why are we a coldblooded bastard? : V - Skyrim

» Sun May 29, 2011 2:10 am

I didn't mean that I did not want to defeat / kill / whatever Alduin.

I ment I didn't want to kill an intire spiecies (with humanoid brain) just because it gives me powers.

It's ok. They aren't real dragons.

» Sat May 28, 2011 11:48 am

It's too early to be thinking anything about that. We don't know exactly what the story is. What we do know is that Alduin wants to eat the world and we're going to be fighting dragons. That's all we really know. Whether they're in Alduin's "grasp" or acting of their own free will, we don't know. There's not a lot of information on dragons in TES so it's too soon to say.

You felt bad for killing Dremora? Why? That's ridiculous. The Dremora attack you first, they hate mortals, and they are immortal. When they die, they're later resurrected in Dagon's Deadlands, so you never truly killed any of them.

What makes Aedra more susceptible to being killed than any other god? No god truly "dies" in the literal sense.

:P

The difference being, Dagoth Ur was a mortal who stole godhood and we were only able to kill him after removing his godhood. Alduin is an actual god whose godhood cannot be removed.

no the fact they are aedra is because they can die.. lorkhan died who was responsible for the creatuon of nirn... deadra however can't . Aedra used much of thier power to create nirn but escape before it was to much so they sityll more powerful than mortals

» Sun May 29, 2011 1:39 am

What makes Aedra more susceptible to being killed than any other god? No god truly "dies" in the literal sense.

That's because in TES the term "death" is only applicable to mortals as their tendency to depart from Nirn and head into Aetherius (the equivalent of heaven in TES). Creatures not bound to the rules of time (set by Alduin being shackled to Nirn) are thus "immortal" in the sense that they don't age or depart from their realm into an afterlife - for them, the concepts "age" and "afterlife" don't even exist. They can, however, be destroyed utterly or (in the case of gods and Daedra) be cast out of a realm by force, such as what happened to Mehrunes Dagon in TES 4. That is as close as you can get to "killing" a god.

» Sat May 28, 2011 11:03 pm

I'm fine with intelligent dragon conversations instead of just a predator/prey sort of thing.

Maybe once you learn enough of the dragon tongue, perhaps then more dialog will open up as you become a bigger threat to them

AND my character is warm-blooded and his parents were married thank you very much!

» Sat May 28, 2011 10:27 am

The "big evil dragon" is Alduin is Akatosh. We cannot kill Alduin.

He's a god! How can you kill a god?!

If anything we'll be disabling him or just stopping his seemingly-inevitable destruction of the Mundus. Or something else. Hell, I don't know. Better be a good explanation for it though.

By killing him

EDIT: In Oblivion i often casted a 100 points charm spell on dremora and bandits and only bandits had rumors

» Sat May 28, 2011 5:14 pm

no the fact they are aedra is because they can die.. lorkhan died who was responsible for the creatuon of nirn... deadra however can't . Aedra used much of thier power to create nirn but escape before it was to much so they sityll more powerful than mortals

Lorkhan did not die in the traditional sense. He still exists, he is just cut off from the Mundus.

The Aedra are the ones who did not escape the Mundus, which is why they are still there and active. Akatosh/Alduin is the one who threw himself into the Mundus, even after seeing it was a trap. He was the one who helped shape Nirn into what it is. Killing Alduin would be like killing time, which would destroy the fabric of reality as we know it.

» Sat May 28, 2011 2:45 pm

That's because in TES the term "death" is only applicable to mortals as their tendency to depart from Nirn and head into Aetherius (the equivalent of heaven in TES). Creatures not bound to the rules of time (set by Alduin being shackled to Nirn) are thus "immortal" in the sense that they don't age or depart from their realm into an afterlife - for them, the concepts "age" and "afterlife" don't even exist. They can, however, be destroyed utterly or (in the case of gods and Daedra) be cast out of a realm by force, such as what happened to Mehrunes Dagon in TES 4. That is as close as you can get to "killing" a god.

maybe we can bind him to a imprisonable human form using nine pieces of eight...

while writing this thinkin:

they already bound him to human form, that's how martin was able to become akatosh, dragonborn are the human prison of alduin?!!?!?!

you are gonna destroy nirn!

» Sat May 28, 2011 2:12 pm

To be honest I even felt bad for the dremora I was slayin in oblivion.

You realize that they don't actually "die".

» Sat May 28, 2011 3:57 pm

so what I understand from this game is:

there are dragons
there are humans
there are other humanoids
there is a big evil dragon who wants to eat the world
there is a dovahkiin who can stop that from happening

to me this doesn't imply that the one person who can negotiate with the dragons is supposed to kill all of them.

can't we find a way to settle this like advlts and kill the big evil dragon but make peace with the rest of them?

and the trolls are gonna say

EDIT: if you really read this, then you know I am not interested in negotiating with alduin, that's just a waste of breath. I am however interested in negotiating with the other dragons, like we negotiated with that one guy in the forbidden grotto.

Well one could try to negotiate with them, but that is a little bit difficult when they are trying to bite off one's head!

One also has to assume that NONE of the other dragons under Alduin agree with Alduin and that seems rather far fetched. Lastly, it is interesting that they fear no one, except the Dragon Born who can use their own language against them. As far as settling things like advlts....take a look at how advlts are settling things in this world... probably not the best choice for reaching an amicable conclusion between humanoid and dragon. *wink*

» Sun May 29, 2011 12:58 am

didn't mean all dragons, but atleast some

» Sat May 28, 2011 10:10 pm

I didn't say Alduin shouldn't die!

I ment that the fact that dragons are for now in trailers and stuff seen as oblivion gates, randomly appearing, destructible and optaining magical powers in the process, is rather disturbing to me, these dragons have their own script. they should have there own voice and there free will, can't they help you free the dragons from Alduin's grasp and maybe, just maybe, let you idk, ride them in to battle? become one with them?

To be honest I even felt bad for the dremora I was slayin in oblivion.

Ride them? no
Become one? hell no

Dragons are the nukes of the TES series, and many other RPGs. That be too much

» Sat May 28, 2011 10:31 pm

you are gonna destroy nirn!

Nope, just make him dormant and unable to free himself

» Sat May 28, 2011 9:49 am

Nope, just make him dormant and unable to free himself

darn it I just had a funny mindspin...

» Sat May 28, 2011 12:38 pm

It's a Dragon....the ability to talk doesn't mean I'm less willing to plunge an axe into it's skull. :thumbsup:

» Sat May 28, 2011 10:57 am

There cant be negotiation. The dragons are trying to eat the world. Not to mention, being dragon born just means that he is a descendant of the septim line. The last descendant.

I was pretty sure that being "Dragonborn" meant that your character has the soul of a dragon, or that he can simply speak the language. And the Dragonborn can be any race, that's confirmed, and the Septims are Imperials. How does a Khajiht come from a line of men? Or a Argonian? That's (probably) not possible, let alone likely.

So basically, your guy isn't from the Septim line. I think.....

» Sat May 28, 2011 9:25 pm

Yeah....The kind Leaper Devil King tried negotiating with Alduin. Look how that turned out, he's now cursed as Mehrunes Dagon, forever doomed to try and try again to destroy Mundus so that he can leap again and teach those how to leap away from the mouth of Alduin.

And let's not forget that thanks to Martin and the CoC he can now never re-enter Mundus. Thus making him forever cursed to be Mehrunes Dagon. Akatosh/Alduin is such a dike. He cursed poor old Dagon and who was it that kicked his ass right back to Oblivion maybe 2minutes after he got to enter Mundus? Akatosh/Alduin! :stare:

I'm honestly hoping as the Dovahkiin I can strike some kind of deal with Mehrunes Dagon for aid to stop Alduin, and hopefully break the curse upon him without having to destroy Mundus. Though, I really don't see that happening.

Edit* to the point of this thread though, anyone could learn the Dragon Language and attempt to negotiate. And for all we know the main quest might involve swaying some Dragons to your side. Assuming it is possible and Alduin isn't controlling them in some way.

» Sat May 28, 2011 5:35 pm

I was pretty sure that being "Dragonborn" meant that your character has the soul of a dragon, or that he can simply speak the language. And the Dragonborn can be any race, that's confirmed, and the Septims are Imperials. How does a Khajiht come from a line of men? Or a Argonian? That's (probably) not possible, let alone likely.

So basically, your guy isn't from the Septim line. I think.....

They aren't, how many times will we have to say this.

It's like every week, "Dragons from Akavir! OMG", "We are Martin's kid! OMG"

Dragons are tying to destroy the mortal plane. There is no negotiation.
"Hey dragon why are we fighting?"
"My god told me to."
"Well don't, he is a jerk."
"You know your right little one. I'm going to tell Alduiin to back off. How mad could he be?"

... And we never heard from that dragon again. :shakehead:

» Sat May 28, 2011 4:08 pm

I always imagined that somewhere in the storyline there wold be an old, dumbledore-like dragon that is wise and you can talk to without him eating you. then eventually all the hater dragons would eat his ***

» Sat May 28, 2011 7:05 pm

No.

» Sun May 29, 2011 2:01 am

I didn't say Alduin shouldn't die!

I ment that the fact that dragons are for now in trailers and stuff seen as oblivion gates, randomly appearing, destructible and optaining magical powers in the process, is rather disturbing to me, these dragons have their own script. they should have there own voice and there free will, can't they help you free the dragons from Alduin's grasp and maybe, just maybe, let you idk, ride them in to battle? become one with them?

To be honest I even felt bad for the dremora I was slayin in oblivion.

Why feel bad, if someone tries to murder you they absolutely have it coming...

» Sat May 28, 2011 11:06 pm

Someone's been playing too much Spyro.

» Sat May 28, 2011 1:06 pm

Why feel bad, if someone tries to murder you they absolutely have it coming...

Dragon: "AARRRHHAHHGFHHHH!!!!"

Dovahkiin: "Dude! Relax, I understand your pain! You people is repressed by the evil Alduin! You don't have to do this! I can he-"

Dragon: "AARHHHHHGGGH" *Roasts Dovahkiin*

» Sun May 29, 2011 2:17 am

You can force on into your service with the Thu'um of its name, but the way the descriptions of that have been in GI that doesn't sound like he enjoys it. Although who knows? It may be possible, I suppose we'll have to wait. Perhaps they'll be like the Daedra seen in Battlespire, where lower ones don't have the will to not simply obey their master's command to kill, but higher ones can think and scheme for themselves?

» Sat May 28, 2011 9:45 am

I think most of the people posting in this thread no NOTHING of TES lore and dragons.

In TES lore dragons are VERY intelligent beings who are capable of communicating with humans. In the past dragons and humans have helped each other.

Darogns in Skyrim should not all be "Evilllll!!!1" They should be treated as the intelligent beings they are, capable of good and bad

I am hoping that we wil meet a few who are not evil, and later on with the story end up helping our character, it would add depth to the cliche "Dragons are eviilll!!1, kill em all!" that most fantasy games do, and it's fitting with the lore rather then writing it off.

» Sat May 28, 2011 6:33 pm

no