What race is the Nerevarine?

Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:03 am

I too believe the Nerevarene is at least male.

I don't think he's a beast race.

Or orc, but thats almost a beast race.

Probably of Elven Descent (Elven- Altmer/Dunmer/and :D Bosmer(probably not bosmer))

My nerevarene has been many races, many times. But my first character, he was the Nerevarene.

He was a male Dunmer.

But he's off in Akavir now, doing his thing.

I hope he's okay :(

Actually, Orcs as Elven as the Dunmer are. So are the Khajiit.
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Scared humanity
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:49 am

You have to stop to think, the Nerevarine prophecies may not even be true. Just because someone a long time ago said they where, doesn't mean mean they are.

Dagoth Ur was an evil killing machine that didn't care for the Dunmer at all, according to the Tribunal.

The prophecy could very well have been created by Azura and passed on to the emporer in an attempt to get someone easy to manipulate. The prophecies are also kept by Ashlander Wisewomen. Word of mouth isn't exactly the best form of keeping information.


This is funny because I said something very much like this in the post immediately prior to yours.
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Mandi Norton
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:11 pm

Whoever fulfills the seven trials is the Nerevarine. I also think that Vivec's backing makes a pretty big difference when it comes to accepting the Nerevarine as Hortator.

I already said this, but I don't believe that the Nerevarine is Indoril Nerevar reborn. I believe the Nerevarine Prophecy is itself a Xanatos Gambit on Azura's part to take down the Tribunal. It just so happens that Morrowind needs the Nerevarine to kill Dagoth Ur, and the Emperor (and Blades) saw the need to end Dagoth Ur before he could escape the Ghostfence. So your character in Morrowind is the culmination of both the Emperor's and Azura's Xanatos gambits, for related, but somewhat different, reasons.

What I mean is, any character you choose to play is the Nerevarine. I don't think any particular race or gender or birthsign or choice of Great House is better or more valid than any other, and I don't expect Bethesda to present a canonical Nerevarine any more than they'd present a canonical Blades agent, Eternal Champion, or Champion of Cyrodiil.


I think this too. Anyone orphan born on a certain day could potentially become the nereveraine - you just happened to fulfill the first prophecy, the emperor probably had one of his crazy visions, sent you to morrowind and you fulfilled the rest. That explains why there are false incarnates - others have also fulfilled some of the prophecies, but were killed before they could (which, if it was a genuine prophecy, couldn't happen as the nereveraine is supposed to be protected from death).
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R.I.p MOmmy
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 1:05 pm

I love the idea of Nerevarine being a non-Dunmer, and I definitely think a Daedra Prince would as well. The whole concept of switching your ethnicity/class/gender during reincarnation is something I'm very fond of in fantasy settings, it opens up a rich vein of discourse on those subjects. The idea that Nerevarine must be a male Dunmer I find to be really offensive, just as a matter of the essentialism involved in thinking that only certain kinds of people can fill certain kinds of roles - sort of a "Jesus is white" thing. It's a recapitulation of the Dunmeri racism and xenophobia, and I say nuts to it! Let the Dunmer squirm with the forces of change at play, and long live gender-bending, race-mixing différance!

Nerevarine, s/he is a Mudcrab!

I certainly see where your coming from - I happen to be especially fond of the Argonians, above all races, and agree that it would be quite poetic for the Dunmer to be saved by a people they dismiss as being nothing more than pea-brained savages. However, the issue of motivation comes into play on the part of the Hero (Nerevarine), and believability on the part of the native Dunmer.

First, motivation - after being dumped into Morrowind and seeing how the natives treat their slaves (or even the free Argonians, for that matter), it would take an Argonian with saintly levels of empathy to really care about their troubles, or to not believe that the Dunmer deserve whatever disaster is about to befall them.

Secondly, ask any native Dunmer how they feel about the Argonians. You'll find responses varying from mild annoyance at best to homicidal hatred at worst. This includes the Ashlanders, and just about every Dunmer you have to interact with through the course of the MQ (which is alot of Dunmer, let me tell you). Whether Nerevar reincarnates as a pretty Argonian female or not, the Dunmer wouldn't even let her save them. The Ashlanders, realistically, would refuse to even entertain an Argonian's notions of greatness. You wouldn't even be allowed to be tested against the prophecies, and the MQ would be cut to an end, there and then.

That makes sense, right? I don't believe the Nerevarine has to be a Dunmer, but sometimes it becomes difficult to suspend my disbelief. The Dunmer are a hateful people, and wouldn't even give half of the races an opportunity to prove themselves. The only race with worse prospects than an Argonian or Khajiit would be an Imperial. Guh...
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Breautiful
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:22 am

The Nerevarine never went to Akavir, he crashed and the save data was corrupted.
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Mike Plumley
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:29 am

I think the Dunmer will always say the Nerevarine was a Dunmer. It wouldn't surprise me if thier was a statue of him depicted as Dunmer somewhere. It's like the whole Jesus is white thing.
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Isabell Hoffmann
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:15 am

I think it is worth pointing out that all of the failed incarnates were Dunmer.
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Bryanna Vacchiano
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:10 am

I think it is worth pointing out that all of the failed incarnates were Dunmer.

Yeah, I was just thinking the same thing. It might not have any real significance, because yeah, you can have a Dunmer Nerevarine; Morrowind was a Dunmer nation before it was an Imperial province, and one should expect a country's own citizens to know and care about their own history more than most foreigners. Not to mention that it definitely is easier for someone to convince themselves that they are a reincarnation of a legendary hero if they are the same race (technically) as him. The actual Nerevarine was sort of corralled into fufilling the prophecies by the Emperor, and whether even [s]he believes that [s]he is the actual Incarnate, or is simply doing it to get it off his/her back is up to the player.

And Ronin, the motivation on the hero's part, and the believability of the natives on his/her claim, would both be very likely affected by the growing threat of Dagoth Ur and his blight. The Empire placed a quarantine on Vvardenfell; nothing leaves, so the situation becomes resemblant to that of a sinking boat. The hero could simply be doing it to lift the quarantine so [s]he can drop everything and haul ass at the first opportunity, because it's either that or join the ranks of victims of Dagoth Ur's plot to cleanse Morrowind. The natives would be doing it for similar reasons; they are slowly being backed up against a wall, with no other means of escape. If someone walked up to me stating that [s]he was going to put a stop to Dagoth Ur, I'd let them do it, (though I'd probably be on the list of those hoping that the person would die in the process.). Even with the Telvanni, who don't even have windows to poke their heads out of, it's hard to completely ignore a problem. They might be facing in completely the opposite direction, but if they had completely ignored the issue, then why would they even let a Dunmer become the Nerevarine?

So it really isn't entirely impossible, as you said yourself, though I know what you mean by the difficulty in suspending your disbelief. I get the same feeling when I run through Oblivion's main quest. If I was Jauffre, and someone walked up to me holding the Amulet of Kings, my first impression of the guy would be that he was the one who killed the Emperor. Game Over.
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sam westover
 
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Post » Sun Oct 24, 2010 11:20 pm

Can I just say that my favorite Nerevarine scenario would be an Imperial? Think about it...

"Oh, no, we Dunmer hate the Empire - we don't need their meddling to prosper."

*Enter Imperial Nerevarine, the last hope for all of Vvardenfell*

"F***."
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Jon O
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 7:57 am

That Imperial Nerevarine may have been slightly Dunmerized. Thats how I see it atleast, he is now a true champion for Morrowind, not a simple paw for the Septims.

If he is Imperial that is.
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Shelby McDonald
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:28 am

That Imperial Nerevarine may have been slightly Dunmerized. Thats how I see it atleast, he is now a true champion for Morrowind, not a simple paw for the Septims.

Unless s/he is a simple pawn for the Septims. =)
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Markie Mark
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:42 pm

Possible... But in my mind that just doesnt seem to fit really... Its just a no-no...

(Sorry for always using "he" for the Nerevarine, many factors I guess...)
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Jack Bryan
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:28 am

Is it just me or doesn't "Nerevarine" sound quite feminine? Like it's the feminine form of "Nerevar".
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Nana Samboy
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:34 am

I certainly see where your coming from - I happen to be especially fond of the Argonians, above all races, and agree that it would be quite poetic for the Dunmer to be saved by a people they dismiss as being nothing more than pea-brained savages. However, the issue of motivation comes into play on the part of the Hero (Nerevarine), and believability on the part of the native Dunmer.

First, motivation - after being dumped into Morrowind and seeing how the natives treat their slaves (or even the free Argonians, for that matter), it would take an Argonian with saintly levels of empathy to really care about their troubles, or to not believe that the Dunmer deserve whatever disaster is about to befall them.

Secondly, ask any native Dunmer how they feel about the Argonians. You'll find responses varying from mild annoyance at best to homicidal hatred at worst. This includes the Ashlanders, and just about every Dunmer you have to interact with through the course of the MQ (which is alot of Dunmer, let me tell you). Whether Nerevar reincarnates as a pretty Argonian female or not, the Dunmer wouldn't even let her save them. The Ashlanders, realistically, would refuse to even entertain an Argonian's notions of greatness. You wouldn't even be allowed to be tested against the prophecies, and the MQ would be cut to an end, there and then.

That makes sense, right? I don't believe the Nerevarine has to be a Dunmer, but sometimes it becomes difficult to suspend my disbelief. The Dunmer are a hateful people, and wouldn't even give half of the races an opportunity to prove themselves. The only race with worse prospects than an Argonian or Khajiit would be an Imperial. Guh...


What better motivation than survival? The blight wasn't going to be confined to just morrowind, you know. Ur would have spread everywhere. (Plus along the course, you get to remove the source of power for the Dunmer figureheads. The tribunal. Added bonus!) You were initially working for the empire anyways.

As for the second point. Despite their hatred, the Dunmer were becoming desperate. Dreamers were appearing in nearly every city, and blight was making it through the ghostfence. People were wondering how long it would hold up. Rumors of sixth house bases popping up were starting to become prevalent. The wise women of the Ashlanders knew what was coming too. They were out of time, and they knew that the prophecy didn't state Dunmer. So if someone shows up fulfilling some of them, you give them the chance because you don't have a choice. (And really, Azura may have influenced some of them to keep watch for something unexpected)
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stephanie eastwood
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:10 am

Depends on who retells the story.

I prefer Dunmer. Makes some poetic sense.
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Daniel Brown
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:43 am

Is it just me or doesn't "Nerevarine" sound quite feminine? Like it's the feminine form of "Nerevar".

The Shezarrines haven't been female, and the -ine part doesn't denote femininity, but roughly, I think at least, "of (something)." So, Nerevarine is "Of Nerevar" or the Shezarrine is "Of Shezarr"
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Soku Nyorah
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 11:01 am

Depends on who retells the story.

I prefer Dunmer. Makes some poetic sense.

That depends on the poet.

http://www.nonsolobiografie.it/personaggi/primopiano_john_donne.jpg
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jesse villaneda
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:54 am

The Shezarrines haven't been female, and the -ine part doesn't denote femininity, but roughly, I think at least, "of (something)." So, Nerevarine is "Of Nerevar" or the Shezarrine is "Of Shezarr"

Well of course. I am no grammar wizard, but -ine does sound quite feminine to me. Then again "Nerevarine" would be a silly name, but Morrowind is full of silly names. Nerevarine is more of title than a name though which make my statement that Nerevarine is the feminine form for Nerevar kinda "wrong".

Anyway the who the Nerevarine is up to who ever retells the story (the player).
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kirsty williams
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:16 am

That depends on the poet.

http://www.nonsolobiografie.it/personaggi/primopiano_john_donne.jpg


Pheh, touche.
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teeny
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:06 pm

Well, we'll never know, I guess, and I hope it stays that way. The Nerevarine's race was what you picked. I'd assume Dunmer would be the most probable, looking at all the other incarnates, but then again, they weren't outlanders, were they?
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Steven Nicholson
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:58 pm

Well, we'll never know, I guess, and I hope it stays that way. The Nerevarine's race was what you picked. I'd assume Dunmer would be the most probable, looking at all the other incarnates, but then again, they weren't outlanders, were they?

None of the failures were outlanders.
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Nany Smith
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:21 am

Thanks for clearing that up. I thought at-least one of them was. Hmmm.
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Chloe Yarnall
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:43 am

Hmm, I don't see the point of vehemently rejecting an Argonian Nerevarine. Obviously, you can play as an Argonian, become Nerevarine and Hortator, defeat Dagoth Ur, and destroy the Heart. I've always felt empirical evidence trumps theory.
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Euan
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:03 am

Hmm, I don't see the point of vehemently rejecting an Argonian Nerevarine. Obviously, you can play as an Argonian, become Nerevarine and Hortator, defeat Dagoth Ur, and destroy the Heart. I've always felt empirical evidence trumps theory.

Indeed, which is why the Nerevarine was a Nord, seeking to reclaim Shor's heart for the homeland.

http://www.friedpost.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/pigs.jpg
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Lewis Morel
 
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Post » Mon Oct 25, 2010 3:58 am

Indeed, which is why the Nerevarine was a Nord, seeking to reclaim Shor's heart for the homeland.

http://www.friedpost.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/pigs.jpg


I can see how Vivec tricked him...

"Hit the heart with keening once and then sunder like lots of times, then the heart is yours."

"I′ll do it! YARGH!"
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Bek Rideout
 
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