West coast mutant theory

Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:49 am

Actually:

FEV causes sterility in some creatures. FEV does cause sterility in super mutants and ghouls - Marcus' comment in New Reno was a joke only (and it was an inappropriate one, for which I apologize for). For other creatures, however, the FEV does not cause sterility - in fact, it may actually speed up their reproductive cycles (in tandem with potential drawbacks). Known species that can reproduce after being mutated with the FEV include most species of Giant rats, the mantises (who are known to have bred so fast they cover the Salt Lake City area like blankets), the radscorpions, and the deathclaws. This is only a partial list.
The deathclaws in V13 are a special case; as part of the Enclave experiments, they were bred as fighting packs for the government. They were not supposed to be able to reproduce, but they were attempting to do so at the time of Fallout 2. It is extremely likely that the Enclave scientists would not have wanted the deathclaws to breed on their own for fear of losing control of them, but that doesn't mean they would have made mistakes in engineering limiters or sterility in them.
The wannamingos are a result of FEV virus experiments, but they are sterile. They are not aliens, but word is they were designed as FEV-tailored weapons for waging war on other countries... and they got loose. They do live a long time, but they were dying out at the time of Fallout 2. They have only been sighted in the F2 area and nowhere else in the wastelands.

This, specifically says that Deathclaws are products of Wild FEV.

Also, nowhere does it say all FEV was moved to Mariposa. It is only stated that research was transferred to Mariposa. There is nothing to suggest that West Tek moved every drop of FEV to Mariposa, and as seen in game, it is evident they did not, as we can see where FEV was stored, and cracked open, in the West Tek facility in FO 1.

The games themselves also dispute that radiation only causes mutation/ghoulification. This is mentioned in FO 1, and is evident in later games, 2, 3, and NV, where people are exposed to high levels of radiation and do not turn into ghouls or mutate. If this turns out to be Wild FEV or some other genetic X factor, we may never know, but it is clearly NOT just radiation, especially for ghouls.

Also note, the above mentioned Wannamingos contains an error, because, well, MCA is human and humans make mistakes. When encountering the Wannamingos in FO 2, they clearly have eggs, and thus, they were not sterile.

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Daddy Cool!
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:02 am

Good read. Most of what he says is backed up in Lore, as it appears in FO 1 and FO 2, and really has yet to be contradicted by 3 and NV. I hope that BGS has some scientist make note of Wild FEV in FO 4.

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Causon-Chambers
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:56 am

I think that's where the people with random mutant powers come from.
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Emmi Coolahan
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 5:28 pm

You were not wrong, Deathclaws are products of FEV. Wild FEV to be a little more precise. The source that Deathclaws were genetically engineered before the GW is not from in game, not to mention it doesn't make any sense, because it also says the Master made Deathclaws in his experiments with FEV. Which, makes no sense. Number 1. How did the Master get his hands on deathclaws(which were probably a lot different, maybe resembled something more like a Gecko at the time) and Number 2. Why didn't the Master use these Deathclaws? It doesn't make any sense, has never been backed by anything in game, and is contradicted later on in the FO Bibles.

I would say the Deathclaws are a mutated creature from the Wild FEV. This explains their presence all over the USA a lot more easier than being genetically engineered(which would make them a more remote creature, being in a specific area). It just doesn't make sense that they are engineered, captured and changed by the Master(thus being a WC specific creature), then some how breeding so fast they spread out across the entire USA. If Deathclaws spread that fast, and being pretty much on the top of the food chain, humans would have been wiped out.

What people and come from where?

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Nicole Elocin
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:18 pm

What people and come from where?[/quote] The occasional psycher you find in various games, as well as others like Vance from 3 who could regenerate by drinking human blood.
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Alexis Estrada
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 8:20 am

Are you saying they are mutated by Wild FEV? The part that lost me was the "this is where they come from" like you are hinting at an actual location.

They psykers from FO 1 were Master created by FEV. Anyone else with some psychic type abilities could have gained those from Wild FEV, hard to say.

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Julia Schwalbe
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:47 pm

I believe most mutations in fallout come from wild FEV(except ghouls) and the wastelanders who more than likely know nothing of FEV only attribute it to radiation.
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Javier Borjas
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:25 pm

There is no wild FEV, both Tim Cain and Chris Avellone have shot down that theory, and Bethesda went with the "radiation only" FACT in Fallout 3.

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Crystal Clear
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:12 am

FO Bible 8 isn't canon, and following that theory, breaks canon in many different ways. Tim Cain didn't rule out Wild FEV, he ruled it out in regards to Ghoul discussion only.

FO 3 is clearly not radiation only, as people exposed to radiation don't mutate but die. You as the LW, die. Other NPCs die. Some NPCs change(Moira). FONV same way. Radiation kills, some change. As far as the critters go, there is no reason in 3 or NV to not attribute their mutation to Wild FEV.

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Roddy
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:19 pm

NONE of the Bibles are officaly canon. However, both 8 and 9, the last ones made, agree that

-FEV = The Master, Harold, super mutants, psykers, floaters, centaurs, wanamingos, talking deathclaws
-Radiation = everything else

-It really doesn't though. All the giant animal mutations being radiation only fits perfectly in line with Fallout's universe being based on 50's nuclear paranoia, which often depicted radiation mutating animals into larger versions of themselves.
-If FEV had nothing to do with ghouls, why would it have had anything to do with any other normal mutation?
-Beyond the fact it doesn't make much sense. Unless Mariposa was directly under a jet stream nexus, theres no way the FEV would have made it over to the east coast simply by being blown into the air. We also know that wild FEV COULDN'T have caused these mutations as Lieutenant himself said that the FEV got mutated from the radiation, thus preventing things from suffering its full effects. Wild FEV, as per Fallout 1 canon, cannot cause mutations, period.

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Hot
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:07 pm


They actually haven't confirmed anything past Hines saying "200 years", and setting it before NV would go directly against BGS' practice of always moving the time line forward. They specifically had Obsidian set NV post FO3 to solidify this practice; otherwise Obsidian was going to set it before 3. It also wouldn't make much sense if the Airship is indeed from the CW, which was theorized because the Prydwen was Arthur's ship in Arthurian legend, implying that maxson has aged enough to be leading a brotherhood expedition.
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Amber Hubbard
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:27 am

after looking at the art of Fallout 4 u can see both greenish and yelloish mutants.

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Rachael
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:10 am

If they aren't canon, which they aren't, then you can stop using them as source. So it is irrelevant what the "last ones" said.

You read the Scott Campbell interview? He explains Wild FEV, and explains the storms caused by the nuclear war that carried it across the globe. Not unheard of, seeing how the Enclave going to do similar thing in FO 2 to wipe out the planet with their modified FEV.

Dr. Razlo in SS disputes radiation mutating animals alone, is the first clue in FO 1 to Wild FEV.

Wild FEV IS a mutated strain of FEV, that is another clue, given by the LT. The WILD FEV is what is preventing humans from becoming great SM, which is the whole point behind them wanting Prime Normals(they are not infected with Wild FEV).

Using the theory described in FO Bible does break canon in many ways, it basically retcons FO 1, the need for prime normals, Dr. Razlo, West Tek.

Going by what happens in game, which is backed up by 2 lead designers in Chris Taylor and Scott Campbell, Wild FEV is a fact, and has never been contradicted by anything else appearing in game, which was also a fact that MCA agreed with for years, until he succumbed to a FAN made theory, that actually broke canon and what appeared in game, is described in game, and can be seen in game.

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amhain
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 4:22 am

If you talk to one of the original developers they will tell you that the ghouls and mutated creatures are a result of radiation. if you talk to another, they will say a combination of radIation and "wild FEV". If you talk to a single developer twice with a couple of intervening years between conversations, you will find that he has changed his mind and the second explanation will be different than the first.

The West Coast had two generations of supermutants. The Gen1's created by the Master used "non-contaminated" or "pure" humans and produced the smart supermutants. The Gen2's were the result of your typical "contaminated" wastelander getting dipped and produced the low intelligence supermutants.

The Capitol Wasteland supermutants appear to have been produced by a different strain of FEV. All but two of the CW supermutants are of low intelligence. Fawkes and Uncle Leo are anomalies among the CW supermutants.

There are three possible sources for Commonwealth supermutants. They may be remnants of the Master's Army. They may be CW supermutants. There may be a third batch of supermutant producing FEV. Until we know more it is impossible to say as each source has its pros and cons.

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Leilene Nessel
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 8:05 am

1. Why is it ok for you to use them, as you did back in post 26, yet the second they dont agree with you, they are no logner canon? You can't have it both ways here.

2. Yes, it also doesn't make much sense becuase thats not how storms work.

3. Dr Razlo is a in-universe character, flawed and with limited knowledge. And as Clarke's Three Laws state "When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong."

4. Actually he says its becuase of RADIATION.

http://fallout.gamepedia.com/LT.MSG

{1005}{}{Normals}

{1105}{LIEUT61}{They are humans who have not been exposed to radiation. They tend to fare better in the Vats than others. You are a perfect example of this.}

5. No it doesn't, it just means Razlo was wrong, as people tend to be, as that the need for prime normals was becuase of radiation, as it was stated to be by Lieutanant, and it changes nothing about West-Tek, and actually more closely follows lore that all FEV research was moved out of West-Tek and into Mariposa before the war.

6. Going by whats said in-game by Lieutenant, and backed up by two devs, Chris Avellone and Tim Cain, wild FEV is not fact, and would have nothing to do with anything even if it did exist. Nothing in the game supports its existence other then an ancient dev interview that has long since been retconed by other dev interviews, that that breaks all logic when compared to everythng seen in-game.

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Jenna Fields
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 5:51 pm

If it was "moved" that means it was elsewhere to start with. Just saying that things get "lost" during a "move".

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Alex Vincent
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 4:21 pm

Actually he says it is because of mutated WILD FEV.

{194}{LIEUT30}{The FEV was mutated by the war radiation. Those living in this desolate wasteland have been exposed to this mutant FEV, essentially inoculating them from the full effects.}
{195}{}{So?}
{196}{}{So you need those who are uncontaminated in order to make Super Mutants?}
{197}{LIEUT31}{So, you're from a Vault and have limited exposure to this mutated virus. The original FEV in the Vats should work quite well on you.}
{198}{}{And how do you know this?}
{199}{LIEUT32}{We have done extensive experiments on humans to reach this conclusion. My master has been searching for unopened Vaults to prove his theories. And now you've come along. How thoughtful of you.}

Also, as I said before, Tim Cain never disputed Wild FEV. He only disputed it for ghouls. MCA didn't work on FO 1. So, it is actually 3 devs who all agree on Wild FEV, with differing opinion when it comes to Ghouls. Of course, all 3 of those devs would say Ghouls are ONLY supposed to be from Necropolis, and now that they are not, Tim Cain may change his mind about radiation only, and nobody has ever asked him, "well if it was radiation only, why are there not ghouls all over creation?"

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evelina c
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 7:17 pm

Interesting, do you have any links to it?
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Killer McCracken
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:06 pm

I'd like to see The Master return. They could make something up, about (since he was basically just a blob melded with machines and, having just watched the video of gameplay where he dies, only the top of his machine tower blew up) like that part of him wasn't destroied and he regenerated, or they could go a different direction and have a new mutant calling itself The Master that looks very similar. Maybe some of the surviving mutants tried to re-create the master and the new version is the result.

I know many fans are very much against this (hell, many don't even like that mutants and the enclave are even still around), but I love the master's design and "voice" so much I think its a shame he was only in one game. I'd also like to see a version of him re-done in a modern game, so I'd settle for a FO1 remake. I'd be awesome if bethesda outsourced fallout 3/4 style remakes of FO1+2 to another dev. They could do it the same way they have Oblivion do New Vegas, just give them the tools/assets of FO4 and redesign the original games.

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Josh Dagreat
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:58 pm

200 years after the Great War, which was in 2077. Fallout 3 began in 2277, 200 years after the Great War. Fallout 4 takes place 200 years after the great war, in 2277. New Vegas takes place in 2281, so yes, it's set before New Vegas.

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I love YOu
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 7:21 pm

I remember the interview stating that FO4 takes place 200 years after the bomb fell. But, what wasn′t stated is whether the time given is exact or an estimate. We still don′t exactly know when the game takes place and everything we do know about BGS actually suggests that the game takes place after NV.

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Sheila Reyes
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:02 am

There was a nuclear bomb in his basemant, regardless of how his fight with the Vault Dweller went (if they even fought at all) a nuclear bomb still turns his headquarters into a crater. See this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlSQAZEp3PA&t=0m25s him surviving is just about as believable.

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Marcus Jordan
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:16 pm

Well now it gets even more confusing, thanks to some resent footage we know their voices are the same as fallout 3 but the one we hear talking is fairly articulate. On the bright side we now know they have mutated dogs with them that may replace the centaurs.
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lauren cleaves
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:27 am

Good news everyone! It's now basically cannon that
Spoiler
you leave the vault 210 years to the day after you enter the vault
.

Please continue to pointlessly debate where the mutants came from prior to our getting a cannon answer to that question....
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Nicholas
 
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Post » Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:01 pm

I could still see a few WC mutants leading packs of CW mutants, if only to protect themselves. Not the majority, but just a few would be a nice surprise. Think about what their journey east would run them into: locust-infested Salt Lake (ugh), Legion, the MWBoS (who I'd imagine shoot first, shoot second, and pee on their corpse third). Or, more annoyingly, tribals that whittle their numbers down with guerrila tactics.

Or, perhaps, find a few strung up corpses and the CW mutants commenting how they "aren't like us, MORE LIKE PUNY HUMANS." Especially the nightkin. Could be a good set up for Fallout 5 and a brewing clash between the different populations. To be honest, I've always felt like the migrating Master's Army is a missing piece of the puzzle.

All in all, the WC mutants is a somewhat tragic story. Jacobstown being their chance to have peace. Kind of wish I could have done more with that community; robot army protecting the city, mutants supplying Brahmin and caravan guards, the Legion pushed back as NCR negotiates peace and uses The Fort as their bulwark against further Legion activity. *popcorn* per chance to dream.
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Stay-C
 
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