Yup, and the sales figures certainly show that...

Morrowind was better. Skyrim is an "arcade-RPG". Still fun, but Morrowind felt more serious. I think the really thought-out journal helped it a lot. Why the hell doesn't Skyrim have such a nice journal?

3) Played enough TES games even if they haven't played Morrowwind to have an understanding of TES. I probably would have enjoyed it and perhaps even played more than 20 minutes if I had known about Mods to fix it up... but as its base game I just couldn't get into it like I did with with Arena or Daggerfall or even Oblivion. Morrowwind never even made my top 100 list.

Cause we live in a GPS culture, lol. I like the the previous TES journals.

What made Morrowind stand out for me was it was the first game of its kind i ever played. I was amazed at how awsome it was. The freedom to run anywhere I want was great for a bit. Then I got oblivion and I loved that even more. It felt much more refined gameplay wise to me. Felt more realistic. Now I love skyrim out of the three because I feel they tried to take the best from the past games and put it into skyrim. I think they did a pretty good job.

The combat is superior to both past games. The stories are just as good in each game I think, I can`t really say which one is best because I liked them all including all the dlc`s for MW and OB, each one had it`s own feeling behind it. Though I can say at the end of oblivion when Martin turned into the dragon at the end and died I was overcome by sadness and pride because I didn`t want to him die but was honored to have met him and call him friend. Never felt that way in any quest in MW and haven`t found any like it yet in skyrim.

One thing I truly miss from MW was levitation because they always hid goodies and loot in places you would never find unles you could levitate. All the games were great but I feel like skyrim is the best of the three. Yeah it might be missing some options MW had but I think it makes up for it in diferent places. Mods are going to make this game truly even more incredible.

3) Have an opinion that differs from yours. Doesn't make them wrong.

Nostalgia doesn't mean [censored], a game is a game and you know how you feel when you play it.

Amen. Skyrim is definitely better than Oblivion in almost every way. However, I still have a problem with the game being about player skill more than character skill in some respects (*cough* lockpicking *cough*). I'm not going to vote on the topic of depth because I've still got a lot to do in Skyrim, but from what I've seen so far, MW has way more depth in story and world interactions.

(I still have a problem with the game being about player skill more than character skill in some respects (*cough* lockpicking *cough*). )

in skyrim, character skills = perks. thats what the alchemist wife means when she say she s not an real alchemist.
with the lockpicking perks, if you make it a priority, lockpicking is not just a total joke,
you also get wax keys and extra treasures.

skirim is all about perks. percentage only get you so far, its your natural talent
but if you never hit the books, you are still a wannabe

but its true for high magic spell like wall of frost, both mental and dextrous ability are required, as well as commmon sense



How much have you seen ...

my character specialty is stealth, and next is illusion
all he does is exploring
I m on master degree, so not much choice there
unless I wanna be fed to the wolves

skyrim is filled with beauty, I spent hours just looking for viewpoints up in the mountains, both in markath, solitude,
and in the wilderness

there are spots in the high mountains on the high rock frontier
that let you look down at the see (up north)
or down at the central plains (central high rock frontier, on the highest peak)

and yes, you can do rock climbing, of a sort, but its hard




I never got affraid in morrowind. diablo I was the last game that scared me (diablo II was not scary)
skyrim actually managed to scare me a lot
granted, I play on master difficulty,

but even when I took a break and created a level 252 jack of all trade cheated character,
I still managed to get killed on the road by an upset female orc

thalmor patrol, wandering trolls, giants, dragons,
the list of what can one-hit kill you is endless

but atmosphere is the scariest, I was gathering samples in the woods (with my real character)
arround solitude when I got ambushed by spiders out of nowhere
I ran like hell and barely made it, thanks for staking on sweet rolls
(so I can have a chance to gather the ingredients to make potions...)




skyrim start is even less clear, and contrary to morrowind we can side with the rebels, or ignore both factions, or play the thalmor agent...
in fact when you finally escape, no matter how you did it, you can turn right or left be anyone you want
the only minus was the lack of a khajit caravan option, or other alternate start
(yes you can disobey what they tell you and even get cooked by the dragon, I died in the intro once, thinking it was a cinematic)
(you can even outrun both guys and make it by yourself, ignoring everyone and running)




solstheim and tribunal were not balanced for level one, I guess you never played them.
you could cheat by going their, stealing all the loot, return to morrowind equiped like a god

you know where you want to go .... only if you do quest where they tell you to go somewhere
daggerfall had the exact same thing, and even morrowind did that (deliver messafe to divayth fyr)
also the silt strider took you to all the towns. I fail to see the difference

now, there is a lot more to explore in skyrim
when I started, I took accross the big mountain
had to avoid gaiants, bears, wolves, mages dueling or something like that,
finally helped the companions backstab a giant in a farm

since then, doing master difficulty, I was unable to progress far in bleakfall barrow, at first couldnt even get there,
bandits being too hard, so 90% was in the farms and forests arround the main towns, in search for food,
or fishing near riften

never can tell what happen next, sure everyone want me to do quests.
some I can many I cant. some I did much latter





The only thing it lack is a journal to note down what peoples say. voice over is nice, but text is usefull
I think they say more in words than what was written for morrowind.
so much background lore its stagering

in morrowind they hardly refered to the outside world. if you go to windhelm there is a solid
injection of morrowind lore there, and also in the mage guild story.
there is even a cliff racer drink made by an argonian. LOL !



wich I never did, but ok...
However in Skyrim I feel like I m walking in the footsteps of Talos, becoming the new Talos
I feel an xpack or 10 coming this way

Which remind me, I took a break and created a cheated level 252 character recently, he got attacked by a boethian cultist and found a book inviting him to join in a far off place.
he was also instantly visited by a mage wanting to duel, which killed my level 252 character... because he had no spells yet, and the other guy was really an archmage or sometging, after which I had to relead and ignore the provocation

I also got some letters about a museum, and ... well, too many things to describe
its choke full of lore

which remind me, some aspect of morrowind I didnt like. for example killing your wife and best friend (almalexia and sotha sil) while helping the bastard egomaniac who murdered you in your previous incarnation (vivec) it made no sense to force the player down those roads. if anything I would have liked to help dagoth ur against vivec.

but other aspects I liked, especially the whole telvani part. that was verry rich. redoran were... I dont know, sketchy, and hlaalu even more so. they were not as deep lore-wise as the telvani. the temple was well done, but it just felt natural to hate them, being the nerevar and all



I dont get you
in morrowind the highest bandits were level 15 and could be killed right away

after bloodmoon and tribunal was released, it became a joke
go to tribunal, hire the clown, go to sewer, kill guy with glass armor
(I really mean let the clown do it)
I mean that guy is like at the first sewer entrance,
and the clown greet you right away to be hired
then go to skyrim, grab all the stuff you want at the fort

at this point you could return to vardenfell, trash the whole island,
get all the artifacts, you are ready for tribunal and solstheim

in comparison, skyrim is totally hellish. even armed to the theet, a spider can one-hit kill you

I knew that post would get under someone's skin.

You're right that people are entitled to have their own opinions. As I pointed out earlier in this thread however, not all opinions are equal. Sometimes some people are just more informed than others. That's a fact of life. Ask a 7 year old for their opinion on various matters, and you'll likely get a load of uninformed responses.

...

Anyway, I think we should just agree to disagree. I'm too tired to go into a long rant on why Morrowind is superior to Skyrim both in terms of RPG elements and open-world elements. It's all been said a thousand times before...

Atmosphere was a big part of it for me. I don't miss Morrowind attributes, or combat and I'm surviving ok without spell crafting (longer quests would be nice though). But the atmosphere... emerging from below decks on the prison ship, catching site of the Stilt Strider and hearing that mournful cry - gaming magic.

Great setting that was tremendous fun to explore, learn about and interact with and build glorious mushroom towers in while growing as a character. Not perfect, no, but so good. I've gone back to it many times.

Heh, and one of my fondest scares from a game - just venturing out from Seyda Neen for the first time when I hear (through great headphones with volume turned up way to high) an ear splitting shriek - made me jump and I'm spinning around, waving a dagger thinking I'm under attack when a guy falls out of the sky and practically lands at my feet...

And I'm having just as much fun with Skyrim.



Ah cliffracers. The first thing I ever soul trapped in an ES game. I was on my way to Balmora, just near the legion, and there was a terrific storm going on when a cliffracer nearly killed me (can't remember why I was so beat up when it attacked). Wheew, I thought, that was intense.



I really liked that to. Especially when it came to my Telvanni mushroom stronghold, at the time (and it still does) it struck me as brilliant the wizards would build towers were levitation was practically a requirement to get around it, it added a lot of character and made a lot of sense - it felt right.



As a big Morrowind and now a big Skyrim fan:

I love reading books in all TES games. My Morrowind/Oblivion/Skyrim house(s) are full of every book I could buy or steal.

I don't miss Morrowinds encyclopedia conversations (well maybe Skyrim Lore would be nice) however. I remember when I first got to Pelagiad and was super excited when I entered the tavern and got the barbarian saying "me no speak good English" - score, I thought, finally some new dialogue. But no, after his proclamation his English wasn't good it turned out it was as great as every other commoner/noble/shop keeper/beast race in the game when it came to saying the exact same thing as them.

By Balmora when it seems like there was at least 30 topics to ask a NPC about (except obviously quest related ones who would have practically no options till their quest started), well, lets say it was hard to want to click on each of them to see if anyone had anything new to say (which they mostly didn't). Skyrim doesn't have General Tullus or Astrid producing 50 replies to topics that are exactly the same as those from a beggar women, Morrowind would. So no, I don't miss that reading as sheer quantity doesn't replace quality in this case.



Because different tastes and points of view don't exist.

That is right, although in the context... it doesn't seem you are debating any 7 year olds over which game is "superior", and since aspects of setting, plot, play style etc are factors in this debate subjectivity is going to be pretty high and since we don't have a quantum computer that can give an objective answer it is kind of hard to look at the opinions here and say "you win".

Thats simply not true. Ive clocked more hours into morrowind then i have into both oblivion and skyrim put together(mind you im only at 250 for skyrim and i know im gonna play it a lot more but i already know its not gonna have the replay value of morrowind - it might beat out oblivion i have yet to see though). Oblivion i have to mod the [censored] out of it for any replay value (i completely [censored] the vanilla oblivion) but morrowind i only ever get the magicka regen mod and thats it, and i still havent even done all the factions in that game let alone seen every dungeon or done every quest.

All in all i think morrowind is the superior overall rpg, with more replay value and substance underneath but skyrim is still a very fun action fantasy rpg(ish) game. Morrowind has way more personality with their characters and much more interesting storyline and a world that you can feel the politics in the air, Skyrim's empire vs stormcloaks questline i found to be VERY very shallow with any lack of substance - the whole questline seemed like go here kill fort, go here kill fort, attack town, kill fort kill fort, attack town you're done. In my opinion the civil war quests is the most bland questline in the game without any sense of accomplishment with terrible missions.

just look at joining the imperial legion in morrowind over joining the legion in skyrim, in morrowind there was a giant questline with missions like breaking out fellow legionaires out of dark magic user's prisons, collecting legendary artifacts for the imperial dragon order, and not to mention the whole Ordinator versus Legion battles they have in the background between eachother. The legion in skyrim was like a quarter the size if not smaller, with only 2 types of missions, take forts and attack a city, and the attack a city quests were the most half assed siege missions in any game ive ever seen, lets attack a town with 6 guys and have an epic battle out of it somehow!! yay! you felt like you killed a minor bandit raid or something i just didnt enjoy the civil war questlines at all.

Also Morrowind has like 3 if not 4 times the amount of factions you can join then you can in skyrim, AND they are all like 2 to 6 times longer then any given questline in skyrim with MUCH more interesting finale quests and you actually felt like the leader of any given faction when you were done.

The Morrowind had zero depth. You took the quest, killed the baddie, and returned for reward. Repeat, rinse. Useless gimmicks like unclear descriptions, locks and persuasion are not depth, they are gimmicks.

In terms of an open world RPG, Morrowind takes the cake. For a themepark ride, I'd probably have to give that to Skyrim. Which one of those types of games do I prefer? The first.

I just can't stand some of the lack depth that Skyrim has. Marriage, although a new feature in the series has some of the worst sort of depth I've ever seen in an elderscrolls game. It pretty much consists of, put an amulet on, and say "YO, MARRY ME!" and blap, it's all said and done. That being said, Skyrim offers a lot in the department of flashyness and action. The character creation impressed me, and the combat in the game is the best I have seen in a while. One thing that I can say is extremely irritating about Skyrim, that is no doubt influencing my opinion, is the constant bugs that plague the game. That and it was released with the Xbox in mind, and not PC gamers.

That's a whole different topic though.

In my opinion, in terms of what is a superior game, for me it would have to be Morrowind because it just appeals to my type of gameplay.

You'd be wrong.

On the "irrefutable fact" subject anyways.

You can have your opinion that Morrowind is better. But it's not fact that Morrowind is the better RPG. Not in the slightest.

You know you don't have to fast travel, right?

I don't.

One thing i have noticed about morrowind is that it had an extremely fantasy setting and did a very good job at making you feel like a foreigner. You see the main characters, the dummer look scary for first timers. They have many customs that are completely incompatible with our culture, like a guild of serial murderes which is aproved by the country rulers (morag tong) the fact that they keep skeletons in their houses to idolize their ancestors. They make houses and clothes out of insect carapaces and raise jellyfish as cattle. In morrowind common animals such as cow or dogs dont exist at all. These things make you feel out of this world. But skyrim by the other hand is very realistic. not only in the graphics. The war of the imperial vs stormcloaks is similar to the ancient battles between romans and barbarians. Compare that to the war of the half-gods of morrowind, vivec, neverar and dagoth ur fighting to obatin the kagrenac tools. The nordic belief in sovgarde is very similar to that of valhalla real vikings believed in. Its not that morrowind is better or worse, is that most morrowind players believed tamriel was all fantasy like morrowind and were dissapointed to see the game take a realistic setting more similar to age of empires. In fact most of tamriel is similar to our world, only a few provinces have unique cultures like morrowind. If you didnt play morrowind in his time you will not understand this and morrowind will just look weird and childlish. Morrowind and skyrim are good games but theyre way too diferent and thus appeal to a different kind of people.
I think Skyrim needs a fantasy oriented DLC similar to shivering isles in order to appeal the morrowind players.

I enjoyed Morrowind a great deal, and while I thought it was better than Oblivion, I prefer Skyrim.
I know some people will prefer Morrowind, thats their choice.
I know people who prefer Oblivion!
No preference is wrong. It's like asking if someone prefers pie or cake, different people will give different answers (though anyone saying cake is obviously wrong!).

Play Skyrim for Skyrim.
Play Morrowind for Morrowind.
There is enough room for both, they are different games with their own strengths and flaws.

You can fast travel in Morrowind. There are "ships", "siltstriders" and even teleports.
Also there are fast-travel spells, potions, and jewellery: Divine intervention transport you to nearest town, Mark and Recall allows you to return back when you were.

Elitist much?

I'm 28 and played Morrowind when it first came out. It was my favorite game of all time until Skyrim released.

Skyrim is better. It is deeper. It is more complex. It is less tedious. It is more user friendly. And it has better gameplay.

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

That's a good post - I do enjoy alien settings (where you get to interact, not just kill) and Morrowind did have a very good "different" feel to it. We have had two largely human settings since - which is great, I am loving Skyrim to bits and I also liked Oblivion a lot - but I do hope the next game goes somewhere non-human again (somewhere Argonian or Khajit dominated, or to the heart of the Thalmor territories or something).

I played morrowind today, for the first time in a few weeks (skyrim addiction), i havnt played it much, only 30 hours but when i decided to walk to sadrith mora to tal mora, i found how immersive and alone i felt, thats not a bad thing, but the little details scatterd around (marshmerro, huts, dunmer strongholds) made it feel like a huge game, and when i compare it just seems like it has more soul than skyrim. oh and when it comes to skyrims immersion, its all very deep, untill a dragon roars :facepalm: ... i think il being playing morrowind a bit more now.

QFT

Skyrim is a good game. However there is no sense of TRUE adventure in it. We get everything on the plate. LITERALLY!

Like the OP said. There were places in MW, e.g. dungeons, ruins etc. which posed a challange and clearing them gave satisfaction. I remember the first time I've passed through the Ghostgate and entered the Red Mountain area. That place had a soul.

In Skyrim? An example.

You get to travel to some ruins with bunch of mages. Starts nice, immersive and then... One of the mages tells You to find 4-5 magical amulets in a room not bigger then my bedroom. Guess what. They are ALL MARKED BY BIG ******* QUEST MARLERS!

IN YOUR FACE ADVENTURERS!