there was years and years of fighting before the sack, it wasn't just out of the blue. they should have just stayed in atmora, cowards running from the mess they have made.

I am really sad that you cannot play the bad guy even though faction might be "bad".

Not to poke you with a sharp stick about that Nord thing.. but we the Dunmer are on your boat..

I think they lived by a merithic code of eye for an eye. Nordic men women and children were slaughtered and they repaid the falmer in kind. Was it right, nope, but they had it coming.

Waaait a minute. They almost exterminated an entire race. That's hardly proportional. "Eye for an eye" is all about being proportional. Like, causing to the offender the same evil that s/he caused to the victim.

No, you are not. But, WE do seem to be a minority.

The peaceful left atmora to find a new home. Don't blame them for that of all things.

Obviously the faction with Argonians is the only good people. They'll sacrifice themselves to heal the land, how can they be bad?

no. absolutely no text what so ever points to them being peaceful in any way.

"The Nords reportedly killed the Snow Elves by the thousands. Their descendants continue to glorify their ancestors' genocidal attacks against the Snow Elves; one of the most popular songs in Skyrim is "The Slaying of the Falmer Princes"

After wiping out organized elven resistance in Skyrim, the Nordic armies sought their enemy out on the island of solstheim. The elves made a last stand in the Battle of the moesring: after an intense battle, their leader, the snow prince, was killed, and the elves were routed. The age of the Snow Elves was done."

Eye for an eye is hardly about proportion. It's about revenge. And they were exacting it in a - admittedly - brutal fashion.

None. If you read the books in previous titles, they take care to set up multiple theories and understandings of past events. Like with the disappearance of the Dwemer for instance. It's the author's point of view.

Welcome to TES fandom, where genocide is good as long as 'our side' does it and evil where everyone else is doing it...

The song is about post saarthal, you know, after the falmer committed their own slaughter which isn't being condemned.

Aldmeri Dominion

No, it is not. It is only about proportion. It is the notion that the severity of the punishment must be equal to the severity of the crime. It is a real criminal justice system, and that's exactly how it is:

The criminal's punishment must be proportional to the crime.

The victim must receive financial compensation that must be proportional to the evil caused to him/her. If the victim died, then the victim's family will receive the compensation.

I can't believe someone just three years younger than me can look as good as Kate Where did I go wrong????

you still said its an eye for an eye.

except they didn't do an eye for an eye. what they did was like the falmer punching them, so in return they ran home crying, came back with a few friends, cut off the falmers hands and feet and brutally slaughtered all his family and friends in front of him while they slow roasted his pets over the fireplace and threw out all the food in his fridge he just restocked whilst dumping his tea into the bin.

see we have different beliefs of what an eye for an eye means.

You mean just like how the Falmer killed every single person in Saarthal besides Ysgramor and his sons? I'm not excusing the Nords, but what goes around comes around.

I can tell that, from what you've said, you just have blind bias against the Atmorans and Nords. The Nords were somewhat justified in seeking revenge for the attempted genocide of their race. Ysgramor retaliated by going back to Atmora and getting his kinsman, and then enacted a genocide of his own. It was brutal, sure, but just because they won doesn't mean they're any more evil than the Falmer.

Every single race in Nirn, be it man, mer, or beast, is responsible for a lot of evil [censored]. They've all caused a lot of death. Sometimes it was justified and sometimes it wasn't. That's the point, though. The races are all 'human', in that they have collective flaws and mistakes, and aren't purely benevolent.

Edit: As for the 'eye for an eye' argument between the Nords and Falmer, I could potentially argue that it was an 'equal' punishment. The Falmer nearly killed every last member of a specific people group (the Atmorans/Nords living in Skyrim), and so the Atmorans nearly killed every last member of a specific people group (the Falmer). Still technically the same punishment for each part, which is why the 'eye for an eye' argument is so convoluted and poor.

There weren't years of fighting beforehand. The Atmorans and the Falmer were friends, but when the Falmer felt threatened by the growing number of Atmorans, they attacked. If you read the Book of Exodus, same story. The Egyptians and Israelites are friends, but the Israelites grow far in number, and the Egyptians enslave them out of fear that the Israelites would eventually become enemies and overtake them.

Here's an Imperial source for that information: http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pocket_Guide_to_the_Empire,_1st_Edition/Skyrim

There's also the theory that the Ysgramor and the Atmorans discovered the Eye of Magnus when they built Saarthal, and when the Elves found out, they attacked in order to secure it for themselves: http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Night_of_Tears_(book)

They didn't create the Civil War any more than my grandfather created World War II. Just because you're part of a people doesn't mean you're responsible for what the rest of them do.

And regardless, if they had stayed, Atmora was freezing over and becoming absolutely uninhabitable, so they would have all died anyways. That's why you don't hear about Atmora anymore unless speaking historically.

I'm not advocating the genocide of the Falmer, but they're hardly innocent.

You can sell it any way you want but I can't think of one single person that can honestly say Dunmer are not evil. Just look at them! Them bleeding eyes and all :-S

Revenge is a [censored].

and Im hoping it comes back to haunt them. with bethesda hinting at the possible existence and hidden snow elves it just might. I mean they did say they had the power to magically hide entire cities right? when it comes to races I think we need one more mer and one less man.

That's a very problematic way of solving the issue.

As Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. once said: "Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that."

Odds are the next TES will be more about the recreation of the empire of man in Cyrodil/purging of the thalmor.

It may come back to haunt the nords though, but I'd place my bet in an avatar of talos reuniting the land as opposed to random elf race comes back from the brink.

I'd like to add a few things because this thread has turned into a long list of just hate on the nordic race and mer races, the Snow elves aren't gone you can meet the last two in Skyrim who knows how many more there are. Same be said for how many dwemer there could be. I don't like genocide but in the Imperials case responding with aggression was the only way they broke free from their masters the same with the Dunmer, no one can feel sorry for the Dunmer because we all know they got what they deserved. But if Elder Scrolls has taught me anything it's that all the races in the game have good qualities even the Dremora anyone remember Kathutet?

it probably won't. the TES games are about the prophecy of events that are large enough to destroy the world/just general evil beings coming in that a hero needs to step up to fight (EG daedra, dieties or things like the numidium). thalmor aren't really one such event. they might have them in the background like the skyrim civil war, but they won't be the focus. im personally putting my money on them skipping over it like they did the first great war.