It's a combination of things, but something had to happen in game for me to realize how much I hate them.

So I reluctantly join the RR after walking the first time Dez gave me the ultimatum of "free synths, no questions asked, or leave". But dat Ballistic Weave...

Didn't help that Deacon was all like, "Please brah, join us. You're a badass, we need you!" So I acquiesce and chaperon him on his little trip to the Switchboard. Mind this is after meeting my disappointment of a son, Shaun/Father/Director, who's responsible for murder, kidnapping, fraud, and unethical scientific experimentation on an astronomical scale.

When I get back Dez tells me to pick a code name, I'm like whatever, and she calls me the Wanderer. Alright, cool.

Then she says "we know" and right then and there asks me to betray the same Brotherhood that's had my back for the whole game for the sake of sophisticated vibrators/flesh lights. I'm thinking to myself "Yeah, she's crazy. I'll ignore her and see what else I can do".

Carrington then sends me to a dead drop in the middle of a Super Mutant Master stomping ground. As I'm getting my ass handed to me in the name of Freedom for Fisto the sixbot a vertibird flies overhead in all it's minigun glory. "I've got your back Brother" is what I hear as two Paladins drop from the vertibird and turns the colony of Super Mutants to ash.

That right there was all I needed to see. Why should I carry a pack of whiners on my back for the sake of their well-intentioned misguided emotional stupidity when I can be helping the Brotherhood protect the Commonwealth from real threats.

"Real Threats" like farmers who don't want to fork over their livelihood for nothing, or ghouls who are rather fond of living, or people with technology they rely on that the Bros like to confiscate?

The Brotherhood are just regressive dogmatic raiders with power armor.

You can keep the BoS and Railroad if you finish with the Minutemen and they stop trying to kill each other, I just found the BoS unforgivable so I killed them

If they could overcome some of their bigotry toward nice Supermutants and non-feral ghouls (and maybe Synths) and ease up on the idea that only ~they~ know how to use technology properly, The Brotherhood would be a great group, if a bit more militaristic than I generally like.

Where the Railroad went too far, for me, was their willingness to kill folk at the Institute to free Synths. I don't mind sneaking Synths out and resettling them, but they go too far.

And where the Institute goes too far is in thinking that they ~have~ to wipe out the Brotherhood and the Railroad, pretty much as a means of self-defense. With the Relay they are pretty much immune to attack unless they venture to the surface for some reason.

I'm looking forward to a mod that scripts some damned sense into some of these factions.

If the Brotherhood were still following Lyons' ideals, I'd be all about supporting them. But yeah, they're becoming the Enclave 2.0 at this point.

A Minutemen/Railroad combination is the best for me and what I feel is best for the Commonwealth. Freedom and protection for all who are willing to live peacefully within.

it all makes sense, the BoS thinks that Synths are technology that has gone too far by making them sentient beings, the railroad wants to free them and the only way to make sure that the institute stops coming after escaped Synths is to destroy their base although you can use an evacuation order to get everyone out who does not want to fight and honestly they can barely help all the Synths already escaping and a giant machine making more of them is not helping. The institute has tried to negotiate as your son said with the Railroad but it failed because the institute does not consider Synths as our equals but as their property and the institute wants to get back its lost robots and stop the BoS from blowing them up.

Haha.. good stuff. Yeah, Des is a big bag of crazy. I liked what Virgil had to say about them. That made me chuckle.

I get tired of this crap being brought up for why the Brotherhood is the evulz. The Brotherhood never orders you to steal! You are ordered to acquire supplies and are given a wide latitude for how you want accomplish that objective. If there is any stealing involved it is because you, the SS, the player, chose to steal in the name of the Brotherhood. Sure, they accept this method because you accomplished your goals, but that does not mean it is their preferred method. This whole "I chose to steal so the Brotherhood is evil" crap needs to stop.


As for ghouls, it's funny. That's a word I have very rarely heard the Brotherhood use. I certainly don't think I've heard them use it in connection with their current campaign. Unless there is a single mission I've not gotten yet, I've never been asked to kill ghouls. It's always been ferals. The Brotherhood is there to wipe out the ferals, which I think is justified. Ferals are little more than mindless monsters that kill whatever they come across with no hope of being anything more. A ghoul tried for 200 years with his feral family members with no results.


As for super mutants, since it comes up a lot, they are again justified. There are currently three sources of super mutants right now, one on the west coast and two on the east coast. Ignoring the west coast super mutants, since they have no bearing on the east coast Brotherhood, I can probably count the number of friendly or non-hostile super mutants I have met on one hand. The VAST majority of them are hellbent on raiding, killing and, oh yeah, EATING humans. Waging a campaign against them is a matter of survival and self-defense.

If you investigate the food being stolen from the Brotherhood warehouse, you find an NPC who explains that he/she had a friend who was turned into a ghoul (if memory serves) and he was ordered to kill his friend, even though he was not yet feral. I think. I only dimly remember the mission, except at the end you can persuade him to turn himself in, and if you TELL him that you are going to kill all the feral ghouls he can be persuaded to not interfere (if you just attack them, he turns hostile). So at least one Brotherhood guy relates a story where non-feral ghouls are discriminated against by the Brotherhood. Of course he takes it a bit far, thinking he can "tame" the ferals, or something....

As for the Supermutants, Strong is ~relatively~ friendly and not a rampaging monster... and Virgil is smart and likeable. But the main argument against generalized hatred toward supermutants is that they can be ~cured~. Not all of them, and not immediately, but the fact that there ~is~ a cure means there -can- be a cure for more of them in the future. Not sure how a human that was converted to Supermutant and then cured could live with him/herself if he/she did the normal things Supermutants DO, though.

Lol way to make [censored] up. He had a friend in DC that was a ghoul.


He got flashbacks of his friend when he was ordered to exterminate the - feral - ghouls inhabiting Logan International.


Get your facts checked.

Bravo and well said! I agree.


That's why I sided with them the first time I played the MQ. I just didn't like the fact that I was forced to murder an entire faction (the RR) that had shown me no ill will and had in fact welcomed me in. Do I believe in the RR cause? Only partially and once the Institute is destroyed the RR has no more reason to exist if you assume they have helped all the synths they know about to escape to their freedom. No more Institute, no more synths to liberate so they can blend back into society or take up another cause. Doing so no longer makes them even a remote threat to the BOS.


For my current run, I'm going to go the method that leaves all 3 of those factions peaceful with one another. I'm just trying to justify how a ragtag group of settlers/farmers could ever muster the skills and firepower to take out the formidable Institute. The BOS is not hard to believe is capable of doing so because flying blimp, vertibirds and Power Armor.


So I'm building my network of settlements and setting human guards at the big ones to at least pretend some of them are gaining experience, lol. I'm at level 25 and haven't taken The Castle yet because I don't feel my troops are ready.


Anyway, sorry for hijacking the thread, lol.

Letting a bunch of savage man-eating hulks infest the commonwealth just in the faint hope that some scientist in a cave located in the worst place ever manages to create an universal cure for FEV is just dangerous,suicidal hippie-talk.

I'd have to see the exact details of that quest before I could comment on it.


Regarding the super mutants, you've named a grand total of TWO in the entire Commonwealth. Virgil is also a very special case. He is not a normal super mutant. As for curing them, prior to Virgil, there was no chance of curing them. Even after the chances are still slim. I seem to recall Virgil's cure being tailored to his specific strain and his specific DNA, making it useless to anyone else. Also, isn't the longer someone is a super mutant, the less likely they could be cured at all? Regardless of the possibility of a cure, they are still raiding, killing and eating people. Self-defense is justified

Bigots in Power Armor and that's putting it mildly. They stand against everything I hold dear in real life and I can't imagine roleplaying their side.

In the Fallout universe being a Luddite actually makes sense. Technology destroying the world isn't abstract theory. It actually happened. Given this reality, I don't apply the same ethical standards to the Fallout universe I do to RL. In RL, I wouldn't align with the Brotherhood, but in RL, no circumstances have ever been present to allow something like the Brotherhood to emerge in the first place. In Fallout, their ideology makes complete sense to me. It just needs periodic softening around the edges to account for the nuance of specific circumstances (Danse, Virgil being cured) and lo an behold such nuance can exist if you actually care to fight for it.

Someone on the Internet I can unequivocally agree with! It must be the holidays.

Truth-in-a-can.

While not everything the Railroad does make a lot of sense, I still love their base out of all the factions because everything is tightly compacted into one room. Quest givers, doctor, vendor, even workbenches.

While that is nice I hate going to it. There's no direct access to it without fast traveling.

I thought I was pretty clear when I used qualifiers that I was not reciting quest contents directly.

In any event, I don't object to the Brotherhood taking out supermutants and feral ghouls as a means of self-preservation, but that's not (only) why they do it. They also just plain viscerally hate them, regardless of whether they have done anything or not. They just strike me as a hate-fueled group. The Railroad and Institute, to varying degrees, seem more rational and reasonable.

Both Supermutants and Feral ghouls deserve to be hated. There is not a single reason not to hate them. I don't know how much Danse represent the BoS, but he's actually very friendly toward regular ghouls, except for Hancock, he hates it if you kill innocent ghouls such as lying to sparing Trish or kill her, help a kid finding his ghoul parents knowing it's tactically disadvantage, against the Covenant experimenting and torturing synths.

The Institute live in a cave. It's a very nice, well-appointed cave, but at the end of the day, if they need any form of supplies other than rocks, they have to go to the surface.

And, demonstrably, even with the massive advantage of the Relay, they are not immune to being wiped out by either the Brotherhood or the Railroad.

Yes, you are BOS material through and through, champ.

So let me see if I understand you correctly. The Brotherhood arrived in the Capitol Wasteland some 30 years ago? They found armies of super mutants not only raiding, murdering and eating humans, but also kidnapping people to turn them into more super mutants. What followed was a 20+ year war against the super mutants to protect the people. They then come to the Commonwealth to find the super mutants doing the exact same thing, minus the kidnapping. You've manage to name two in the Commonwealth that are not trying to kill and eat everyone and there weren't many more in the Capitol Wasteland. And you want the Brotherhood to... give them the benefit of the doubt?


Same thing with ferals. Ferals are ghouls whose brains have rotted away until they are mindless monsters. In their mindlessness they try to attack, kill and most likely eat anything they come across. When in sufficient number, they have been known to wipe out entire populations. They cannot be taught to be anything more than mindless monsters. However, you want the Brotherhood to... give them the benefit of the doubt?

I'm against the Brotherhood not because they're taking crops but the fact they're a bunch of Neo-Feudalists who worship Humanity in a Posthuman world.

Yeah, they're going to order you to take crops eventually because, eventually the BOS is going to rule the Commonwealth and that will be called taxes soon.

But by then they'll have already eliminated other threats.