That would be probably the most brilliant idea you've had in your entire life.

A fellow Daggerfall fan who likes both of its successors, as well, I assume? We are too few these days.

You assume correctly. And I agree.

I am actually happy that they do try to change it up a bit with each iteration. It keeps the gaming experience fresh.

That is why I fear that Fallout: New Vegas may not be as stellar as I was hoping it to be.

A lot of the latest previews are saying it's pretty much the same thing as Fallout 3 but with different content.
Not a bad thing. Just upsetting that they couldn't have spent more time to improve/add new things.

But that is not Bethesda Game Studios so it is irrelevant!

Useless statement is useless!

I agree with the change part. As for New Vegas, well, it's just a spin-off. We get it quicker for the similarity, but Bethesda will likely change things with Fallout 4. I think New Vegas will be different from Fallout 3, anyway, just because of the different developers, even if it doesn't look different.

Actually there is much less to do in oblivion then Morrowind, there are only five factions in oblivion compared to ten factions in morrowind (including the great houses), there are fewer quests, fewer weapons, armors, skills and even with the increased map size, there were fewer towns.
If you seriously think there is more to do in oblivion then morrowind then i really have to question how much of morrowind you have actually played.

People dont dislike oblivion for being different to morrowind they dislike it because it has less content then morrowind does. Oblivion removed much more then it changed.

And i picked Morrowind, for many reasons, one of them being the sheer volume of content.

If people dislike Oblivion for fewer content, shoudn't they prefer Daggerfall to Morrowind?

I think that's a pretty weak argument, especially since quality is usually preferred over quantity. I actually think the dislike for Oblivion because of it's difference is more of the case sometimes.

Morrowind. Funny, considering I started with Oblivion. For the first few days, I had to force myself to play Morrowind. But once you can finally kill something and start to discover some of the secrets of the factions, you're hooked. To the guy who said Oblivion has more content than Morrowind, enlighten me please. Oblivion is far smaller than its predeccesor.

Less factions (if you count the arena as a faction, it's got half as many). Less skills. More map space for sure, but as the poster above said, less cities. Vivec is bigger than the Imperial City. In Morrowind, you could take on a political role, like you should've been able to in Oblivion, if not moreso.

Some people do.
Also the while there was a huge amount of content in daggerfall most of it was randomly generated, like someone already said, if you've seen one daggerfall dungeon you've seen them all. Even though there was a seemingly endless world to walk through you would never come accross anything really unique.



But it isnt that much different, the combat system is changed, thats about all i can think of thats different besides the fact that it has removed weapons, armor, skills etc.
What was so revolutionarily different that it has made many elder scroll fans dislike it?

And the quality over quantity argument would only apply if oblivions quests were of a higher quality then morrowind, which they weren't. But there were less of them.

I'm aware.


I'm just saying it would be a more likely culprit, though I don't think it's usually the case.


To me Oblivions quests seemed to be more fleshed out, with more emphesis on creating "mini" stories, rather than more arbitrary quests (not implying that all Morrowind quests were like that). But that might just be me :shrug:

I agree with the quest part. I feel as if each Elder Scrolls game has had more interesting quests than its predecessor. :shrug:

If more interesting is hold your hand and way too cliche quests is better, than I completely I agree.

What an obnoxious comment...

Ayway, not everyone likes Oblivion, and I'm one of them. Oblivion lost so much potential content.

And about "fleshed out" stories... Huge quests where I'm saving the world from a big evil threat, after joining the guild last week is not fleshed out. Daggerfall had it great with the fact that I was just a lowly member, killing rats in people's homes for quite some time. I think at the begining, I should be just some random member of the guild, with nothing important to do. I shouldn't start getting my important quests until I'm fairly high up in the guild (which should take far more than an in-game week).

I don't think any game got guild questlines right, but I feel Morrowind was the closest to it. While it was too fast (though, not as fast as Oblivion), I really felt like a part of a guild. I would do lowly errands for the guild, such as collect mushrooms, kill rats, kill poachers, for quite some time, and not start with the real important quests until I was nearer to the end.

Also, the need to actually be good at magic to join the mages guild really helped me feel like a mage. Level requirements NEED to return.

Well said. When I first started Oblivion, I distinctly remember being in awe. The starter dungeon was pretty darn entertaining, with it's traps, layout, etc... when you leave the sewer and emerge into the wide world it's a great moment in video games (I saw this for the first time in a light controlled room on a 92" HD screen, so you can imagine I wet my pants)

As the game continued, however, I started to note how meaningless the dungeon crawls were as the challenge never varied. You couldn't go anywhere to find different monsters or challenge levels because it was all tied to your current level. The innovation of the starter sewer was forgotten. Other than a few of the very well made Grey Fox quests, traps and tricks are basically forgotten. Obviously they ran out of time and couldn't design the vast majority of the dungeons properly. The first time I noticed the painfully obvious level-scaling with roadside bandits wearing elven armor I had it.

Oblivion had less variety in armor, weapons, etc... It's AI was effectively no different than having scripted schedules since the player could rarely if ever detect the NPC's acting in a particularly logical or intelligent way. I mean, if you go into a bar and a guy is drinking from a mug that isn't there, how great is the AI. Games from 20 years ago had convincing NPC schedules, day/night cycles, and even weather patterns.

Oblivion wasn't a terrible game, it was just not as complete as it could have been. I have high hopes for the next ES game because the majority of Elder Scrolls fans prefer a game a bit more deep than Oblivion. I have never seen a poll that didn't have Morrowind #1.

Double post, sorry.

Mine would be Morrowind but that is largely due to it being the first game in the series I played.

Oblivion. If it wasn't from Oblivion, i wouldn't even know TES.

If you think the majority of Elder Scrolls fans are the people voting on these forums your sorely mistaken.


Maybe fleshed out wasn't the right word for it. I just meant it seemed like they spent more time focusing on each individual quest, rather than having more mundane quests.

Quests are not the only thing to do in games. There are many dungeons, caves, and tombs in Oblivion that have no quest associated with them that you can go and explore.

Do NOT act like YOUR opinion about something is FACT. IT IS NOT. Just because you liked Morrowind's quests more than Oblivion's does not mean that they were of a higher quality.

They did not only change the combat system in Oblivion either (even though that was a much needed change from the clunky, less entertaining combat of Morrowind that most people criticized).
They also added voice acting for ever character, improved the graphics, made a much larger and better soundtrack, and immensely improved the inventory.

The entire way you go about doing quests in Morrowind is so much more of a hassle than in Oblivion also. In Oblivion they made it much easy to get right into the fun stuff and got rid of all the walking back and forth that needed to be done in Morrowind.

Agreed

You do start as a lowly member of each guild in Oblivion. Did you even play the game?

The main reason you seem to rank up faster in each guild in Oblivion is because you can actually quick travel in the game and don't have to find and then walk to a silt strider every time you want to travel somewhere.

And how did Oblivion lose so much potential content?
It has 200 hours of gameplay, every character actually has a voice, its graphics are much better than Morrowind's, there are more songs in the soundtrack (and they're better), the sound effects in the game are much better, the combat system is much better, the inventory system is much better, the world map is much better, the way you go about doing quests is much better, and the game world is larger.

Please explain, because I'm dying to hear.

There are more in morrowind, so im not sure what your point is.
How far did you actually get in morrowind?



I never said morrowinds quests were better, i said oblivions were not of a higher quality, meaning they were not better then morrowinds, which in no way implies morrowinds were better. But i suppose that is just my opinion, much like how this:



Is all your opinion about what you think was improved, i disagree with every one of your points.
The voice acting was horrendus, combat became almost totally player orientated making oblivion feel overall more of an action game, fast travel completely ruined immersion, the inventory was a hassle having to select a catagory and the soundtrack was new but not better, but these are all just my opinions so meh..

But the comment reguarding fewer factions, quests, weapons, armors, towns etc in oblivion is not opinion, it is fact.

This is exactly what I call quantity over quality, because although it might seem some of Oblivion's quests were more detailed and longer than average Morrowind quests, they lacked the intrigue, under current, rivalry, and gray morality that was interwoven in the Morrowind's quests. Except for example the dark brotherhood quest-line and some misc quests, I know.

The reason that a lot of people like Morrowind over it's predecessor and successor is that it was different, from any other experience that we had in any other game, it was dreamy, intriguing, hard to start, but utterly more satisfying to conquer. It was a surreal life never experienced before or after, not as generic as Daggerfall's randomly generated environment and encounters, and not as bland as Oblivion's repeating landscape and encounters.

Not as overwhelming and hard as Daggerfall's world and game-play, not as underwhelming as oblivion's environment and the deeply rooted hand-holding in every aspect of the game design, and cut down quest meats because there was not enough resources and man power to make a lot of voiced dialogs, so that made the core of the game-play a shallower experience.

Just a perfect middle point for any of those aspects, except that for some people it was hard to get into, as they were not prepared to the game mechanics, and did not know the tricks of the trade in such an open ended game with so much pitfalls.

I do not say that in every aspect it was a better game than the others, but I say it had a better overall experience from the combination of those aspects, and had less compromised elements.

I'm guessing you have't been in TES General for long

But, (and I'm not going to count Daggerfall here, it's not really fair):

Morrowind had tonnes more quests than Oblivion
.... dialogue than Oblivion
.... guilds than Oblivion
.... items than Oblivion
.... hidden secrets than Oblivion

Hamsmaago is the best for this. He knows exact numbers and stuff. The point is, Oblivion really lacked a lot of potential content because of the space taken up by, I believe, voice files. I mean, Cyrodiil was the BEST place for corruption, greed, poverty and political quests. We're probably not going to see Cyrodiil again for years, and I'm so disappointed in Bethesda for not taking the opportunity to do such an awesome political quest in the Imperial homeland.

Oh, and 200 hours of gameplay? That's hardly anything for an open sandbox world RPG. I'd expect that from a sandbox action game, like Grand Theft Auto.

:facepalm:

Don't waste your time Hircine. :wacko: