so is it becoming a trend for rpg's to hide or eliminate status bars almost completely? I think that is stupid needless to say, I hate dying randomly without know how close I am to death, or fail a spell because I unknowingly ran out of mana. so why is it a few games are tossing out the hud. is it because fo casual gamers and or gamers who just want a streamline beat the game and get the achievements experience. because It certainly can't be targeted at gamers like me how really can't stand not having a hud.

I agree 100%, I don't see anything wrong with Health Bars. It's a video game not real life.

yeah man [censored] casual gamers everything's their fault [censored] them alll

Some games can do the HUDless thing badly, but for the most part I like it. It's more immersive imo.

thats not what I meant to say, just that indepth (or any rpg really) should not try to make health unimportant and or try and make the game seem like there is no health just to attract or benefit a group of gamers that are just playing the game to beat it and or just to pass a little time. there are plenty of games that casual gamers can enjoy that aren't status oriented but generally thats not in the rpg genre. maybe some one needs to make a casual rpg that fits all of the things that those kind of gamers want in a game and they can go play that instead of watering down long established franchises.

@uberbanana I think its gamebreaking because you never know when you are going to die, I don't like immersion that gets in the way of playing the game smartly, i find it to be unimersing.

I much rather have health bars than red jelly splashed on the screen whenever I get hit. I like being able to see exactly how much health I have left quickly, not counting how many liters of jam they just threw at my face.

That's why I said badly. In real life, you don't know how much a punch, gunshot, stab wound, ect is going to affect you. Its not like "Okay, so I'm a black belt...that means I can get punched in the head exactly 59 times before I'll black out and die". Some games might do it stupid where it's just "hm, my screen is slightly red, what does that me-wtf I'm dead?", but overall it isn't a bad thing. Especially since most games do the whole automatic regenerating health thing, it isn't that big of a deal. It's more about figuring out how much damage your character can take in one encounter rather than baby sitting your health bar.

i'm a casual gamer and enjoy playing rpgs

so? rpg's aren't real life. if there is magic in the game all valitdity to realism holding a grip on the mechanics of a game go out the window. its stupid imo to not know how much damage you can with stand because other wise you just drop dead randomly. and that makes me rage quit.

EDIT: in most rpgs the amount of damage you can take is always changing so it would do no good to memorize it and I would not say its ever necessary to baby sit your health bar, you just need to refill it once combat is over. but it needs to stay up after combat because you might not be able to refill it and then if it hides it self then you are screwed if you get ambushed... so that last was about SK but this thread is about other recent games too.

I honestly like the HUDless look. It's clean, smooth. It lets me focus of the game itself, not a bunch of meters down in a corner. That's also not to say I'm against health/magic/whatever bars either. I'm perfectly fine with them. But at the very least, keep them minimalistic. There's nothing worse than some guy down in the art department who wanted his HUD to dominate the game.

I don't mind it when games take out health bars, they still give you some notification as to how much damage you have taken and what you can still take.

I never said you couldn't. I just think it is wrong for casual gamers to come into a series and start making complaints about how the game works so that the devs have to change it to meet their standard and the game gets watered down. I am not saying your one of those kind of casual gamers but there are a lot of them. I don't go into casual games and demand the make them more indepth. I play them aware that I am not going to be able to get into them as much as the rpg's I like, I don't start complaining that the game needs to be changed to suite my gaming style.

@septiego I haven't played any good rpg's that have status bars that dominate the screen. most that I play just have them in the corner that I can pay attention to once it starts to get low. but not having one at all is bad, even if they have some kind of non meter indication. it went really wrong in RDR and I would not like to see that carried over to any thing else unless there was an option to change it.

This is exactly what you're doing

Actually I haven't seen any casual gamers making these kinds of complaints. The kind of people who can't wrap their heads around health bars are the kind of people who can't wrap their heads around internet forums.

What this thread is is a thinly veiled rant against the perceived dumbing down of videogames across the board, oblivious to the fact that this trend has been going on for a long time and will continue for a long time. As long as there is money to be made by appealing to more casual gamers then that will be the trend. Personally I would devote your efforts to decrying removal of the arguably more important aspects of videogames: deep and meaningful stories, awesome and challenging fights or mind bending puzzles. Not health bars.

I know you are talking about rpg's here, but in other genres I hate the "jam" filling the edges of the screen and obstructing your view, more than a health bar would have.

I personally prefer a small and subtle health bar. Was never a big fan of clogged and over crowded HUDs. I don't mind the lack of one either though.

no I am not. I am complaining about the indepth games getting watered down. what I said was I don't go to casual games and complain that they are to casual, like when some casual gamers come to the indepth rpg's and say that they are too complicated.



then I will mourn the death of quality rpgs. I have seen more than several people complaining in the OB forums since the game came out that it was not like "X" game and that OB svcked because of it wasn't like that game. they were a dime a dozen. and just porting more features into a rpg to make it seem less like an rpg to draw in more buyers does not = to making the game better. I am all for drawing in more gamers, but not trading one group for a much larger group.

@xxcrashdownxx thats right, I have yet to see a good damage indicator that is hudless that doesn't actually disrupt more of the screen than a hud would.

If it comes down to it trading a small group for a larger group financially makes more sense. While it would be great if they could make a game that everyone loved they can't, so they settle for the majority. You might want to start making that gravestone now.

I for one don't really want to monitor my health bar all the time. I like it when the screen turns all red or black 'n white to indicate that I'm [censored] and that I need to get the hell away. I'm playing The Witcher 2 right now and that health bar stays where it is, however I keep dying unless I monitor it very closely; which breaks immersion and focus in my opinion.

I don't like health bars or the red splashes. What's wrong with a little number in the corner, Half-Life style? Their not as messy as red puddles nor as obstructive as health bars and you can very clearly see how much health you have left.
Win Win in my opinion.

This.


As a side note, it should depend on the game. Some games pull off the hudless look very well, like Metro 2033 and Amnesia: the Dark Descent. :shrug:

As do I. You'll be lucky nowadays to even have a numerical health indicator in the game. More and more games seem to just give you nondescript bars without any labeling, so instead of being able to play tactically and say "I have to avoid weapon X, it does 40 damage at a time" I have to say "I have to avoid weapon X, it does...uh...enough damage to make my health drop 4/9ths of the way past that little arrow right there."

It doesn't bother me not having health bars. However given the choice, I'd rather have something like http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=15790, where the hud goes away when you don't need it, but is there to see when you do need it...such as in combat, or when enemies are close by.

related

AI snipers

huh, so diffeent games are made differently, then?