i agree its ridiculous, they "exploit" the games themselves then complain about it, WoW nerfs stuff real bad cause of complainers too but its a multi player game and skyrim isn't, but nerfing is stupid and bethesda makes games where you get to be a "God" if you want and why some people are so worried how others play i just can't believe it.

why are you worried if someone is wearing deidric armor at level 20?

@OP: It's when you go to the blacksmiths in various towns, buy up all their leather/strips, and powercraft hide bracers to level smithing. Fast travel to town 2, repeat. Do this until you're @ 100. That's abusing smithing. If you're in full dragonscale armor at level 20, you abused it.

I don't see why people complain about it, imo, if Bethesda decides to nerf those skills then what would the use of them, to only make your average healing potion or putting a +5 fire dmg in your weapon? Better remove those skills then.

It's a one player game, so I don't see the problem?

Definitely not a problem. It's just every 2 days you can expect someone who abused crafting to come here and spew how the game is too easy mode now....well duh.

It would be good if people read previous posts.
Wouldn't have to mention some things a hundred times.

If you want to answer to the op though, go ahead and say the same copycat line "it's their choice" without thinking any further.

My missus does it with alchemy - she just makes a gazillion potions to get rich and level up her alchemy. Whilst the game does allow you to do this, it is blatantly abusing the gameplay flaws. All it would take to fix the smithing, alchemy, etc is to just put a limit on how many X items you need to smith, enchant or whatever to level up. So if you made say, 2 iron daggers, then any more you make after that makes no difference to your skill level, because how many iron daggers do you need to prove you can make an iron dagger? It would force you to create more varied items, which would in turn force you to need more varied raw materials, etc.

so what, who cares if someone power levels, how does that affect you? it makes you mad? upset? you feel cheated? get over its a single player bethesda game, not world of warfcraft where everything gets nerfed cause of complainers. if someone decides to power level a skill SO WHAT, i use a little power leveling just to get a skill to a certain point so i don't have to worry about it the entire game, so its a core game mechanic to "power level" some skills, instead of taking the entire game to raise a skill, some skills i want high earlier on, i wouldn't expect the game to change in this area too much, most people enjoy it just how it is. most of us want to be fairly powerful as we level up, but you can choose to stay weak if you want the entire game, its really up to you, how i play has no effect on you or anyone else.

Maxed Smithing, Enchanting and Alchemy will give you very powerful gear, but that doesn't mean its abuse or exploiting. They're purposely designed synergies.

Lol, I don't give a crap, the OP just wanted to know what does it mean to abuse smithing.

ok cool

*shurgs* I leveled my smithing early, but I didn't dagger/leather spam to get there. It leveled quickly because I enjoyed the skill; I'm too ADD to grind skills in any game. And really, my hybrid character would probably suffer badly if I couldn't augment her combat skills with my smithing. Every few levels for a while I would have a more difficult time because the enemies had scaled and I my combat perks were no longer good enough. But I chose to play that way. Granted, I don't use uber potions or enchantments for smithing, but that's my game play choice, not something I would want foisted on me by people whining that they broke their game. I think part of the problem is that MMOs have trained a large portion of the gaming population to power level and always use the best stuff. You almost have to grind and exploit in an MMO, because everyone else does. And if you refuse to play that way, prepare to be UP for a very long time. I'm not saying it's necessary in a single-player game.

TES has had exploitable combos for as long as I can remember. Remember the Fortify INT potion-spams you could do to then make insanely powerful, long-lasting potions? I never chose to do it, but I knew the option was there. Or the ability to run out, buy a couple Summon Golden Saint scrolls, a couple grand soul gems, and effectively print your own money? Or a full set of constant effect Chameleon items? Or hell, constant effect levitation items? There have always been plenty of ways to make your character an unstoppable god. And some people enjoy that. One is simply expected to show self-restraint and quit doing something that ruins the fun in their game. So if people come up here whining that all their gear is OP, sell it and buy/make something that's not as good. It really is that simple.

The problem here is that we're essentially arguing over two sides of the same coin. We have some people saying that using a certain armor/weapon at a certain level is abuse. And we have other people saying that it's no one's business how we play a single player game. Some want the skills rebalanced, some don't. Here's something we can all agree on: people who powerlevel and then come to the forums to b**** about their broken, easy game need to be mercilessly derided. Go after them instead of each other.

Everyone have a good-mojo cookie. They have moon sugar sprinkles (plus some clean ones for the Paladins out there). ^_^

I keep myself from abusing smithing by only using materials I find out in the wilderness.

I'll round down my rant to ONE QUESTION:

What should my battle-axe-wielding PURE warrior (two-handed combat) invest perks and training in, when roleplaying as a NORMALLY INTELLIGENT warrior who wants to become master with the battleaxe, and trains strength to wear heavy armor and wield heavy weapons?

Intelligence is a major factor, and the reason he uses axes.
He employs a fighting style that focuses on putting the heavy weapon in motion, and fights like a dancer; his every move is thought-through and every step has it's purpose.
He aims at fighting as fast with the battleaxe as other people can with their one-handed swords: With grace and great precision, and an axe in constant motion, where he use his balance and weight to steer the axe, effectively adding a part of his armor weight to the injury dealt to enemies. (He WILL use a briastplate that increases two-handed damage).

There is no way to implement the full character, who was a Paladin of Mystra (4) Sorcerer (4) Gold Dragon Diciple (10) using scythes as his primary weapons in D&D.
The character fits perfectly:
His shouts works as the sorcerer-part of his training, and the dragon diciple part fits almost perfectly with the theme of the game.
Sorcerer spells:
1: True Strike (Absurd bonus to hit), Ray of Enfeeblement (str. damage... Sigh...), Identify, Feather Fall (Sigh...)
You get the point... all spells focus on enhancing his combat abilites, movement, speed and most target himself.

Abilities focus:
Strength, constitution, dexterity -- with high base intelligence.

In skyrim, the following skills come naturally:

1: Two-handed, with axe perks
2: Heavy armor
3: What do you suggest?
4: What do you suggest?
5: What do you suggest?

Remember that the character is intelligent. He will use the skill to it's fullest potential.
He does not care about making "the game challenging", but about surviving using the best available equipment.
It is the creators of the game that make the game challenging, not the player.

...
I ask the DM what is available, and the DM sets the limits.

Ingame, the entire game is the DM.

The reason people should have no problem with smithy abusing is simply this: Dragon armour is sweet, and if I wait the entire game to get smithing jacked up to 100, I don't get to use dragon armour for any points in the game that it would benefit me. So I abuse it to enjoy an aspect that otherwise would be pointless at level 40. Nuff said yallll.

Qft. However the way the rules are set, I don't think the DM is doing a particularly good job all the time.
This kind of balance is important to BGS, just look at past games and see how bad it was.
Ex, anyone grind magic spells in DF simply by throwing Destruction spells into the wall and absorbing the magic?
Those times are gone, because they were easy to abuse. The intentions were good but the outcome bad.
I don't care if things can be abused, as long as the rules makes sense and I don't abuse anything without even trying.

For the scaling of effects, I've always been against this whole additive stacking business. The maximum outcome potential should be twice the most significant one, so:
1/1x50% (maximum is now 100%) +
1/2x50% +
1/4x50% +
1/8x50% (etc etc etc) =
--------------
93.75% and you can never reach 100%

Typically though it would look like: 1/1*30% + 1/2*20% + 1/4*17% + 1/8*15% = 46.125% (where the potential max is 60% in this case). Of course the game would have to be scaled around this so that it matches, but this "need to 100" (and even beyond) is damaging the game :/ In all my years in dice games, I have never ever had a maximized skill. Wth happened?