Yep, and Bethesda does love to rehash old plotlines, which is basically what Fallout 3 was. Main threats were Super Mutants (Fallout 1) and Enclave (Fallout 2).

Lyon division was allready spread thin by the time of FO3.

The fight with the enclave exhausted them and they have to protect the distibution of Aquapura.

Also depending on your choices the Lyon chapter has some leadership issues.

Or this is again a group who separated from lyon chapter or a new group...

Based on Caesar's comments, it's safe to assume that he has come into conflict with the Midwestern BoS before. But you gotta wonder, why hasn't his Legion expanded further east than Denver? One possible explanation, is that during his eastern expansion he came into conflict with the Midwestern BoS, maybe even had a few early victories taking out minor outposts at the very onset of it, but when the Midwestern BoS mobilized and showed their true power, it put a screeching halt to the Legion's eastward expansion.

Could you imagine a Midwestern BoS Paladin drawing a line in the sand, and saying "If you cross this line, you all die" to Caesar's Legion, as an airship and numerous vertibirds fly overhead? The Legion has absolutely nothing that could counter an airship or vertibirds, while the aircraft could wreak absolute havoc and annihilation on them with impunity.

Maybe the Legion being so close to Vault 0 isn't a sign of the Midwestern BoS' weakness, but rather a sign of their confidence and strength. The Midwestern BoS could see the Legion as no threat whatsoever to Vault 0, because it's so heavily defended.

Yeah, the Midwestern BoS had no part whatsoever in the war against the Enclave on the West Coast. Which means they'd also have no hostility against Enclave fleeing from the West Coast to the East Coast. We know there's an Enclave outpost in Chicago. Plus, the Enclave in Fallout 3 wore Power Armor that was suspiciously similar to that which the Midwestern BoS wore in Fallout Tactics. Perhaps they traded technology?

No he lived after Christianity was adopted by the Roman Empire. He was very likely in the Roman military, although by that time it doesn't mean he was Roman.

Well of course the legion isn't in the east coast during F3, NV takes place after F3. I was quoting without actually quoting someone else that said bethesda wouldn't do anything with West coast territory.

Yes honestly it probably is Sarah Lyons leading the BoS into Boston, they can make sense of anything. They still will have a lot to explain with the airship and time frame.

F4 takes place 3 weeks after, but they could come up with a story for the fully heavily armored well thought out constructed airship of SHIELD I guess somehow if they wanted to. Finding a airship would be 1/8 the battle of getting it to what we see flying over Boston.

The concept art also suggest multiple airships as a possibility in F4, but that is high speculation. Who knows.

Ultimately it's a video game and Bethesda owns Fallout, they can and will make sense of anything they want.

I really hope it isn't Lyons.

Xenophobic Technomunks aren't already a concept that I like a lot (yes this aimed at FO1 ) and think of it as creative. It's simply to far fetched for my taste.

When they did get "good" it actually becomes even worse but at least we got a good explaination in FO3 why it happend and also the Outcasts. It shows at least some development of this faction (something that the harsh critics of FO3 constantly demand and when it happens then they hate it and think "their" holy faction is destroyed).

The BOS of of Tactics was completly out of charater compared to FO1 & FO2 too. Still it was a more logical development imo. Yes I am one who wants to see more of them (or a splinter group) in FO4 and also finally get the solution which ending of Tactics is canon .

Or something completly different (which actually would be the best).

The NCR.

Lanius is the one who took Denver, and Lanius only came into power after Graham faled to take the Dam from the NCR n the first battle of Hoover Dam.

Ever since then, most of The Legon's forces have been occupied with the dam, leaving lttle time for expansion outside trying to bolster thier ranks to fight against the NCR.

My money is on Mid-Western Brotherhood.

They took the airships and headed East to persue The Master's army and crashed near Chicago. They have the exact same insigna as shown in the gameplay footage with the big cog on the right side of the insigna, or, pointing East. The Westcoast BoS has the big cog on the left of the insigna, or, pointing West.

Since Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 take place in the year 2277 it is very unlikely that the Lyon's brotherhood had the time to do all they did in Fallout 3 and somehow get airships operational, build up man power, and continue to Boston.

Whereas the MidWestern Brotherhood crashed at Chicago quite a long time before 2277. They had airships and could've had the time to rebuild them and continue heading East. They are considered a rogue chapter, and apparently had established harsh rule over the tribes in the Chicago area.

We've seen the BoS as enemies in Fallout 4. It seems more likely that a chapter like the Mid-Western, that seems to exert harsh dominance, would be an antagonist organization than the Lyon's chapter which is far more benevolant towards wastelanders.

For those wondering about the Vertibirds. The Enclave, after the destruction of the Oil Rig, fled to Chicago as well. It's entirely possible the Mid-Western Brotherhood got their hands on Vertibirds from this group of Enclave.

So in short. My money is on the Mid-Western Brotherhood fixing their airships, heading further east, and continueing their oppresive mindset which leads to a direct conflict with the locals in Boston as well as the Sole Survivor.

This is a common misconception, both Lyons and the MwBoS use both styles of logo interchangeably.

Point is the MW bortherhood does use this insigna.

I personally like to think that Bethesda is going for the arthurian theme for all BoS factions in thier games and that this faction is an entirely new division of BoS.

Reading your previous messages , You seem to think the Brotherhood of Steel don't kill raiders and talon company so therefore they are good guys.

That is backwards thinking as they do kill supermutants which are the BIGGEST threat, They would be stupid to try and get rid of every thing at once.They also bring water to different settlements so they are undisputable good guys.

I said no such thing, and I have no idea where you got that notion from.

They actually don't, and have been trying to get Rivet City to take over the whole distribution network since they don't want to deal with it themselves. Actually playing Broken Steel would help with your arguments.

That is solid speculation.

Regardless of the inconsistency with the insignia their are facts about it.

In Fallout tactics the only west coast variation of the insignia shown is on the banners behind Barnaky in the cinematics. Every piece of armor, and every vehicle in game had the MwBoS suggested variation of the insignia.

I would haft to see a in game screenshot of the F3 BoS with the MwBoS suggested variation of the insignia. I am not saying it's not their necessarily just as a disclaimer, if it is their it does blow the entire insignia speculation out the window completely.

I would love to see the Midwest BoS in there somewhere..if not..mods .

Here are 6

https://i.imgur.com/uQ58D6p.jpg

i still bet my money on Lyons BoS. But for me will depend on when Fallout 4 take place, MWBoS make sence too if the Mutants are part of the Master army. But at the same time Lyons BoS make sense since is close to DC and they can be fallowing Mutants from DC.

Then that is the end of the insignia debate/speculation.

Unfortunately because I also think it would be cool to see the MwBoS in Boston. Their is still the chance because of the airship/s, but that is the only thing they have going for them now. Bethesda can explain the airship even in the short time between F3 and F4 if they want.

Now I really don't know what division is in Boston, but man am I curious to find out. I am still going with West Coast.

The West Coast BoS has never used that symbol though, and thats the symbol seen on the Prydwen.

Yea but the Fallout 3 BoS armor has this,

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/b/b6/Fallout_3_PA.jpg/revision/20101030181613

They are not consistent, you said and proved i t. So the insignia's do not have a effect on my speculations anymore. Yes in Tactics the insignia's are consistent on the in game power armor and vehicles, but seeing as their is both variations of the insignia clearly being shown in Fallout 3 across the board.

Its the airship, if it wasn't for the airship their would be like 0 speculation on my end because with all the seeds they planted in F3. 3 week time span is nothing, DC is close to Boston, the DC BoS could easily roll up into Boston strong within that time frame. Its the airship or airship/'s, as F4 concept art suggest the possibility of multiple airships.

How are the airships explained if it is the DC BoS?

It should, just because the MWBoS and Lyons BoS are known to use both symbols does not mean the west coast BoS have ever used both symbols.

Well then its just the airships that tell me their is a chance it is not the DC BoS, take the airship or possible airship/s out of the equation then its straight DC Lyon's. Anyway will just see, here is hoping from MwBoS, but highly doubt it.

I mean if you want to get super obsessive, if we all haven't already, or I will admit I have about this. The Fallout 3 BoS power armor does not match the Fallout 4's power armor Insignia's.

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/b/b6/Fallout_3_PA.jpg/revision/20101030181613

Then the concept art for Fallout 4

http://i.imgur.com/ztBR8aJ.jpg

They are the most likely candidates. They have immediate access to and airship wrecks and husks.

I don't think they can be.

Pete Hines confirmed that Fallout 4 takes place 200 years after the war, that would place it in the year 2277. The same year as Fallout 3. A Brotherhood that was already a small splinter group took heavy losses does not suddenly come up with Airships out of nowhere.

The Airship seems for when you want to move large numbers and material, which the Lyon's Brotherhood did not exactly have after the events of Fallout 3. The insigna on the side of the Prydwen has definitely been used by the MWBoS, so as far as that goes they are still in the running.

If it is Lyon's they'd have to explain where they got the materials for such an operation. Where they got the airship. Why they are suddenly the bad guys when previously they were the good guys. And where they got the time for all this to develop.

If it's NW they have almost a blank slate with decades of unwritten lore to fill in, all we know is they had airships, they had been building up numbers, and they were not to kind to the locals which sets them up for being the antagonists we saw.

Where in Fallout 3 does it say they took heavy losses, and you do know Rothchild is only assuming about the Rogue Chicago division.

Fallout Tactics begins 80 years before Fallout 3, 80 years. If you played Fallout Tactics, you will know that the normal ending shows the MwBoS expanding.

Rothchild also says the DC division is a small division as well in Fallout 3.

Then finally, in Broken Steel the captured vertibird, the BoS armor, and the citadels flag insignia all match. Its not not the MwBoS variation, then what I linked above. The Fallout 4 BoS power armor insignia does not match the Fallout 3's BoS power armor insignia.

Possum did link 6 in game images that do have the MwBoS insignia apparently, so again its like who knows.

But the MwBoS are likely candidates for Fallout 4, its like you said, they are not the good guys. Though they won't be the main antagonist I doubt. The Institute is the highest speculated main enemy of Fallout 4. You already have other obvious good guy factions in Fallout 4, whatever BoS division/faction is in Fallout 4 they are going to be a grey area, id put a 100 caps on it.