I have been obessed with this for awhile, and I thought I'd ask the Bethesda forum on what BoS division they think is in Boston.

Your Options:

Known West Coast Division
Known East Coast Lyons DC Division
Known Chicago Division aka Midwest Division

Or a entirely new Division

I am going with West Coast

All evidence points to Lyons.

CANADIANS

i think is part of Lyons division, maybe not under his directive.

I really hope not Lyons. That would be a huge disservice.

It was so interesting to find out that the brotherhood really were not knights in shining armor. After playing FO 3 and looking into the lore I learned that the Outcasts were the true brotherhood and that Lyons group were the real outcasts. Seeing how they were done in new vegas gave me so much hope in seeing a truly amoral Rule & logic driven faction.

I would hate for BGS to beat home the point that the brotherhood was all a bunch of goody two shoe Care Bears. Having them be cast as the "good guys" in two consecutive BGS games will sadly cement them forever in the role of saviors.

That will take a multi dementional group and paint them into a corner in all future FO lore.

Maybe there will be more than one. If Lyons faction is there, the Outcasts could be too and maybe this time they will actually be at each other's throats.

I'm more than certain that Lyon's BoS will now be under new leadership, and will have a very different focus than was seen during Fallout 3. Most likely candidate will be Arthur Maxson, which could suggest a 'back to roots' approach. I also have a strong feeling that they will go directly up against a number of other factions in the Commonwealth, including the Railroad, as well as the army of synthetics that we haven't been told about yet

You would know that if you played Fallout 3.

Except the while point of the BoS is that they aren't multidimensional. They have been the EXACT same since Fallout 1, and that's what is killing them.

The only time the BoS got actual depth to them was in Tactics and Fallout 3, which showed that the BoS wasn't the singular monolithic entity was portrayed as being in past game, and that some people can actually see how getting others on their side is beneficial.

Well, since they are in Boston, they call themselves the "Loy-ens"

Eh, I'm alright with it being Lyon's group.

If it's outcasts...Well...Gotta test the new weaponry on someone right?

Wishful thinking is it will be the Midwest directly from Tactics, that would be just too damn cool.

Given how the Midwestern Brotherhood was totally unable to stop The Legion's advance into the Colorado area, even into Denver, especially when the MWBoS's main base is in Cheyenne Mountain, located just south of Denver, I doubt its them.

There would also be the problems of where they got the Vertibirds, given that they left the West Coast years before The Enclave showed up, thus would have no knowledge of them.

MwBoS is who I'm staking with.

While I did think Lyons' Brotherhood of Steel was bland in Fallout 3 - that doesn't mean they have to be going forward. There's plenty of ways they could be made more interesting in Fallout 4 than they were in Bethesda's previous game, so I don't think we should write them off just yet.

How does that paint them into a corner any more than the insistence that a group can't change at all in over 200 years? The hardline BoS practically died out because they went to war with the NCR. Like it or not, the BoS can't go it alone anymore. They can't maintain their numbers internally against a much larger and reasonably well supplied fighting force. When they were fighting half-starved tribals armed with spears and junk guns, the BoS was the big dog. That is no longer the case. And in what universe does the Capitol Wasteland BoS pass as "goody two shoe Care Bears"? If you really find the concept of not just letting everybody else die that cloying, your mother went very wrong somewhere along the line.

Here's how it would go down if the BoS acted like they used to:

Knight: Hand over the laser rifle, wasteland scum!

Waster: There are 15 of us and only two of you; last time I checked, our number is higher.

Knight: Then we'll have to take your technology by force!

*pew pew pew pew pew pew pew pew pew pew*

Waster: Shame we had to slag their armor; that stuff's pretty valuable.

Other waster: I don't know why those guys threw their lives away like that. They could have just bought weapons just like these right in town.

Theoretical, would it be possible if a new faction is introduced?

if the game happen near the time of F3 the war with the NCR still didnt happen.

Distance and vertibird use points at this being Lyon's brotherhood but I have no idea about the airship and no-one can get a clear view of their insignia.

The war with the NCR had been going on for years before NV.

Lyons mentions in Fo3 that the brotherhood has been struggling out west, and Rothchild says they haven't had contact with the west in years.

The BoS had likely been warring with the NCR for a decade even before Fo3 began.

We have seen the insignia actually, during the shot of the Prydwen being destroyed.

Its the same mirrored symbol that Lyons and the Midwestern Chapter use.

I double checked the timeline, and the war had already been going on for years. The NCR attacked Helios One in 2276.

The mojave chapter managed to stay out of the ear somewhat longer then the rest of the west coast brotherhood.

Not necessarily all evidence. The Airship evidence leans more towards MWBoS, despite the name. None of the evidence is 100%.

Even if the game was 10 years after FO3, I highly doubt Arthur Maxson will be the leader. Elders are generally just that, elder. He would maybe, MAYBE be a Paladin, more thank likely still a Knight. IMO the most likely candidates for Elder after Lyons is Sara Lyons or Rothschild, or that scribe that we meet in FO 3 in the library. It wouldn't surprise me if one of those two scribes was Elder and Sara was High Paladin, the Rhombus of the ECBoS.

That would be nice. It is who I would like to see.

Under new leadership is a different boat. So long as they don't carry a cross to save everyone. I dont mind them doing good things, as long as they are not the "good guys out to save the wastes" again.


Way to bring personal attack into this debate, your mother clearly excelled in the manners department.

The NCR was believable. Their goal was rule and the stability that was required to maintain it. Sorry but if you think any fighting force risks their lives for no reason other than the "greater good" i have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

Lyons group was acceptable because it was loyal soldiers fighting for a crazy old man they respected. But outside of those loyal to Lyons there is no reason for these guys to act like they did. It's simply not in human nature.

They were never that to begin with, hence why they didn't bother attacking the raiders, salvers, or Talon Company, despite all of them being threats to the people of the wastes, and most of them being fairly easy to exterminate.

They only attacked the super mutants because
A. That was part of their mission.
B. Lyons saw a means to use that, and project purity, as a PR stunt to get people to join his order so they dont go the way of the west coast BoS.

And even when they did finally attack Talon Company in Broken Steel, it wasn't because they were [censored]s who had been attacking innocent people for years. Na, their reason was because Talon Company was taking their water.... their PR campaign water.

And its also why Lyons BoS still shot at non-feral ghouls, and weren't given them clean water. They don't give two flips about friendly, non-hostile, non-feral ghouls.

I'm on the fence with that. If Obsidian is given another shot then I would prefer they handled a MWBoS instead of Bethesda..

Depending on how close this game takes place to Fallout 3 I will be extremely disappointed if it's Lyons Brotherhood though.