Who's the better barbarian? : V - Skyrim

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 11:56 am

Orcs are savage, Nords are wild and barbaric. I say Nord.

Okay, I guess this is true. I never thought of that element when I placed my vote for orcs. So, for the record, I change my vote to Nord. :intergalactic:

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 5:56 pm

Orc because thier sixy :yes:

If you say so. To each his own... :shrug:

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:14 pm

I think the main problem with this thread is that people are confusing vikings and barbarians. The obvious choice is Orcs.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 6:21 pm

Nord no doubt, I dont see Orc's as a barbarian race acutally, I see em more of a warrior race, but not barbarians

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:04 pm

I think the main problem with this thread is that people are confusing vikings and barbarians. The obvious choice is Orcs.

I don't get it myself. I mean people are saying that Nords are more barbaric, but orcs are more savage. One of the dictionary definitions for barbarian includes savage and another is about being uncivilised. Nords are not uncivilised and I've never heard of them being particularly barbaric. I think people remember "Conan the barbarian" and think "Nords are similar in Nationality style, therefore they are barbarians" and think vikigns are barbarians, even though vikings and Barbarians are not the same thing, but often confused. Orcs seem to actually be based off Mongol Barbarians.

» Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:53 am

I don't get it myself. I mean people are saying that Nords are more barbaric, but orcs are more savage. One of the dictionary definitions for barbarian includes savage and another is about being uncivilised. Nords are not uncivilised and I've never heard of them being particularly barbaric. I think people remember "Conan the barbarian" and think "Nords are similar in Nationality style, therefore they are barbarians" and think vikigns are barbarians, even though vikings and Barbarians are not the same thing, but often confused. Orcs seem to actually be based off Mongol Barbarians.

Hm, never made such a connection, but now I think you are right... Oh, my head is spinning...I feel slightly dizzy... :dead:

Okay, my stance now is--both are barbarians in differing ways. I think orcs are the less civilized, so if we use that as the determining factor, then it would be orcs. Okay, I see both sides, and I'm staying put. :tongue:

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 11:56 pm

I don't get it myself. I mean people are saying that Nords are more barbaric, but orcs are more savage. One of the dictionary definitions for barbarian includes savage and another is about being uncivilised. Nords are not uncivilised and I've never heard of them being particularly barbaric. I think people remember "Conan the barbarian" and think "Nords are similar in Nationality style, therefore they are barbarians" and think vikigns are barbarians, even though vikings and Barbarians are not the same thing, but often confused. Orcs seem to actually be based off Mongol Barbarians.

Atually the romans called the northmen barbarians because they had an alien culture that seemed savage compared to their own. Barbarian just means different/not understood more or less, and since the nrod are infact based on the northmen I don't see how Nord aren't the most barbaric.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 4:43 pm

Atually the romans called the northmen barbarians because they had an alien culture that seemed savage compared to their own. Barbarian just means different/not understood more or less, and since the nrod are infact based on the northmen I don't see how Nord aren't the most barbaric.

I was going by the modern definition which I found in a dictionary. It said savage and uncivilised. But even if they are based off a race considered barbaric, why does that mean they are the MOST barbaric? Since we're in Skyrim I guess they're not foreign at all, so that doesn't fit with that definition!

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 11:01 am

I was going by the modern definition which I found in a dictionary. It said savage and uncivilised. But even if they are based off a race considered barbaric, why does that mean they are the MOST barbaric? Since we're in Skyrim I guess they're not foreign at all, so that doesn't fit with that definition!

that is because the modern use of the word is based upon the view of the northmen back in the day, which was in the eyes of the beholders savage and wild. But still, that doesn't change the barbaric infact does refer to northern tribal culture

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 10:59 pm

I go with orc. Used to be concidered too uncivilized and where believed too be a distant relative of the goblins. Also I think they look more savage.

» Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:07 am

I was going by the modern definition which I found in a dictionary. It said savage and uncivilised. But even if they are based off a race considered barbaric, why does that mean they are the MOST barbaric? Since we're in Skyrim I guess they're not foreign at all, so that doesn't fit with that definition!

Well, if a Gaul were in Gaul, he'd still be a barbarian (at least from the roman viewpoint). I suppose the reason I see Orcs more as barbarians than Nords is because I relate barbarians to Gauls and Germanic tribes.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 10:53 pm

LOL are we really arguing over semantics here? I'm finding this somewhat entertaining.... Perception is an interesting thing, and we all have our own varying perspectives. I say orcs, you say nords. But it really doesn't matter, when it comes down to it... Still, I'm enjoying this. Keep em coming! :teehee:

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 6:06 pm

I'm just wondering why this thread is in the Skyrim section, it clearly isn't about the game. I think this would fit better in the lore forums.

I don't get it myself. I mean people are saying that Nords are more barbaric, but orcs are more savage. One of the dictionary definitions for barbarian includes savage and another is about being uncivilised. Nords are not uncivilised and I've never heard of them being particularly barbaric. I think people remember "Conan the barbarian" and think "Nords are similar in Nationality style, therefore they are barbarians" and think vikigns are barbarians, even though vikings and Barbarians are not the same thing, but often confused. Orcs seem to actually be based off Mongol Barbarians.

And I think Dragonbone have a good point here. Vikings were more like warriors, with a structured civilasation. There were even more traders and farmers in Scandinavia than professonal warriors. They were just pictured as barbaric savages by the Katolic Church since they had another religion until around year 1200A.C.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 12:14 pm

TES is heavily influenced by Roman culture, so we can safely use the original Roman definition of the word "barbaric". And that definition clearly points to the peoples of central and northern Europe, which are most similar to NORDS.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 1:07 pm

TES is heavily influenced by Roman culture, so we can safely use the original Roman definition of the word "barbaric". And that definition clearly points to the peoples of central and northern Europe, which are most similar to NORDS.

No, Imperials are slightly influenced by Roman culture. And apparently barbaric for Romans meant foreign and different, and if that's the case, orcs are equally barbaric if not moreso.

EDIT: And if you are to go by the barbarian archetype which was portrayed by Romans, that is neither accurate to Norse people or Nords, it actually fits more with orcs. Barbarians were portrayed as savage and uncivilised, and for this reason, people are thinking nords are like that, when they are not. They have a strong society, whereas the orcs are barbaric and uncivilised.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:13 pm

I say Nord because of actuarial historic reference the Nord i'm guessing would be based off vikings them selves. vikings were more Civil then Barbarians but they still fit the category. orcs are Savage more so but they wouldn't fall to the category because there more savage lore wise then Barbarians were Historically.

» Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:40 am

No, Imperials are slightly influenced by Roman culture. And apparently barbaric for Romans meant foreign and different, and if that's the case, orcs are equally barbaric if not moreso.

EDIT: And if you are to go by the barbarian archetype which was portrayed by Romans, that is neither accurate to Norse people or Nords, it actually fits more with orcs. Barbarians were portrayed as savage and uncivilised, and for this reason, people are thinking nords are like that, when they are not. They have a strong society, whereas the orcs are barbaric and uncivilised.

No, the Romans would have considered the orcs as just animals to be slaughtered in the Colosseum. Nords would at least have the status of barbaric humans.

» Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:58 am

No, the Romans would have considered the orcs as just animals to be slaughtered in the Colosseum. Nords would at least have the status of barbaric humans.

What? Because they are "unhuman in appearance"? This is TES, the comparisons to the real world are not exact, orcs are considered uncivilised brutish peoples, much like Barbarians, outcast by the Cyrodiilians, whereas Nords are a highly civilised culture and a welcome part of the empire (until they decide to rebel). Just because they don't have human appearance doesn't make them the same as non-sentient animals in the real world.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 3:15 pm

The origin of the word "barbarian" (ancient Greek? I recall reading about it, but not certain anymore) meant something along the lines of "not speaking the common language of our culture". It didn't necessarily mean that they weren't civilized, just "foreign" and lacking in familiarity with the culture, although it implied "not as good".

The one difference between Orcs and Nords is that the Orc will be resentful or shameful of his or her (real or imagined) sense of mental inferiority. The Nord, in contrast, will be proud of his own stupidity, possibly even boastful about it: "Well, I'm so stupid that I......."

» Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:21 am

Can't beat Grognak the Barbarian.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:03 pm

Orcs are the more proper savage folk originally (though actually they're quite refined and industrious), while the Nords are actually a rather civilized folk overall... though reeks of alcohol and freaking LOUD. Eh, my vote goes to the Orcs.

Though the most fearsome barbaric warrior there is would be a Khajiit warrior of a Cathay-raht sub-species, under the influence of 'dem Skoomas.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:10 pm

Zorc

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 4:52 pm

Never played Morrowind? Berserk svcked in Oblivion, but in Morrowind it allowed a level 1 orc to kill enemies that normally only a level 10+ character could kill.

Ah, I have/do play Morrowind, but never played as an Orc in Morrowind. Nor am I really inclined to. Shoulda thought of that before posting though. My mistake.

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:38 pm

nords are plain old humans
orcs are savage monsters who will destroy anything in their path

» Wed Sep 01, 2010 7:34 pm

Nord and Orc? Impossible to decide, I think their both brutish and savage in their own ways.

Besides the words savage and barbaric are open to interpretation and one's own view of civilization.

Yeah, I pretty much agree