That Cyrodiil wasn't a jungle with tatooed monks and diversion between nibenay and Colovia.

You must not have been on these forums when Morrowind was released. The hate directed not only at Morrowind but at the players who liked Morrowind was ugly. It was so harsh I had to stop coming here for a few months. It didn't let up until a month or two after Tribunal was released. To this day I have kind of a chip on my shoulder against Daggerfall because of the arrogant, superior, insulting tone taken by fans of that game against the fans of Morrowind years ago.





You're correct, but this has nothing to do with what Borbarad and TES_Ronin said. The issue brought up by their posts is not "does an optional feature impact the game?" It is, rather, "Why would anyone dislike an optional feature?"

We all know fast travel impacts the game. I know of no one on either side of the fast travel debate who would deny that. It is precisely because fast travel impacts the game that it is necessary to point out now and again that it is optional.

Well then people dislike an optional feature because if the game is developed with the intent of players using that optional feature then not using that "optional" feature is to the detriment of the player.

Hell, if you don't like fast travel, don't use it. No reason to complain about it for years. I for one haven't got the time to run around the map doing nothing for extended periods of time and therefore am grateful for the feature.
I haven't played the previous titles, but from what I can remember, I disliked the all knowing guards and the sneaking system. Shouldn't forget about the stupid animals and creatures that would constantly attempt to chase me in the mountains. The constant battle music really was irritating. There was one thing I had hated the most though, the females, they looked more like ugly men in wigs than anything. Unfortunately I will probably be getting the PS3 version this time around, so hopefully they will do something about it, since I won't be able to use mods.
Oh, I almost forgot, the damn superman theme. Hell, I don't want to become the guild master of every guild I join, save the world and crap like that. Why can't the stories be about something less important and more realistic? I want to be a part of the world - not the center of it.

The villains. I have gimped dialogue with Ur, and none with Mankar, who's portrayal as a lunatic is much irksome. The insane card is too commonly played.

Everyone's insane, it's in the metaphysics. Why should villainy always be tagged to insanity?

From my understanding most people who dislike Oblivion's fast travel on this forum generally don't like it for the way it was implemented in Oblivion. It's not that they want it gone so they can run everywhere, just that they would prefer it be revamped and made more realistic.

No, Morrowind didn't have it perfect either, but I think Oblivions was a step back from that.

Morrowind's was perfect IMHO. It was realistic.

But... you joined these forums about six months before Tribunal going by your join date. And if you were gone for several months back then... well, it seems odd that you'd have a chip on your shoulder from maybe a few months of jerks.

Even besides that, if we buy that the tone was the same then as it is with Morrowind fans criticizing Oblivion (and I'm not sure I buy that - I have seen some examples of what people were like back then and I've talked with more than a few people about it, and while a lot of people say that things were harsh back then the kinds of things they say Daggerfall fans would say never seem anywhere near as directly insulting as how Morrowind fans who dislike Oblivion always talk about the game) then going by what you've said it ended around the first month of 2003. Morrowind was released in May of 2002, so that would mean that you saw what the release of just about every game sees: a sudden rush made up of a handful of jerks who come in, scream at everyone, and then leave because the new game isn't like the game they liked.

Basically, let me put this in perspective: from what you're saying, people were ripping at Morrowind fans for about eight months after release here. We're past four and a half years after the release of Oblivion, and Morrowind fans are still doing the same thing. There's no equivalence there.


Two things:

1) Fast travel in Oblivion isn't really optional, because quests are designed with the specific assumption that you'll be using it. If you don't use it, there's a huge amount of quests in the game that force you to walk the entire length of the map. If you aren't using fast travel, the main quest becomes almost unplayably boring.

2) People dislike optional features because every feature in a game, optional or otherwise, has an influence on the overall tone and feel of that game. Even if someone doesn't use fast travel, the fact that fast travel is available in the game has an impact on the feeling and believability of the game world - the knowledge that you can instantly teleport to wherever you'd like to go changes things, whether or not you ever use that ability.

EDIT:
Actual realism is rarely perfect. In Morrowind's case, the fast travel system didn't cover nearly enough locations on the map, as I recall it wasn't possible to actually plot out a route unless you had it memorized which towns could bring you to which towns (which... isn't realistic at all, since if there were a network of silt strider operators they'd likely be entirely capable of telling you what route to take to get where you wanted to be), and every station always had a silt strider in it that never moved, whether or not you paid for it (again, not exactly realistic).

That last point's easy enough to respond to, since it'd be extremely frustrating if the silt striders were almost never in because they were off delivering people elsewhere... but the minute you bring that up you're admitting that realism isn't the end-all be-all.

I even though I played Oblivion for a while I still never remember to fast travel unless its heading back to town.....I gallop around and get lost, look at the compass and turn around, get lost again, wash, rinse and repeat.

But fast travel services are less necessary in Oblivion due to the presence of mounts, which reduce travel time pretty immensely if you invest in one of the better ones. In fact, considering how horseback riding actually allows you to see ruins and caves and unmarked villages on the way to your destination, I'd argue that it's preferable to Morrowind's fast travel, where your options are walk at a snail's pace or teleport.

That said, I do miss Divine Intervention spells...

I hate how nearly elder scrolls tittle from arena to morrowind failed on combat, they had the same thing in common combat was sloppy, unresponsive,slow,jerky,repetitive,dull, and uninspired.

This is the only comment I found on this thread that is not a biased opinion or a baseless statement. You took the entire series into account instead of only taking into account the two latest titles in the series.You also presented your argument with facts showing how Morrowind was the actual divergence from the series rather than Oblivion. You, my intellectual friend, are deserving of a cookie and a smiley that no sane person would ever think of using. :shocking:

The best thing to do whit Skyrim is to take all the best things from series, improve them, and kick out all the bad things.
The same thing GSC did whit S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Call of Pripyat, they packed all the good stuff from predecesors and improved them.

I AM a Morrowind fan, because its my first RPG, and no, I dont troll Oblivion fans.

All this flaming MORROWIND vs OBLIVION in my opinion is plain bull[*CENSORED*]. Both are good games, and they all have + and -.

Also I dont know why, but I am more attracted to less popular games (Darkest of Days, ArmA 2, Mount&Blade, Dungeon Lords...), that have lots of bugs, than lets say Crysis, Dragon Age etc.

Oblivion's level scaling
Morrowind's "chance to miss" combat system (although I don't mind spell failure)
Random glitch in OB that prevents almost all of my characters from starting the last thieves guild quest
The replacement of travel services with fast travel
Fans that take every opportunity to bash console gamers

Edit: Oblivion's lack of spears, can't forget Oblivion's lack of spears :banghead:

There were no silt striders or boats or mark/recall so it wasn't practical not to.
Same deal with the quest markers, the quests weren't designed to be completed in reasonable time without them, you couldn't ask NPCs for directions.

I hate the Whole Morrowind vs Oblivion thing. Don't like one? Don't play it, it's not rocket science.

psychic killer guards who seem to know your crimes pretty quickly...

The fanbase. :spotted owl:

Nah, just kidding. You guys are great. :happy:

How much health monsters had in Oblivion by the time you reached the higher levels. I remember running away from mudcrabs, because my character was stealth oriented and at a high level. Those guards were right, mudcrabs were fiercer than me.

Daggerfall- hated the ridiculously huge and often illogically laid out dungeons.
Morrowind- hate cliff racers and the levitation animation.
Oblivion- hated level scaling and the quest compass.