of weapons in each iteration of TES which is completely unrelated.

Thats a good point, but the Commando perk relates to Automatic weapons. And there is a perk called Sniper, which likely works on Sniper weapons.

Both Sniper and Automatic come before the Type in the name. Automatic Pipe Rifle and Sniper Laser Rifle. So i still contest that post-type* naming, like rifle or pistol, is somehow more meaningful.

*(type = f.e. laser, plasma, pipe)

The only meaningful way for this to work is if each base weapon is completely unique. In other words, all laser variations will stem from a single base weapon, all pipe variations from another, all baseball bats from another, etc. In the case of ranged weapons, this would also allow for turning rifles back into pistols for anyone who prefers this particular style of play. The system would be far too restricted if we were able to transition from one base weapon to another as some have suggested, as this would significantly reduce the total number of available options.

It's called rifleman and stated to affect all single shot rifles, key word rifles, and gunslinger affects pistols, key word pistol.

And commando affects automatic weapons, keyword automatic. Like automatic laster pistol or automatic laser rifle.

My point was that naming after Type, like Rifle and Pistol is not the only way the system identifies for the sake of perks. Before type naming, such as Automatic and Sniper, also works for the sake of perks.

Not sure about Shotguns, i can only imagine there is a Shotgun perk. In which case it could be naming both before and after type, Scattered Laser Rifle and Plasma Scattergun.

In that regard naming after type is not more meaningful or impactful than naming before type.

I haven't seen you make any arguments besides telling people they're wrong, despite providing evidence or reasoning, and you're not the only one in this thread so far.

As to the laser rifle becoming a shotgun, again there is the Metal Blaster in the Pitt. It increased the spread significantly and adds 8 other lasers. It made sniping worthless, but in Fallout 3 it did not change the play style in the least for me. I'm sure others could easily misconstrue this as a shotgun though. All I can say is it sounds just like a previous weapon I have seen, but I can't argue against hearsay

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To reiterate what I have said previously since people continue to ignore what Todd Howard said in the E3 conference: There ARE NOT 50 base weapons, as Todd Howard said there were OVER 50 base weapons. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-D8KDx2_eQ

Effectively making all these "but there are only 50 weapons so you're wrong, despite what we have seen" arguments baseless.

Possibly the first time I've agreed with you but I think you nailed it. From what we've seen, it looks like that's pretty accurate. One part I'd be hesitant about is the turning a rifle into a pistol part. While it may be, I think it's more likely that we're just see a semi auto rifle turn to full auto or a sniper. Some small changes but they affect how the weapon is used. Someone also mentioned double barrel rifles? I may have made that up entirely lol

Rather than name calling, try to contribute...

You just quoted me using the argument that a laser pistol turns into a rifle the moment you add a rifle stock yet fail to grasp that they would be the same base weapon??????

As far as mods to guns not changing how you play.

That argument is ludicrous. All guns in every game are either semi auto, automatics or shotgun.

You could play the same with a BB gun as a anti material rifle the only difference is accuracy range and damage all things mods change.

You're forgetting we likely will have different calibers of ammunition.

Let's take new Vegas as an example here.
You had 357 magnum. That could be a pistol cartridge or a lever action rifle cartridge.

You also had 5.56 mm that was primarily a rifle cartridge. But there was a unique pistol that could shoot it.

We will likely have something similar. A cartridge that is primarily used for pistols but you could mod into a type of rifle. And cartridges that are used primarily for rifles but you could mod them into certain pistols

Alright dude, first off there was no name calling in my posts, but if you'd like I can back up my assertion from your previous quotes throughout this thread calling other people's ideas nonsense, wrong, or claiming they're beyond reason for having differing opinions, or are tin-foil hat wearing maniacs. Oh and hey, in the above you claim my arguments are ludicrous, would you look at that?

I have been contributing: I have been posting links; I have been referring to previously established mechanics and weapons from previous games; I have been attempting to discuss with civility; I have provided information from Todd Howard himself. You and several others prefer to simply bash any skepticism or differing opinions though, can't have those, can we?

It depends on the weapon. The Assault Rifles didn't have any mod slots for changing them into pistols or non-automatic rifles - so I figure base weapons are just whatever weapons have the same mod slots. So yeah, a Laser Pistol and a Laser Rifle would be the same base weapon since they take the exact same mods and can be interchanged - but the Assault Rifle and Junkjet show, not all guns are as configurable.

Seriously though, it's not worth getting worked up over. They've spent years making this game, and plenty of time working on weapons and their mods - I don't think we'll lack for variety, even if there aren't as many straight-up guns as New Vegas.

But can you mod a laser pistol into a laser musket? Preston Garvey has a modified laser musket with a beam focuser and scope. It is possible that the Laser musket is using a different type of capacitor, but I like to think there are different styles for each weapon type. So there is the laser pistol and laser musket base weapons.

I think the Laser Musket is a separate base weapon - everything about the model is different, from the stock to the barrel to the scope, and none of those components were shown when they were modding the Laser Rifle/Pistol.

You know, this new crafting system might be a nightmare for the wikis.

That is likely, while I think there is a single laser core pistols and rifles, autos and snipers share, there can be a different "laser core" that an entirely different branch uses.

I dont think anyone argued that a laser pistol was able to be modded into a laser musket.

Military grade laser vs civilian grade/junk laser.

Its like a pipe pistol vs a 9mm pistol.

Upthread and last page, I worked out how the weapon system might look if this were the case. Basically, that. Energy Weapons organized by type of energy fired, Guns organized by caliber. Explosives, melee, and unarmed all have... different, more chaotic systems involved (though mostly seems to depend on "overall weapon type". I'm not seeing someone turn a Frag Mine into a Missle Launhcer, or a Sledgehammer into a Katana, though I can see a Frag Mine becoming a Grenade by removing the sensor module, and a Sledgehammer becoming a Super Sledge. I need to stress that this system is speculative, based only on the crafting video.)

This is my thinking as well. Some people like using military hardware while others like civilian hardware. If each base weapon has a military and civilian version, then it is easy to get over 50 base weapons. It will be interesting to see what a civilian minigun, Fatman, missile launcher, and laser gating gun looks like.

probably there are some core weapon types that are modable in a large extent like "laser" "pipe" "plasma" and then there might be some unique base weapons that have only very limited modability like the laser musket? maybe...

Completely agree with this. The laser musket will be a separate base weapon because it is too different from the others, but all other variations that we were shown in the crafting section will be derived from a single base weapon. This includes the laser pistol, laser rifle, and laser shotgun.

They didnt show any of the different mods for the Capacitor slot in the reveal trailer. So it's entirely possible that the hand-crank charger is one of them (or under More...)

This definitely looks like a completely separate base weapon, just because of how different it is from the other laser weapons.

The lase4 muskr5 really isnt that different. It's got a different ammo 5yoe, sort of. Instead pf inserting an energy cell, you insert a crank module.

Any rate, this thread is pretty funny in its "what is considered a base weapon?"-ness.

The Capacitor is the part where you put the microfusion cell, so where the "energy" comes from that powers the weapon. And this part can be modded, we know that much. We just haven't seen this part get modded in the crafting part of the trailer, but there is a Photon Exciter, Beta Wave Tuner, Boosted Capacitor, and More... A handcrank as seen on the Laser Musket might be possible.

It seems like the barrel of a Laser pistol/rifle is mounted on the stock of a rifle. We havent seen all possible Stocks yet for the Laser weapons either. And that contraption at the front seems like some kind of crude beam focus muzzle, and we havent seen all of those either.

I wouldn't rule it out as a series of modifications just yet, we've just seen but a part of the modifications that are possible for the laser weapons.

My guess is that the "civilian" version of big guns are going to be "junk" versions. Perhaps the junk jet, a tube missile launcher and some kind of hand crank Gatling gun.

Imagine a big 8 barreled crank Gatling laser rifle. Your guy hoisting it up cranking this big lever for it to fire.

Considering that I plan on playing with 2 weapons + frags. I think 50 is a lot. But thats just me.

The Laser Musket is actually quite different. The Laser Pistol and Rifle are refined weapons made of metal, while the Laser Musket appears to be a jury-rigged weapon with a wooden body composed of a laser rifle body and other electronics taped to a rod. It wouldn't make sense to go from a polished military design to a makeshift homemade form.

Even looking at the picture http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Laser_musket?file=Fallout4_Preston.png, you can tell that it does not have the look of a conventional weapon. I would say they are different base weapons not because of name, but due to how different the styles are.