Nirn is finite, Oblivion is infinite with endless possibilities, So why Does Mehrunes Dagon want Nirn?

it was his, they took it, and now he wants it back

if you listened to what caroman was saying you would know that Nirn is just another plane of Oblivion

He is the god of destruction. Oblivion is endless and static, and Aetherius is endless and nothing but constant change. Nirn, the mortal realm, is the only place where destruction really has any definition.

I thought it was Oblivion that was changing and Aetherius that was static, since the Daedra represent change and the Aedra represent stasis...

Edit: And to Swarley Swazenoskie, welcome to the Forums. Have a http://www.uesp.net/w/images/images.new/c/c4/Fishystick.jpg!

He doesn't want Nirn, he wants to COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY DESTROY ALL OF MUNDUS!!!!

Caps for emphasis. You can read about it http://imperial-library.info/content/fight-one-eating-birth-dagon. For background, Greedy Man is Shor, Leaper Demon King is what MD used to be, and Alduin is the nord version of Akatosh

Of course even Dagon knows that if you destroy everything there will be nothing left to destroy.

Yeah, acording to Mankar, but I've read that this might not be true. and like I said it's finite, Oblivion isn't.



Hm, me to.



Oh right. But when hes destroyed it then what?

Also If Oblivion contains endless of posibilities, and is ever changing, shouldn't he be able to destroy it over and over?

According to the Mysterium Xarxes, Tamriel belonged to Lorkhan. Dagon has a legitimate claim, as Royalty and on account of his unique history with Mundus. Mankar used Dagon, though. Dagon was not the Master, in that relationship.

Don't merely think of Dagon as Destruction, though that works, but also think of him as Revolution.

In the end, he may be back to being the kind Leaper Demon King, but there will be no one to be kind and kingly too.

thanks for the welcome, even though I have been here at least 2 weeks, you were the first to welcome me

oh and Oblivion is infinite, but Nirn is just one realm of Oblivion, so it is part of the infinite, even though it is finite

Bear in mind that everyone in the Elder Scrolls universe has their own opinions...and not necessarily correct ones. Don't just accept what Manker Cameron says, especially when every other source contradicts him (and remember he's crazy )

The Deadlands is Dagon's realm, not Mundus. Mundus isn't even a realm of Oblivion, is it? Either way, if Mundus was to have a "prince" it would be Lorkhan.

Many of you are repeatedly saying that it was nirn that he wanted, nirn, nirn and nirn againt

I will quote it directly, Mancor Camoran made no comment about Nirn, only tamriel
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Mankar_Camoran

Tamriel is just one more Daedric realm of Oblivion, long since lost to its Prince when he was betrayed by those that served him. Lord Dagon cannot invade Tamriel, his birthright! He comes to liberate the Occupied Lands!
the Coldharbour of Meridia, Peryite's Quagmire, the ten Moonshadows of Mephala, and... and Dawn's Beauty, the Princedom of Lorkhan... misnamed 'Tamriel' by deluded mortals.

By him not acknowledging Nirn or "Mundus" as they are used as one in the same. It is very probably that he is unaware of that particualy technicalities. So by that sense, I render that statement pointless.
For example, if someone tells you that he is going to take over Akavir, and by that he would be ruler of the entire realm. Why would you consider the statement valid? Although Tamriel is the largest continent it is only a part of the planet.

Dagon just wants to make a revolution and change stuff (and destroy some stuff)! And he suceeded! In many ways!

1. The Mythic Dawn starts a revolution, and "fails".

2. The whole of Tamriel is changed COMPLETELY after the end of the Septims.

3. Kvatch is destroyed!

So he did what he wanted!

When I was but a lad, my great-granddaddy (honest-ish Nibenese he spoke, dead langauge now, 'membered only by ghosts of the past such as I) told me a story of a naughty demon who would leap places Aka' said he couldn't. He leap'd so many times he tore a big [censored] hole in the sky (and he made sweet love to that gaping hole, making children uncountable, some of them naughty like he, like that young girl of his, Meri-something-or-Raga-Dia), so big that the even bigger dragon (he's bigger than big, he's like huge) actually noticed that damn hole, so he asked the demon "Why you leaping so hard little devil?"

The Devil replied "Piss off!", so Aka' sequezed that demon hard between his tail (making him six feet shorter), "Okay! Okay! I leap because I visioned true end, destruction, destruction of everything! Horrible! I must escape!".

So anyway, Aka' then punched that Devil so hard he sent him to hell, and made him a grand 'ole prince, even though some say that some missing man or greedy god tricked that demon blind (as he does in all stories, that wiley & slippery fish).

That's granddaddy's story (of a story of myth of legend) as I 'member it anyhow.



...Oh, the point of the story is that the Devil-who-is-Magnus-who-is-Akatosh-hu-is-Dagon isn't who he used t'be (you get like that after being so many other people), and instead of run'n he is now fighting (well Aka' did corner him), which he is doing so he can stop playing Akatosh and be true freedom again (because a 'red' freedom is just revolution) and run away. Ofcourse the only reason why he's Aka' is because he saw himself as Destruction, which caused him to see the BIG God, which meant... [NUMMIT]

Took the words right out of my mouth. Revolution and Change are the parts of Destruction that create room for growth of new things... in order to Destroy those things.

How's this, though for a new perspective on why he seems to hate the Empire so much: When Tiber Septim became Talos, he was a stand-in for Lorkhan and that whole interplay with Alduin/Aka and such. Because he was the God-Hero of the Empire, he aligned the Empire into that interplay, thusly creating an opponent out of MD as he was the enemy of Alduin. After all, Dagon didn't kill the Second Empire. That was Mephala/Sanguine. There was something in the Third Empire that provoked Dagon to actively become its Enemy.

Of course, there is still the whole idea of the fact that the Empire was in its waning years for 4-5 games and there must be an event that officially ends it. I suppose one is a mannish perspective while the other is an Elven.

Why did Hitler want the world?

To get to the other side.


Took you long enough, old goat. We're looking at the same guy from different angles.

this is confusing me :huh:

It's poorly worded. Based on older models of the RL universe, the universe is infinite.You go from point A in a direction and you would never hit the edge of the universe (this is still true, but for different reasons). Within that infinite universe is a finite earth. A speck in a sea of nothing.

Mundus=/=Oblivion

And the Dead Lands should've depicted things like volcanoes, tornadoes, etc. And it is Dagon's birthright (Magnus).

People say these things are hard to depict in a game. I don't get it. What's so hard about adding in a volcano, even just as a skybox, to the game world? If you have any knowledge of the CS, you'll know how simple it actually is.

Tad off topic...

You see, my whole schtick with Magnus leaving but a part of him wants to come back and reclaim it is somewhat discordant with how the whole Magnus/Meridia relationship plays out. Because despite the whole unified wheel model, Oblivion and Mundus are a lot more related with each other than Mundus and Aetherius. So Magnus wanted to distance himself as much as he could from this trick and failure and so left to Aetherius, scorning Mundus. At some point afterwards, Meridia was booted away from Magnus for "consorting with illicit spectra" whatever that means and makes herself a home in Oblivion, closer to Mundus. Magnus wouldn't allow Meridia, his outcaste, to align herself closer to something he eventually wanted to retake...well, unless she were forcibly Selected out of Magnus somehow, but I think that's highly unlikely.

Additionally, it's not like Mehrunes Dagon and Meridia are very aligned spiritually. Battlespire is proof that he is willing to at least passively allow undead to further his causes through his followers. Not to mention that Meridia is the Daedra Lord of the life energies of the world whereas Mehrunes is the Lord of Change and Change is volatile to life energies even if it usually takes energy to change something.

For the record, I can handle the whole Mehrunes/Magnus duality. It's a little weird, but I can take it. I guess all I'm saying is that the Aldudagga has been distorted by myth and tradition and so we shouldn't jump to the conclusion that Mehrunes is(was) completely the Leaper Demon.

It's possible the Sigil Towers were simply located in areas that weren't prone to erupting and destroying any structures (like Sigil Towers) in their vicinity.

I am probably completely just using my own interpretation here. But I thought Nirn was Lorkhan's realm and that Dagon sought to break the barriers down to somehow bring about his return or implement his will upon Nirn.
As the dead god is one of the links in TES 3 and 4, so I kind off see the elder scroll games as some form of contingancy plan to bring him back again, and only the players actions have a way of altering this fate in any meaningful maner.
Again thats how I sort of see it, not what is true.