I agree with you, but, we have no idea if chicago existed prior to rig explosion, was manned by Navarro troops, or what.

All we know is it exists. Troops, strength, who formed it, all a big guess. Likewise, existence of other bases is pure guess. Which is why I hope they are in FO4 so we can start eliminating guess work and replace it with actual lore. If they are 5 troops or 500, pre-existed or from Navarro, other bases or is this last stand, whatever, I would like to know.

all iv ever wanted was to join the enclave. in fallout 1 your given the option of helping the master in fallout 2 your forced to destroy the enclave in tactics your still given the option to help bad guy in fallout 3 forced to help brotherhood in New Vegas you get to chose from 4 factions it looks like in evey game were enclave in it you have to destroy them cuz they love america but with every other game you can help bad guys now the enclave arnt evil just misunderstood and i think its there tern to be joinable like other people have said that the enclave are changing Eden and autumn are the best example Eden trying to kill all mutations Autumn realising that they need to change to survive now im confidant that even if you killed autumn in the purifier or let him live bethesda will bring him back in fallout 4 and say that when autumn left he toke some troops and scientists with him and headed for an outpost or base (possible chicago) and at that base he decided to let people join them (probably only if they have an american background and if there not suffering from mutation and like i said before they could have made there own combat armer (due to power armer in short supply) and regular foot soldiers get guns and sergeants get energy guns and have MK1 power armer (the chicago base doesn't have MK2 or at lest shouldn't) officers still have officer outfit and higher ranking soldiers get MK 2 (veteran soldiers from D.C) and they have a few vertabrids left and a few robots now they are not a main faction but a side faction that is willing to fight in the upcoming battle and depending on how you help them they become good or bad so now that iv typed down evey thing that i think should happen what do all of you think?

bethesda wont be making FO4 like obsidian made new vegas, two totally different styles, bethesda makes fantasy games, obsidian wants their game world to be "plausible" and "believable" so thats gonna be a major difference, bethesda is far better at making interesting enemies to fight, the enclave were cool,....ceasers legion in coimparison is just plain stupid, a faction that live in tents and throws spears and uses macheties, thats not even close to the enclave, ceasers legion is the worst faction in any game i have ever played, and they really don't fit in the game or make sense, they make no sense at all. the slavers in the pitt or CW did make sense, but not ceasers legion its a faction that might of looked good on paper but really wasn't implemented or done well at all.

Kai-sar's legion is not THE enemy, you can help them. Many see the ncr as the enemy

"While changing his armor back in the bunker" Hey, quit tying us into this discussion! If you got a problem with my brothers and sisters, make your own seperate discussion, i am no FEV user, and neither is my brothers and sisters, so quit tying us in with the Enclave.

the enclave arnt evil they just love america..............................a little to much

they loved her to death
to bad she returned the favor.

its the enclaves turn to be joinable

coronal autumn LIVES TO FIGHT ANOTHER DAY!?!

what you didnt like my saying lol

Sorry, I know how much you like them, but joining the Enclave just wouldn't make any sense lorewise. Unlike the BoS, who are just isolationist and xenophobic, they're aggressively xenophobic.

No I know mate. I was saying that even if chicago was founded in the same year as FO2, they still have enough time to get a sizeable force together.

I agree that it is all speculation as all we know is there IS a base in chicago.

like i said in an earlier post around 127 on page seven of this topic the enclave is in fact changing A.K.A Eden sticking with original plan and autumn realising that the enclave needs to change if there goal of saving america is to survive now if you wont to read my entire post its the big one about around 127 (127 is 127 post ) on page seven of this topic soooooooooo GO READ IT CUZ I WORKED HARD ON IT

I wouldn't say Autumn is "changing" the way the Enclave works. Plus he's dead, or gone. If you remember in FO2, they used slave labor, and used mercs to get the stuff they wanted. Do you really think Autumn would have turn around and started handing out water to the wastelanders? What I saw was really no better then there "old ways". They would have denied the mutants, and kept the primes as second class citizens at best, and only the useful ones. They control the water, so you have to do what they say or drink poison. Can you say work camps?

I wish there was a eye bot that played cats in the cradle.
If you haven't heard it here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-s5r2spPJ8g


but I guess and's right
but any one can change there ways
even if they had a dark hole in there chest they can change.
but as I have said assassins would be there best role now.

The Enclave wasn't Bethesda's creation. It was Black Isle's (known as Obsidian nowadays). Also, why do people keep insisting that the Legion only uses spears and machetes? I mostly see the recruits using them, everyone else usually has guns like cowboy repeater or shotguns.

The Legion is trained to be awesome with kill quick with sharp blades, but I also mostly see them ranged weapons.

And at west, all factions look good on paper and in concept art. I agree, the Caesar's Legion wasn't implemented as good as they could have been, but they aren't the worst faction I've seen in a video game.
Edit: and you don't say they make any sense at all. Why not?

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

i think the slavers in FO3 and the pitt were implemented better, but yeah ceasers legion were implemented really bad.

He does have a point that unarmored legion recruits actually using blades as a primary weapon against firearm-equipped enemies is a bit silly.

That said, most I've encountered use the Cowboy Repeater at a minimum.

Say that to Machete. Think he handles enemies with firearms quite well in close combat with sharp blades.

Agreed. Its sad some people just want TES clones.

Enclave are gone as a powerful faction.

Going off topic. People saying the legion was a bad faction need to wake up.. Fallout 3 is full of bad factions as in they fall short. Talon Company and Enclave could have been awesome but no, they were made just so we have enemies to shoot over and over. We are forced into joining the BoS and can't do more then sell weapons to the Outcast.

Indeed, just watched that movie last weekend.

"While relaxing in the Bunker" Look, i am no fan of the Enclave as much as the next person in the Brotherhood, i would sooner use their spare Mark II Armor on Mannequins for Target practice, heck i got chewed out for helping out on these conversations by my elder. But give them a break people, they are as much fans of a organization that would sooner see most of you dead of a Modified FEV virus or some other crazy maniacal plan all in the name of restoring the Commonwealth of the United States of America and all the normal people in it. We know what happened in the games, we can argue and fight like Deathclaws, but we do not have to, we can be civilized about this.....well, as civilized as we can be in the wasteland, but you know what i mean, PLAY NICE! Now shake hands or whatever, let bygones be bygones, and respect each others opinions, let the Enclave supporters have their say and wishes, and vice versa........there, it's not too tough. It's like showing a nube Initiate how to put in a MF cell into a AER-9 Laser Rifle, easy peasy.

(Nuff Said)

I didnt know the East Coast BoS had the one single prototype AER-14 I think you mean the AER-9 Laser Rifle common on the East Coast.