For me it was very disappointing that Kvatch wasn′t rebuilt after the gate was shut down. Other than that, no real letdowns for me.

Morthal, it really should not have its own hold.

Vivec, hard to argue with Shades excellent anolysis.. and it just svcks to navigate, and each canton is pretty much the same.

And generally the non walled settlements in Oblivion are a real let down. Theres nothing to do but speak to NPC's about rumours. No taverns, no traders. You sort of have to fill in the blanks yourself.

I concur. For the center of the Empire it was my second least favorite city to visit in OB due to its lack of life and its dumb (ie. lazy) layout.

Oblivion - bravil or imperial city
Skyrim - Morthal

Although, I really have to say Ebonheart as well. It's supposed to be the center of Imperial power on Vvardenfell and the main port for the island, but it makes the towns of Skyrim look like bustling metropoli by comparison.


Keep the walled-in wheel design, rearrange the districts so the market district is between the waterfront and the main bridge. Create some market stalls to sell fresh produce, line the sidewalks with them. Leave some relatively intact Ayleid structures in the Elven Gardens along with some more fantastic flora (here would be an ideal location for the giant mushrooms everyone refuses to shut up about). Tear down the statue of Akatosh in Talos Plaza and build a new one in honor of the location's title deity. Put a small shrine or statue to each of the Nine in the temple district, along with some doomsday preachers on the street yelling about the end of times. The slum district behind the Waterfront should be at least as big as the sum total of the rich areas combined (Talos Plaza and Elven Gardens), and really should be even bigger than that. And finally: release a DLC wherein the Elder Council comes out of the protective custody of the Legion from the now-unlocked 3rd floor of the palace after the immediate threat to the Empire has passed.

I liked all citys in Oblivion.

You know I originally designed this topic to discuss "small towns", but it didn't turn out that way (probably because I'm one of the few people who really care about those at all) and I think this discussion is better.

I do too so you′re not alone I would really like Blankenmarsch to be more than it is too. It feels like it has potential but it falls short to uninteresting NPCs and the presumed deleted quest.

For city Imperial City is a city design that can be vastly improved just like Baldur's Gate series where their cities are huge. Vivec city in Morrowind comes in a close second for its hard to navigate cantons and sewers. (Mournhold comes to mind)

For town, no dissapointment for me at the moment, probably I just treat them as inns and villages instead of towns, just a place for me to stock up, rest, train and quest. I think the ES series wins in terms of its landscapes surroundings where we can truely explore and climb the mountain we just saw over there and jump into the sea instead of other games where it is just scenery. However other games wins in terms of cities and towns, this is the difference I feel. Different value proposition.

Ohhh. Well none of the small villages are really appealing. I suppose the towns ringing the Imperial City Isle were all rather small and boring and could have been better.

It was really the fact that besides the models there is literally nothing to the place. No quests starting there or even leading you there, nothing but rumours from NPCs, no sort of story, no mention of the town anywhere, nothing. On the other hand I love the Leyawiin lower class buildings.

The most disappointing thing about the small towns is you can't generally buy a house from them. I would've loved to live in Dawnstar in an actual house.

Khajiit was not amused with Helgen. A town with dragons and soon bandits. J'rahzir will avoid this place.

I suppose the Imperial City isn't too impressive, though I do like quite a few of the shops, inns, and places within.

That said, nothing beats a good roadside tavern. Much cozier.

That isn't why I talked about the Imperial City. I brought up the Imperial City because I didn't realize that when you used the word "town" you literally wanted to discuss small towns. I hate to say this about people here, but most posters on these forums use words so inaccurately that, over the years, I've kind of abandoned any attempt to read posts literally. I just assumed you meant any kind of settlement where people live. My apologies.

So if we're talking about smaller towns, I'd say my biggest disappointment was Weye. It seeems to me that, being so close to the Imperial City, it ought to be larger, more bustling. It's kind of the gateway town to the Imperial City and should be raking in some serious coin from travelers stopping there to clean up and refresh themselves before they enter The Big City. For me, Weye was a missed opportunity and a serious disappointment.

VIvec has to be the top of my list. It is just such a pain to get anywhere in that place, that it makes me avoid it whenever I can.

Well, the small towns are usually fine to me, because they're supposed to be small and are. Yay. It's when you get to the bigger places that thus tend to fail to live up to their potential that bother me.

Than you will absolutly hate the city in Summoner.

The game Summoner?

Vivec reminds me of first getting to the Citadel in Mass Effect - so confusing for a new player. I had no idea where to go.

I totally agree about Vivec, it's like it was designed to take the most amount of time possible to get between sections, and gives no unique indicators to help you remember which of the identical and randomly placed bridges and ramps would lead you up to the canton entrance you wanted.

Didn′t think about Vivec but I absolutely agree with this. Way too confusing and disorienting for my tastes.

My (apparently lesser than most) problem with Vivec isn't necessarily confusion as to where things are and how to get around, but that when you're outside the place almost seems dead - I could see an entire city retreating inside if they were getting hit with the brunt of the ash storms, but they're about as far away from that as you can get on Vvardenfell. If the streets were lined with markets and people moving around and other things that they were apparently originally intending judging from the concept art, it would be almost perfect... I guess that's what the limitations of now decade-old technology required, though.

It's funny, but I see Vivec's design as perfect for what the city is supposed to be. The city is an "artificial capital" created purely because it's the home of the man-god it's named after. It's separated into cantons because the three local Great Houses can barely stand each other. As for the "inconvenience" of the layout, anybody with wealth or power has access to Levitation, and can simply fly to wherever they need to go, and those who are mere "pilgrims" should be inconvenienced.

I agree that the population is too sparse. That's true of all the later TES games. The cities in Arena are more "alive."

Have never played it but somehow I don′t think I would agree. I′m so accustomed to the ramblings of the Oblivion NPCs.
As for the Imperial City feeling empty, I just like to think people are at home or just Elsweyr

The thing I dislike the most about Vivec is the drab, utilitarian, urban-planning-esque, architectural design of the place. I just don't like the look and feel of Vivec. It kind of gives me the creeps, actually, a little bit. I keep picturing Winston Smith hiding from Ordinators down in the sewers. It's just too oppressively homogenous for my taste.