If you have beaten the both stories and listened/read the logs has your opinion on whose side you would choose changed.



EDIT: The not sure can double an an undecided or no opinion or neither or something to that effect.

EDIT: The new poll is asking if your opinion about the different factions has changed. Please state whether it did or did not change for the better or worse.

I've sided with Security. The Outside world is dangerous and it's not safe to venture out there. I believe that security and the founders do have the best interest of the people at heart and are trying to compensate for a lack of resources. It's understandable why the guests are frustrated but the water must be rationed out according to ones importance, we must keep the leadership alive. Whats' important is the survival of the Ark and Civilization, not comfort and ease. Chen is an opportunist and oratory master who has little control over what his followers do (the attack on the Reactor). I find that Security is focused on the future of the Ark and the safety of all, while the resistance has nearsighted and immediate goals. They do not think ahead, only in the present.

It's not like the Resistance knew there was life outside the Ark that was in worse shape then they were.

I side with neither, really see no point in siding with one or the other

Security. The guests are unwanted. The fact that they are actually giving them water and supplies is already enough.

Has that changed from before you had the game. In other words were you sided with restance or security before you got the game and now you opinion has changed or stayed the same.

My opinion hasnt really changed from pre-release

The security and the founders have just wanted to help and keep people safe, the resistance are trying to do what they think is right but are clearly misguided. The missions more or less make the side youre on look good (ignoring the what-ifs) but the audio logs take a different turn. Chen comes across as a paranoid person with far too much anger and power. He could tell the founders that the Arks is doomed unless something is done about the Arkoral, but doesn't.

The founders clearly only wanted to help from the very start, and are blamed and accused by the refugees unfairly. But at the same time, they are also guilty of hiding information that is best out in the open. They should have told the resistance that outside contact has already been attempted, and is dangerous. Even if they did it at this point it would be seen as a lie.

The only person in the audio logs that seems like he is doing his best is the head of security. He and his troops have no options left at this point. They are told to keep the peace and are being shot at by the resistance.

Preferred Security since the beginning. :tops:

resisance is more of something i would do in real life cause they get treated lesser than others.

I gotta say i always sided with resistance and still do side with them. Althou my impression on security has changed alot, for the better that is, and i undertstand them much better now aswell.

Lets go to beginnings first.

the Guests might be unwanted, but are they really unwanted? they are currently doing all the dangerous maintainance work on the Arc and basicly doing all the dirty work. for free. they dont care if they are practically treated like slaves.
All they want is a place to live and food and water.

Cut off 1 of theese basics, or restricting them, is going to far, when they already demand so little.

I still personally dont understand why they cut off so much of the arc from the guests, theres quite alot of "unhabitated" archipelagos on the arc, designed for tourists and such, wich are practically left abondoned.
yet, i dont understand why they dont give theese places, more livingspace, less cramped the guests are and less distinct on hierarchy on the Arc.
Its one of the things that the Arc suffers from. the founders and the guests are basicly seperated, where guests are living as low-lives while the founders live like nobels, ofcourse the guests gonna look at them with envy and jealusy.
make the difference bigger, you make the problem bigger. and thus you get what the Arc suffers from now.

And also both chen and the founders fault. They do not want to tell the people what really happens.
Chen refuses to tell his secret, i wont tell, as it will be spoiler, listen to the audio log if u wanna find out!
and the founders refusal to tell the people about the outside world and its condition it is still in.

this also causes more chaos and misunderstandings.

But i still side with resistance. as there is no reason for the arc to isolate itself from the outside world.

and there is no reason to leave so much empty wasted space, just to be empty and wasted when its needed so much!

I say, the arc should unite, as togheter, they actually got quite a powerfull military force.

get close to land, and make a position. from there, they can conquer land, and create a nation, with the arc beeing the capital. yes, the entire world is Mad Max style. but the arc has enough power to keep the savages at bay, and aswell as making other savages actually join them, convert, and conquer.
and they will not have to worry about livingspace again.
Watersupply will always be a issue.
But cmon, destillation is a simple thing to do, all you need is space, and make it into large scale. if they can get a destilation plant up and going, seawater wont be a problem! and drinking supply will be in more ampler supply.

The arc will be the base and foundation, get on land and expand, and soon people no longer will be desperate to reach the arc, and people can instead reside in the country it has created and the arc will be left for the founders alone again.

In the big simple picture. ofcourse its gonna be much more complex than this, but just to explain thigns simple and short and basic.

That's the thing, you can't build a nation if there isn't the foundations of what a nation should be built on. Fertile land, clean water and such.

I side with Security as I have done from the beginning, I believe that Chen and his followers are disillusioned, they believe that society must have re-built itself in the twenty years that they haven't had contact with the outside world, they believe that there is a better standard of living than that they have now which isn't true, the Guests do have clean drinking water, yes it is rationed but it is necessary, in the outside world there would be no clean water.

The Refugees do not do all of the work, that's what Chen claims to get people angry. There are founders who are in charge of the reactors, in charge of security, ARE the security, scientists, engineers, doctors, etc. The matinence is mostly made of refugees because maitinence is an easy job to teach people. Its easy to teach a person how to do something, knowing why is much harder. The founders were mostly trained professionals, experts; the refugees are all types and educations, mostly normal civilians. Even the founder in the audio logs, a member of the council, mentions working in the clinic as a doctor. They aren't slacking as much as the refugees are convinced.

The refugees were originally kept on their own because they arrived and there wasn't really anywhere to put them. As more and more kept arriving, Container city grew, more islands were made for them, but there were still kept on their own. By the time the refugees outnumbered the founders 10:1, there was a large criminal element. Founders built the wall to keep them in check. I'm not saying that building what essentially is a concentration camp is the best idea, but that is why.

Its fair to say that the founders are living better lives, but its definitely not a good situation for them either. Should the founders give their resources away to the point of starvation? The founders are giving everything they can spare, more or less by choice, while working to keep the Ark afloat, just as the refugees are.

In the end, I agree that the leaders keeping secrets is the main cause of conflict. Of the two factions though, the security are the ones with cleaner hands. They cant be blamed for the faults of the ones in control, they are just trying to keep the peace. They kill because they are being shot at. The resistance kill because they want more than they are being given.

1. I think that the Security are right, the rest of the Earth is destroyed, and what's left is even worse. I agree that the Ark needs to remain a hidden city in the ocean.
2. The Resistance's cause is just but they can't understand that there isn't anything left to return to.
3. The Founders and the Security Force may seem oppressive but they can't do much more to save the Ark.

I really love how this story line is so deep as to get us to take sides and argue of who is right. When was the last time you played a game like that, really?

I sided with Security in the beginning, and after hearing all the audio logs, I'm happy with my choice.

The Resistance is lead by Chen, an arrogant man who is clearly only after his own personal interests. He, like a cult leader, uses his people to destroy that which he feels is holding him back. In his arrogance he fails to tell the Founders about the irreparable issues with the Arkoral. Chen is a vile, desperate, manipulative man who is knowingly fanning the flames of hatred for his own selfish goals. He doesn't care about the Guests. He simply needs an army.

In the audio logs we learn that Guests can achieve a greater standard of living if they apply themselves. They are given education, they are given chances of promotion, they can even join Security! As to why the water is rationed? There isn't enough for everyone. The Ark was made to house 5,000 people, and it's currently housing over twice that amount of people [I forgot the exact number. It's mentioned in one of the little facts shown in loading screens]. The desalinization plants are running non-stop. There just isn't enough for everyone. Hell, one of the audio logs even mentions how the Founders tried to build new pelgos for the Guests! The project failed due to a few flaws... mainly because they were being too hasty, so there is that.

Now I do admit the Founders and Security aren't 100% good. Mokoena mentions in an audio log how some of his men have taken things too far, and how he would deal with them accordingly when the war is over. There is also the fact that some places [such as the abandoned airport and the resort] could be used to house Guests? How come they are abandoned? That is never truly explained by anyone, or even mentioned. I do understand how the Founders can be apprehensive about living next to the Guests. The world was in shambles when they came, society was deteriorating and people were doing horrible things to survive. The last thing anyone would want is to live next to a homicidal maniac. Of course, generalizing a group is wrong, but desperate times call for desperate measures. The Founders could have just as easily not allowed anyone to stay... and they would have been right to do so.

But I'm going to stop babbling. Those are my two cents, and I respect anyone who disagrees. This is what I understand from what I've heard and read. In the end both sides are in the wrong... in one way or the other. I strongly think Security has the people's best interest in their minds. Chen on the other hand... well, I'm just sad he isn't killed int he end. I hate him so much. Would love to see the Resistance take him out. Then again that would only lead to an actual psycho leading things, such as the genius who suggested the mission to blow up the reactor and making the Ark an unlivable radioactive wasteland. lol

After beating both sides of the game, I can't see how the resistance members aren't completely evil. I've never seen such homicidal monsters being presented on even footing as if they could have been the good guys.

I haven't beaten the game yet, and haven't unlocked all the logs yet, but overall, I supported both sides in their argument that "we have good reason to fight" - I prefer Security stylistically, and that isn't going to change because of storyline. The further I get into the Resistance campaign, the more I feel that at least most of them are justified in their actions and just doing what they feel is necessary.

Ive always been pulled more towards the Resistance, mainly cause i share the urge for freedom and equality.
though it sickens me people always try and find the worst about another that,
atleast not in obvious ways, support their own cause and and goals.

Both sides show pro's and cons,
Security wants to bring peace to the ark and let everyone live there properly, though i think they should ask more questions, instead of walking into Resistance areas guns blazing (such as in Container City).
The Resistance feel they are being mistreated (a fair opinion if you ask me) and want more freedom.

Both act through violence so i think both sides are wrong. Still i do blame the founder for it all,
they knew where the world was going to, and built the ark, they had enough wealth and presumably time,
yet they made it to "only" support 5.000 people! which were mainly wealthy and/or highly educated (lazy) people.

Its they're own fault they made the place, and didn't make it bigger.
its they're own fault they let more people in.
its they're fault they kept 80% of the resources for barely 20% of the population (founders/security).
So really who's fault is it that there is a war going on on The Ark?

If you are refering to the founders, they did build the place, maybe not entirely, but to an extent. If you are refering to inteligent people in real life then without them we would not have some of the things we have today.

PS: If you want to respond to this rather than leave a comment and start some war send me a message. I'm not trying to start something; just wanted to state what I thought.

"An unjust peace is better than a just war." ~Cicero
"I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent." ~Gandhi
"What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy?" ~Gandhi

I can understand why they are doing it, and it is a just cause; but I do not agree with the methods.

As to your multiple questions:

They made the place as an experement to see if sustainable life was possible, and then the world fell apart. The Ark was not meant to be a housing district, just a working model.

They should be faulted for letting too many people in and helping them survive for decades, instead of letting them die by refusing them admittance?

Where are you getting your information from about founders hordeing resources? Chen? He's far from unbiased.

Listen to chens audio logs, he is equally guilty of refusing to meet halfway in the meetings that were held, and to top it off is paranoid that they are trying to stab him in the back, though there is no actual evidence of it. I doubt the founders are looking to create a Martyr anyway.

After finishing the story, but not the audio logs, it's still Security for me.

**SPOILERS**

Security campaign pretty much proves that Resistance are ignorant, and that Security's plan is the most suitable option. Heck, even on Terminal as Resistance I found myself siding with the green-shirted guy in the pre-match cutscene who raises the point that Security might be right about everything, but he gets shut down. Also, listening to the Security leader's audio loops in the Challenges, he's trying to get his point across and having seen both sides of the story I wholeheartedly agree with him.

**/SPOILERS**

I'll give the audio logs a listen when I'm not grinding my alt. up to lvl 20, but I doubt my opinion will change drastically.

But I will admit that after playing both Campaigns thoroughly... I've grown a lot more fond of The Resistance outfits. :tongue: The Lost & Anger jackets, The Voice pants, The Firestarter and Hockey masks... <3

There is one detail in Chen's audio logs that may change your opinion a bit. Not of factions themselves, but of what should be done for the future.

And more quotes against the actions of the resistance:

"It is not enough to say we must not wage war. It is necessary to love peace and sacrifice for it." ~MLK

"Why should we love our enemies? The first reason is fairly obvious. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that. ... Have wwe not come to such an impasse in the modern world that we must love our enemies - or else? The chain reaction of evil - hate begetting hate, wars producing more wars - must be broken, or we will be plunged into the dark abyss of annihilation." ~MLK

Oh man! I can't wait 'till I unlock all the audio logs!!! >w< Getting to level 20 is a pain considering I'm lazy ;D

Yeah, my OCD made me wait till i had them all before listening to any.

Yeah, I'm gonna play through the entire campaign on my new PSN (I quit the last one because I got tired of it...) or the next couple of days, and hopefully get to level 20 by Sunday >w< Then I get to listen to them all and understand more of this

The main reason I am siding with the Resistance at the moment is pretty simple. The Ark will die. It's a ticking time bomb, and while I may agree with many of the Security's points(and I may change over), the fact is that the Ark won't last forever.

You don't get them all from reaching level 20, im level 20 and im still getting new audio logs every time i play a match.

Tho as soon as my main ps3 is fixed im going to have to get them all over again.......o well

Anyways.

I played security campgain first and what they did felt right, they are doing whats best for EVERYONE. Then i played resistance, from the beggining it was...odd, chen says to kill the hostage so the security does not torture him? But security said the resistance kidnapped the hostage and injected a neurotoxin into him. So Chen is telling his men lies? by the end of it all, i felt the resistance were insaine. Most of the resistance members are criminals or psychotic. One of the guys in the cutscenes at the beggining is not so devoted, he feels like its wrong and does not want to fight. as you go through the story, he becomes more and more devoted,crazy even. at one point he does not want to attack the security HQ because his brother joined them. Later he preaches about how the founders are evil and such, and by the end, (in the what-if) he gathers some troops and decides to blow up the reactors, even tho chen was bluffing.

Also, in the audio logs, Chen says 'I' alot, it seems he is more concerned about HIM, and HIS family name, he just wants control. I belived he was leading a rightious casue even tho im pro security, but in the end it seems he is wrong. Instead of telling the founders crucial information that could destroy the ARC, he hides it in fear he and the rest of matnience is blamed for it. Instead he makes up lies about it being the security's helicopters and patrol boats causing it.

In the end i am now mostly Anti-Resistance and still 100% Pro-Security.