It's not that doesn't have lore; it didn't have as much as Morrowind. And that is most jarring part of Oblivion to me, as it seemed unthinkable that Bethesda would even come up short in that aspect, after Morrowind.

It's the various enemy factions, I feel, that are most glaring: There's very little backstory on the Mythic Dawn and the Necromancers' Cult. The Sixth House in Morrowind were far more fleshed out in terms of history. As a result, the Mythic Dawn/Necromancers seemed like a generic evil cult that are just put there as designated villains with clich?d cult members.

Nothing you can't fix with over 200 mods.

I played Daggerfall before I started MW this year. I was sorely dissapointed. Either way all of MW's "unique" environments were all the same thing with different colors. Maybe throw in a couple trees or a muck lake.

My main gripe with Oblivion was the level scaling, it was arguably the worst feature to ever be put into a TES game. Travel could have also been handled better, I would have preferred to have a system of guild teleports, horse carriages and ship transportation.

Thankfully there are mods to fix these issues.




Oblivion did have some pretty neat dungeons, and some of them took well over an hour to fully explore. Morrowind had some pretty small dungeons in comparison.

i might have gotn a few of my facts wrong, i dont know the exact history, your most likely right so i am sorry, but i mean to say that i think more people revere mario because it is older. yes maybe you might revere it because its fun. while it is fun, i think it gets most of its respect from age. Personally, while mario is fun, id rather play oblivion, or fallout 3. and i know people that have never even touched mario and they still see it as a great game. Or take galaga for instance, that has a fare amount of respect (at least where i live) just for it simply being an old classic.

Every game has its flaws, which I think the majority of MW and DF fan boys forget. For instance Daggerfall has quite a bit of flaws, It recycles quite a bit from Arena, and is mostly randomly generated, which means a lot of places in DF are really generic and uninteresting. In Daggerfall Most of the NPCs are generic and really don't have a personality. Not to mention the game breaking bugs that DF was famous for. Morrowind is no different, Dungeons were unintresting, NPCs as a majority seemed unintresting, NPCs seemed like talking encyclopedias that didn't sleep or have lives of their own. The ashland landscape became boring and uninteresting really fast. The combat system was very flawed, you could stab someone in the face visually and Morrowind would say you missed. The point is Morrowind and Daggerfall have as many problems, if not more so, as Oblivion. Does this make them bad games? That's up to the player to decide. Everyone has a different opinion. The problem is that people are going around and claiming their opinion is fact. You shouldn't go about bashing Oblivion, because Oblivion is in all aspects as good as Morrowind and Daggerfall.

In my Personal opinion Oblivion=Daggerfall=Morrowind they're all equal, but there not as good as Arena

Lore is ok to some point.
But a lot of people seem to look at the Lore, as the words of the prophet carved in stone, and every diversion from it, as heresy.
If Lore prevents the game of evolving, or inventing new stuff, than we still would play daggerfall with just better graphics.
Whoever makes the lore in the first place (in this case the developers of the Elder scrolls) can change it all they like.
Oblivion is fine, L2P ^^( always wanted to say that)

i get angry at assumptions that people hates OB when really in some aspects morrowind is worse.i haven't been playing MW for long but i prefer that even though i played OB first and even though i prefer morrowind i still love OB. there is nothing really wrong with OB i just think morrowind is a better game

This is pretty much my long standing gripe with Oblivion. When I enter dungeons in Oblivion, I don't get that creepy uncertain feeling. In Morrowind, I am scared to death to enter one ;p.

Yes! In Morrowind you will even unconsciously align with a faction. Every faction has certain (pre)dispositions toward other factions. Either fast-talking or back-stabbing is how you get through. Consider that you are an outlaw through half of the Main Quest. Or that joining one Great House can have you aligned against other members of that same house (Hlaalu Hello!) The ins and outs in Mournhold can be Byzantine.
I am only playing OB for the second time but it seems like my char started as a hero early in the MQ and it's straight to the top from there. The Emperor who was a sinister off stage presence in MW is now a benevolent avuncular char who sets your char inevitably on the right path. In contrast, in MW Caius Cosades and Azura offer choices that you are free to accept or reject as you choose.
I've read many threads in the Morrowind forums where a player is hopelessly screwed and all the respondents could do was commiserate.I feel that the ending of Oblivion is like predestination. You can't end the game until it turns out right. Unlike Morrowind ,failure is not an option in Oblivion.

There the [censored]?
Coming from the person calling Morrowind the best game ever, re-read your comments before you sumbit them next time.
Oh and my opinion (coming from 200 hours+ of Fallout Oblivion and Morrowind) is that they are all equally good games, but all different.
Oblivion had good replay value and a good storyline (even if it somewhat lacked depth at times).
Morrowind had an amazing storyline and good immersion.
Fallout had amazing immersion and the longest single play time without replay, for me of course.

wasnt he being sarcastic? :mellow:

yes, i thinks so
and again, there's nothing necessarily 'wrong' w/ OB...it could have been better, but it is definitely replayable many times...it might not engender the same type of loyalty that MW did...BUT lot's of ppl obviously still play :shrug:

I think the level scaling was put in to make the game more playable. There is a huge area with several dozens of dungeons, the level scaling ensures that the player can enter them as he finds them, with a reasonable change of survival, instead of having to come back at higher levels. They would work as "static" if there wasn't so many of them. That is impression i got after playing with a mod that "fixes" it.

It svcks that there is nothing truly unique loot-wise in most dungeons, but the system was much better realized in Fallout 3, so maybe they get it perfect for TES V. Or they overcompensate due to whining about Fallout 3, and make it even worse <_<

I think there's good and bad things about both games. I think the main thing Morrowind has over Oblivion was the amount of detail.

100s of books - reveals the world you are in, important NPCs, etc.
Lots of unique items - many you can just come across in dungeons, someone's house, or in the environment somewhere.
More factions - each have a different agenda and directly conflicting quests. The assassin's guild would not be friends with someone who's also in the fighter's guild.
Text dialog - without the limits of fully voiced NPCs, they could add as much detail to conversations as they wanted to.

All that detail makes Morrowind a much deeper game. It's not as easy to pick up and play, but when you have some time available it is more rewarding. It's a game where the more time you put into, the better it gets. In Oblivion by the time you finish the main quest, you pretty much know everything about the game. You probably haven't finished all the quests, but you definitely know what to expect in the game.

Another thing is that in Morrowind you revolve around the world. In Oblivion, the world revolves around you. I mean both games are pretty static when the player isn't doing anything, but the quests in Morrowind are worded to give you the feeling that someone else will do these quests if you don't. In Oblivion it seems like you are the only one that can make a difference. It just starts to feel too fake after a while.

There were only two things that bummed me out about oblivion having come from morrowind.


1. No flight spells =(

2. No Recall spells =(


Otherwise... Oblivion looks so much better, however, less detailed. It's a catch 22 but I certainly won't be playing Morrowind anymore.

One thing about the whole level scaling, is that admittedly, it had a lot of flaws, but at least it made the game a little more challenging at higher levels. In Morrowind, when you got to a certain point, your character was god. In Oblivion, when you make a sneak character, you still havea reason to sneak at level 35 (sort of), in Morrowind, at level 35, there was no need to sneak up on anyone, anywhere, anytime. Like I said, it wasn't done perfectly, but it at least made the game a little bit challenging over the course of a characters lifespan.

I guess that I should start by saying that my favorite game in the series is Daggerfall, but I do like Oblivion. My complaints about Oblivion:

1) This is a biggie, but the Main Quest is kind of lame. The setup is actually pretty good, but the payoff is weak. Can't say more without spoilage.

2) Atlthough it allows the player more freedom of action than many games, compared to Daggerfall it is extremely linear, and limited.

3) Somewhat related to #2, the gameworld feels claustrophobic.

4) Don't like the leveling system.

5) Some of the lore contradicts the lore established in previous games. (Note that I don't agree with those that say Oblivion doesn't add any lore. It adds tons of lore--and most of it doesn't contradict what had already been established. But some of it does. But it's not a major complaint in and of itself--it doesn't lessen the enjoyment of playing the game, just makes it feel like it's not a TES game.)

6) I don't see this complaint much, but I don't care for the fact that anyone can join any faction. I liked that in Daggerfall you had to have the right skills to join a particular guild.

Oblivion compared to Morrowind is bland, dull, and lacking.

Oblivion compared to most of today's RPG's... Amazing, non-linear, creative.

Morrowind in my opinion is the far better game but Oblivion is a good game.

This
I hated that oblivion really didn't have that much variety within the different areas.
That and the enemies using shields liked to turtle way to much which meant unless you had some good spells the fights were gonna go on for a while.
Plus, being a genius at spells without actually trying was extremely boring.

unless you are on the xbox.

i don't dislike the game but i would like a evil main quest

I would like a main quest that does not use absolute notions of good or evil, instead relying on moral ambiguity and an all-involved-sides-are-correct-in-their-own-eyes mentality.

I love both games equally and will have fond memories of both.
Admittedly i now find it hard to go back to Morrowind due to the superior combat mechanics that Oblivion has.

This seems to happen to alot of past greats. Resident evil 1 is almost unplayable these days........

I could easily write a few thousand words detailing only a portion of the things that are wrong with Oblivion (and have done so on a couple of occasions), but here's just the short outline:

Overly-insistent main quest
Tedious and uninteresting main quest
Unsatisfying conclusion to main quest
Shabby award for completing main quest
Random rat-maze dungeons
Paltry loot in aforementioned random rat-maze dungeons
Bland and uninteresting NPCs who all say the same tedious things in the same few voices
Rigidly linear quests
Too little quest information given in-game
Too much quest information given via journal
Too little direction information given in-game
Too much direction information given via map markers
Poorly implemented distant objects
Creatures pacing back and forth on the roads
Nothing in the wilderness except flowers and butterflies
Poorly designed and implemented enchantment system
Poorly designed and implemented leveling system
Too few factions and guilds
Too easy to join and advance in factions and guilds
Too little conflict between factions and guilds
Too little variety in armor and weapons
Rigid, simplistic progression through armor and weapons


..... just off the top of my head.....

I think this is a case of nostalgia overpowering the reality of things. Saying that Morrowind is perfect and some sort of benchmark game is just off the mark. It's a classic, and it was awesome during its day, but it has a list of flaws that is pretty ugly too. Oblivion is just an attempt to address those issues that doesn't work out really well either. Just like how Morrowind was an attempt to address various issues with Daggerfall and Arena. The whole series is a disaster zone of bad design calls but still each release has some good qualities too.

And I'm kinda sick of hearing about how Oblivion is too linear. Plz do let me know which games write the story entirely around your actions. They don't exist. And no I'm not interested in hearing arguments based on those few games that throw in disjointed "decision" moments where you can jump onto another totally linear path based on whether you shoot one guy or say yes or no at some point. Storytelling is linear. The TES games are the most non-linear games out there if you just ignore the story and do your own thing (as pointless as that may be).